# Jan. 21, 2009 .Do you advise former president Bush to limit his foreign travel? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 12, 2006, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018 "2006-03-12T04:43:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/41 "2006-03-12T08:18:17Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > I see it’s another thread for you and your lackeys to have a reason to pound away at a keyboard, but this is silly even for you. “Lackeys” ? So he’s a supervillain now ? Do his lackeys get to wear capes, or is that reserved for the guy in charge ? ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/42 "2006-03-12T08:27:42Z")
Looks like I ended that _New York Times_ quotation too early. Here’s the last sentence of the paragraph: > [@](#): > > [George W. Bush] also traveled to Europe several times in the 90’s with the Young Presidents’ Organization, a group for corporate executives. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/43 "2006-03-12T09:20:27Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > The only problem with this thread is that you’re the main respondant to it. Seriously, count your replies against anyone else’s. Duffer, allow me to introduce alaric. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/44 "2006-03-12T13:08:38Z")
I tell him to go to Crawford and park it right there. Travelling costs the taxpayers money, he’s certainly burned up enough of our cash as it is. Put razor tape around the ranch and pay a rent-a-cop to guard the gate. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/45 "2006-03-12T14:18:53Z")
> [@Der Trihs](#): > > “Lackeys” ? So he’s a supervillain now ? > > Do his lackeys get to wear capes, or is that reserved for the guy in charge ? No capes. Remember The Incedibles; bad things happen to those who wear capes. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/46 "2006-03-12T17:44:11Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#): > > let’s game this out. presumable his secret service detail would attempt to protect their charge, but they will be, after all, outnumbered outgunned, and out of luck. > > So now he’s in custody. > > You, President Mace, do what? Well there’s always the Hague Invasion Act. Diplomatic pressure could be applied to the arresting country, sanctions could be threatened, etc. But it’s unlikely that either the UN or another country would care. Military action is unlikely, especially if he’s succeded by a Democrat. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/47 "2006-03-12T18:02:09Z")
I should note that before Delta Force is launched, there is likely to be political and financial pressure applied. “All your assets in US reach are now confiscated. Shut your embassies and go home.” and so on. However, this is not the sort of thing the US could take lying down, and, in fact, could start a third world war, just like shooting a small grand duke might. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/48 "2006-03-12T18:32:46Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > I should note that before Delta Force is launched, there is likely to be political and financial pressure applied. “All your assets in US reach are now confiscated. Shut your embassies and go home.” and so on. However, this is not the sort of thing the US could take lying down, and, in fact, could start a third world war, just like shooting a small grand duke might. He was an archduke, not a grand duke. It’s unlikely in the extreme that US will go to war over the detention of a single citizen. A special forces op is a possiblity, but world war? Never. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/49 "2006-03-12T20:07:44Z")
It might start that way, however. This would be a very strong slap in the face of the US, diplomatically. And remember, it wouldn’t just be George at risk. If they take him, they declare they could take anyone. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/50 "2006-03-12T20:36:13Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > It might start that way, however. This would be a very strong slap in the face of the US, diplomatically. And remember, it wouldn’t just be George at risk. If they take him, they declare they could take anyone. only those who, unlike Kissinger, travel to unfriendly juriosdictions. Plus, not “everyone” is c in c , as g-dub is fond of saying,. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/51 "2006-03-12T20:39:11Z")
> [@Walloon](#): > > _The New York Times_, January 14, 2001: well, shut my mouth… ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/52 "2006-03-12T20:46:15Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > OK. This thread had the potential to be a moderately interesting discussion on the topic of arresting former U.S. presidents for international crimes. However, with only 35 replies, the OP, himself has submitted the following hijacks: > > - a speculation regarding what sort of activities the formar president might enjoy (delivered as an insulting rif on purported behavior in GWB’s youth); > - a second allusion to purported youthful mischief; > - a complaint that no poster has challenged one particular claim in the OP; > - a claim that he is, himself, a lunatic; > - an aside recommending a defense counsel that is irrelevant to the discussion; > - four posts criticizing President Bush for his apparent lack of a passport (none of which provide factual evidence for the claim); > - and a query as to whether one question was the “only” objection to the OP. > > I’m going to send this over to the **BBQ Pit** where raving hijacks are more to be expected. > > [/Moderating] without deconstructing the prissy thrust of your post, please be informed that as far as am concerned, G-dub had his best moment on top of that bar, and for clarity, since you are prone to brain seizures, I mean that sincerely. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/53 "2006-03-12T20:48:00Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#): > > well, shut my mouth… Yes, please. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/54 "2006-03-12T20:51:17Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > The only problem with this thread is that you’re the main respondant to it. Seriously, count your replies against anyone else’s. > > You’ve come up with the unique stance that Bush is bad, and took over the debate. What is your point? What are you adding to the world debate? I see it’s another thread for you and your lackeys to have a reason to pound away at a keyboard, but this is silly even for you. " lackeys" Oh precious blood of sweet baby Jesus, at last!!! (are any of these lackeys cute girls, cause if so, why are we wasting time on this dumb board?..) ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/55 "2006-03-12T20:55:47Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Yes, please. > > Regards, > Shodan it’s just an expression…don’t get your hopes up too high… ---
**Author:** ![Tabula\_Rasa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@Tabula\_Rasa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tabula_Rasa)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/56 "2006-03-12T20:58:54Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#): > > You think President Dean is declaring war on anyone to haul G-dub’s scrawny ass out of a jam. > > To paraphrase another commentator, “it’s hard out here for a Pimp…” If Bush’s captors had to go through his Secret Service detail to get to Bush, and President Dean is surrounded by his own detail of the late agents’ brothers in arms, armed, there might be a certain impetus to action. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/57 "2006-03-12T21:03:40Z")
> [@Tabula Rasa](#): > > If Bush’s captors had to go through his Secret Service detail to get to Bush, and President Dean is surrounded by his own detail of the late agents’ brothers in arms, armed, there might be a certain impetus to action. considering that the hypothetical interaction between local gendarmes and the secret service would be accompanied by the service of a valid arrest warrent, I really don’t anticipate gunplay, or even the need for overt force, to take g-dub into custody. Moreover, I don’t think the seizure would be done sub rosa, (unlike OUR snatches in Italy, eg) but would be the subject of a warning prior to g-dub’s even leaving the US In other word, an indictment would be handed down and be waiting, should he venture out–much the way Kissinger is on notice to avoid certain jurisdictions–notice that he has taken to heart, avoiding the unpleasantness of an armed confrontation. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/58 "2006-03-12T21:10:21Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > If they take him, they declare they could take anyone. BTW, they pretty much have declared that, from jump. That’s the whole idea of universal jurisdiction (your crime, your victims, and your nationality need not be local–only your person when arrested) ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/59 "2006-03-12T22:23:15Z")
Well, first of all, it just confirms my impression of the righties that they aren’t even slightly perturbed at the fact that this President is the first one, I’ll have to say in modern times, at least, since I haven’t bothered to research the idea that prior ones in the more misty mists of time might have come up under this heading, that would even _conceivably_ be subject to international jurisdiction for crimes of the sort we’re talking about here. This is not something to be proud of. BTW, as for his lackeys, like Rice, Gonzales (especially), John Yoo (doubly so), Cheney, and Rumsfeld, not to mention the despicable General Miller, well, they would be very well advised to take the Kissinger route. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018/60 "2006-03-12T22:39:06Z")
> [@pantom](#): > > Well, first of all, it just confirms my impression of the righties that they aren’t even slightly perturbed at the fact that this President is the first one, I’ll have to say in modern times, at least, since I haven’t bothered to research the idea that prior ones in the more misty mists of time might have come up under this heading, that would even _conceivably_ be subject to international jurisdiction for crimes of the sort we’re talking about here. > This is not something to be proud of. Why would anyone be perturbed that same rabidly anti-Bush poster on an internet message board makes the unsupported claim that Bush could be arrested in Europe? Since it’s an entirely fanciful proposition, it invites only derision. Would it confirm your impression of lefties if one of the righties on this board opened a thread that Kerry could be arrested in Europe for war crimes committed during Vietnam? Didn’t he, afterall, pretty much admit that he committed such crimes? Should any of those lefties be perturbed? Of course not. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-21-2009-do-you-advise-former-president-bush-to-limit-his-foreign-travel/348018.md?page=4)