# Jan 6- Insurgency? Coup? Unarmed Riot? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [December 5, 2024, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206 "2024-12-05T16:25:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/1 "2024-12-05T16:25:59Z")
Continuing the discussion from [Ohio's anti-trans brigade continues](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ohios-anti-trans-brigade-continues/1010861/103) > [@Magiver](#): > > No, it’s not obvious at all. An unarmed protest that broke a couple of windows of the seat of power in the US for lack of any real security effort. From roughly that post onward, the thread is hijacked by discussion of the January 6 “unarmed riot”. I publicly acknowledged that I had been part of the hijack (sorry) and asked the mods both in that post and by PM to spin the Jan 6 posts into their own thread. They declined to do so- Please Note I am not protesting their decision (that should be done in ATMB). I do not want to discuss their decision in this thread. It just would have been easier to read and quote the relevant posts if they had. Anyhow, I and others maintain that Jan 6 was an attempt by an armed group to enter by force the seat of the legislative branch and overturn the results of a legitimate Presidential election. Further, Trump sat back and let it happen rather than do anything to stop it. **Magiver** says it was an “unarmed riot” that did little damage and should not be considered anything more than that. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/2 "2024-12-05T16:36:47Z")
It was an attempted coup. There were weapons and violence. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/3 "2024-12-05T16:37:51Z")
It was an insurrection. Organized. Violent. Against the government. That’s the definition of an insurrection. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/4 "2024-12-05T16:51:17Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > **Magiver** says it was an “unarmed riot” that did little damage and should not be considered anything more than that. OOPS! In the post I quoted above, he said “unarmed protest” not “unarmed riot”. I admit my mistake and aplogize for any confusion this may have caused. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/5 "2024-12-05T16:53:54Z")
A “protest” is designed to _protest_ something. The mob on January 6th was not _protesting_ the election of Biden, they were trying to prevent him from taking office. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/6 "2024-12-05T17:00:53Z")
They were protesting reality. As they continue to do. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/7 "2024-12-05T17:02:43Z")
First off, a mob doesn’t need weapons, a mob _is_ a weapon. Secondly, J6 has to be viewed as merely a single tile of a much larger mosaic. There was the “fake elector” scheme, there was the pressure on state legislatures to disregard the will of the voters, there was the “find me the votes” call. This all has to be remembered and taken into account. Look, I know that many of the J6 participants were basically normie poop-smearing podium-stealing doofi. But they were used as instruments and cover. There were folks in that crown that had darker purposes. The zip-tie guy, the woman who stole Nancy Pelosi’s laptop. The people who built the gallows. The person or persons, still unidentified, who planted the pipebombs. I think that Attempted Coup or the crime for which some were convicted “seditious conspiracy” covers it pretty well. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/8 "2024-12-05T17:56:52Z")
Know why there weren’t _more_ guns at the Capitol that day? > _“I don’t [expletive omitted] care that they have weapons,” Trump fumed in urging aides to take down magnetometers near the White House before he addressed a “Stop the Steal” rally, Hutchinson testified. “They’re not here to hurt me. Take the [expletive omitted] mags away.”"_ But the Secret Service – you know: the ones whose text messages from on and around Jan6 were unintentionally all deleted – knew better than to listen to their Protectee. Guns were all around that day. January 6th at the Capitol – the part we all witnessed, live, with utter dismay and rapt attention – was the low-rent, grunts, “boots on the ground” piece of the attempted coup. The “alternate slate of electors” and “rigged voting machine” schemes were the “White Men In Suits” piece that was playing out behind the scenes, in the shadows, and across the nation. To understand this coup attempt, you have to understand both AND how they fit together. I’d love to see conservative media consumers take a quiz on the “alternate slate of electors” scheme. My strong sense is that – as usual – they know virtually nothing. But that’s a daily, conscious choice they make. I wish they’d make a different choice. It’s what Trump supporters don’t know that allows them to BE Trump supporters. Cult. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2024, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/9 "2024-12-05T18:15:24Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > you know: the ones whose text messages from on and around Jan6 were unintentionally all deleted Yeah, whoopsie! What are the chances? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/10 "2024-12-06T05:54:44Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > A “protest” is designed to _protest_ something. The mob on January 6th was not _protesting_ the election of Biden, they were trying to prevent him from taking office. There is no scenario where this could happen. And protests are protests until they become riots. This occurred at the building that represents one of the 3 branches of government. It should have been immediately shut down. The governing body over the Capital building let this happen. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/11 "2024-12-06T10:19:34Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > There is no scenario where this could happen. The rioters thought so, as did many of the people advising Trump in preparation for the events of the day. > [@Magiver](#): > > The governing body over the Capital building let this happen. This remains untrue. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/12 "2024-12-06T12:48:07Z")
I responded to that point twice in the old thread- > [@Ohio's anti-trans brigade continues](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ohios-anti-trans-brigade-continues/1010861/141): > > It was an attempt by an armed group to enter the seat of the legislative branch by force and overturn the results of a legitimate Presidential election. That it failed is not relevant. That is was destined to fail is not relevant. OTTOMH Earlier this year, the FBI announced the arrest of a would be terrorist. He had become radicalized and sought out infrormation on how to make an improvised explosive device and where to buy chemicals to make explosives on the internet. He thought he had found … and again > [@Ohio's anti-trans brigade continues](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ohios-anti-trans-brigade-continues/1010861/143): > > Two Things I have sent a message to the mods requesting this discussion of Jan 6 be spun off into its own thread. And One of the recent assasination attempts on Trump was as follows- Reasoning, correctly IMO, that he coud not make it past the security checkpoints and metal detectors with a gun, a man came up with a plan to kill Trump. He would enter without a weapon. Then, he would take a pistol from one of the armed security personell. Once he had the pistol, he would shoot and kill Trump. … ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/13 "2024-12-06T13:35:13Z")
Has that orange biomass ever explained what he was doing for those 3+ hours in the WH dining room? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/14 "2024-12-06T13:44:04Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > > [@Magiver](#): > > > > The governing body over the Capital building let this happen. > > This remains untrue. After a bank is robbed, there’s generally a pretty thorough end-to-end review of people, process, security, and systems in order to figure out what happened and how best to prevent it again. Smart. Reasonable. Proper. Wise. The MAGAs and MAGA-enablers are still blaming the bank for _being_ robbed in the first place. Cult. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2024, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/15 "2024-12-06T14:29:56Z")
The mere fact the bank lacked adequate resources and advance planning to prevent the robbbery is _proof_ it was all their fault. IOW, “They let it happen.” [/sarcasm] F\*\*\*ing morons buying the big lie the one the hard Right is selling all day every day. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2024, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/16 "2024-12-08T18:23:50Z")
@Magiver also says the people were a bunch of children let run loose and that it’s all Nancy Pelosi’s fault. He says it was let run it’s course and petered out. He says all the Congress members were perfectly safe. He asked why the security guard that shot one person (Ashley Babbitt) stopped and didn’t shoot more. He doesn’t differentiate that there were multiple categories of participants. Some were just following the crowd. Some were spun up by Trump and wanted to march into Congress to be heard. Some were ruled up by mob mentality. And some had actual precoordinated plans to get ahold of government officials and hold some sort of mock trial and summary execution. Magiver is disconnected from reality. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2024, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/17 "2024-12-09T05:07:14Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > This remains untrue. Nonsense. There’s no reason not to use teargas on the crowd. My city uses to flush people out of houses if need be. This is far more important than someone resisting arrest. I would put the Capital Building very high on the list of assets to protect. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2024, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/18 "2024-12-09T05:13:15Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > And some had actual precoordinated plans to get ahold of government officials and hold some sort of mock trial and summary execution. Again, that is nonsense. There were officers in the building that could have shut it down with the use of force if somebody gave them the go-ahead. There is just no way the crowd could have taken over the government. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2024, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/19 "2024-12-09T05:17:53Z")
Clearly an attempted coup. The mob was only part of it intending to pressure Pence to accept the fake electors. Anyone denying that is either delusional or deliberately lying. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2024, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206/20 "2024-12-09T06:14:56Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Again, that is nonsense. There were officers in the building that could have shut it down with the use of force if somebody gave them the go-ahead. There is just no way the crowd could have taken over the government. Firstly, I didn’t say their plans could actually work. I said they had plans. They built a friggen gallows. They had zipcuffs and were coordinated and working in teams. Whether or not they had an actual chance of succeeding with the version of the plan they used is irrelevant. They thought they could change the outcome of the election, and possibly send a “sign” to all the government officials to shape up or they were next. Secondly, what officers in the building were sitting around waiting for a go ahead to end the riot/invasion/obstruction of government operations? Who were these officers, and why weren’t they given the go ahead? > [@Magiver](#): > > Nonsense. There’s no reason not to use teargas on the crowd. Did they have tear gas? Gas masks? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jan-6-insurgency-coup-unarmed-riot/1011206.md?page=2)