# Japanese and Koreans **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 15, 2003, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938 "2003-06-15T01:27:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![captainQwark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e68b1a/32.png) [@captainQwark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/captainQwark)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/1 "2003-06-15T01:27:16Z")
according to a video on racism I watched in a history class, the Japanese have had a deep hate for Koreans. Fortunately, this hate has been declining. Does anybody here know why the Japanese have hated the koreans? ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/2 "2003-06-15T01:39:44Z")
Didn’t the video give any reasons? I wasn’t aware of a hatred between the Japanese and Koreans, but maybe the fact that the Korean war is still relatively recent has something to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![captainQwark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e68b1a/32.png) [@captainQwark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/captainQwark)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/3 "2003-06-15T01:41:26Z")
the video may have told the reason, but I don’t remember it. ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/4 "2003-06-15T01:56:16Z")
Japan pursued an aggressive colonization effort in Korea at the beginning of the 20th century. Japan was, for all intents and purposes, an occupying force in Korea. There are many bitter memories of their tactics during this time. Koreans had to change their names and were forbidden to speak anything but Japanese. One of the biggest issues has to do with the conscription of young Korean women into official prostitution for the imperial army. Surviving Korean “comfort women” protest against Japan to this day. The mutual hatred seems to be lessening as the Japanese and Koreans who directly experienced this period in history are passing on. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/5 "2003-06-15T02:10:46Z")
I don’t know about hatred, but looking down on Koreans (and Chinese) is still not uncommon. Granted, there was Tokyo Governor Ishihara’s speech at a military base a few years ago, in which he accused the “sankokujin” (a derogatory term for the people of the countries Japan colonized before WWII, roughly equivalent to “niggers”, although he later tried to soften the blow by saying he was referring to all foreigners) of being crminals who would start riots in the event of a major earthquake, and urged the soldiers to step in and “show people what the military is for.” ---
**Author:** ![MrO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/50afbb/32.png) [@MrO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrO)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/6 "2003-06-15T02:12:32Z")
When I lived in Japan, I wasn’t aware of hatred toward Koreans. In Korea, I often hear of hatred for the Japanese, but it is fading among young people. Since what I’ve noticed is the reverse of what you ask about, it may be irrelevant, but the anti-Japanese feelings among Koreans are based on the 35 years that Japan occupied Korea, from 1910 to the end of WWII. During the occupation, the Korean language and Korean names were suppressed. Even now, Japanese history books are said to distort the truth of what happened. [Here](http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/east/04/14/skorea.burn.japan/) is a link to an old article about the textbooks. One of the biggest issues was the Japanese use of “comfort women” during the war. Women from several countries, including thousands from Korea, were forced into prostitution for Japanese troops. Most of them are dead now, but there is still an enormous amount of bitterness toward the Japanese about that. (On preview, I see that **Amanita** covered all this, but I’ll post it anyway because of the link.) ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/7 "2003-06-15T03:59:55Z")
The funny, ironic thing is that the ancient Jomon culture, the ancestors of the Japanese, must have immigrated from Korea. So the Japanese are descended from two peoples they supposedly despise: the Ainu and the Koreans. (There are studies suggesting that the Samurai families are descended from the Ainu.) What’s the big deal taking pride in your ancestry anyway? And despising other people’s ancestry? I once heard an African-American Muslim say that racism originated with Iblîs (the Devil); he refused God’s command to the angels to bow down to Adam. Iblîs said: “I am better than Adam. You created me from fire and you created him from clay.” There was an anecdote on a Celestial Seasonings box once, about an American who dated a Japanese woman. He couldn’t understand why she thought she was better than him. Another Japanese took him aside and explained: “Your mythology tells you that you’re descended from monkeys. Her mythology tells her that’s she’s descended from the Sun Goddess.” It’s ridiculous. We’re all just humans. Myths of the superiority of one people over another are used to incite wars, invasions, oppression, and fascism. There’s only one human race and this planet is all we’ve got. If we don’t learn to value one another’s humanity that we share in common, we’re all fucking doomed. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Tiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Mama\_Tiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Tiger)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/8 "2003-06-15T05:05:21Z")
I met a young woman who I thought was Japanese – and to all intents and purposes she is, having been born there, as were here parents and grandparents, and lived there all her life, and speaks nothing but Japanese – but she’s of Korean descent so is not allowed to be a Japanese citizen. There’s some deep hatred there, to force a family to remain aliens after living there for several generations. I also noticed when we were living in Japan that Korean-made products, even if completely identical to Japanese ones except for the name on them, were invariably priced more cheaply because they were considered inferior. Hey, we got some appliances on a good deal that way…but it was kind of strange. (American products were much sought after and far more expensive than Japanese products. Go figure.) The Japanese dislike everyone who’s not Japanese, although at least they’re polite about it. (or else they ignore you, which is better than open rudeness). But they don’t dislike ANYONE as much as they dislike Koreans. ---
**Author:** ![Peanuthead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peanuthead/32/360_2.png) [@Peanuthead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peanuthead)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/9 "2003-06-15T05:33:42Z")
A bit of Korean trivia for you: The Koreans treat the number **4** as bad luck, much the way us westerners see the number **13**. (Buildings without a 4th floor etc.). I don’t know the specifics but it has its roots in the Japanese occupation. ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_Explosion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Roger\_Explosion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_Explosion)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/10 "2003-06-15T06:13:39Z")
I believe that the reason the number four is unlucky lies in liguistics, not the Japanese occupation. The sound for the number four is ‘sa’. This is the same sound for the word death. -Roger Explosion ---
**Author:** ![non-native](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@non-native](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/non-native)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/11 "2003-06-15T06:23:03Z")
Last i checked, the Japanese government has yet to apologize for most of the atrocities committed during their occupation of Korea and other nations. They’re waiting for the victims to die out so they can all just forget about it. The best part about it is that they’re pretending it never happened, so most of the younger generation has no clue what their grandparents did. And preventing korean descendants from getting citizenship is simply being petty. As a korean, i may be a bit biased but I think that the korean hatred or dislike for japan is understandable, but i don’t know where the japanese are coming from. Ironically, before the japanese obtained western technology and kicked our ass, China and Korea considered the inhabitants of Japan barbarians. ---
**Author:** ![Avumede](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/avumede/32/7235_2.png) [@Avumede](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avumede)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/12 "2003-06-15T06:30:53Z")
Interesting, Roger. I know that the number 4 is pronounced the same as death in Mandarin (si), and Cantonese (sei). But I had thought that Korean is not from the same language family, in fact I thought Korean is a pretty unique language. Am I mistaken, or is there another explanation? ---
**Author:** ![non-native](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@non-native](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/non-native)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/13 "2003-06-15T06:39:15Z")
Well since we’re already a part of a hijack… **Avumede** : The korean language has several indigenous words but also has words borrowed from chinese but are pronounced differently (a korean, a chinese, and japanese person would look at the same chinese symbol and read it differently). In fact we have 2 different ways to say the number four, “sa” which is from the chinese and “net” or “neh”, which is indigenous. ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_Explosion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Roger\_Explosion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_Explosion)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/14 "2003-06-15T06:43:31Z")
If you can view Chines Characters… Žl (four) Ž€ (death) both pronounced ‘sa’ in Korean. I think the pronunciation is different in the Chinese, but because Korean lacks the different tones, the pronunciation is the same. Korean, like Japanese has its roots in Chinese. I think about 60% of the language is based on the chinese. Korean is unique in its alphabet, and pretty strange in its grammar, but has the same Chinese roots as a few Asian languages. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/15 "2003-06-15T07:02:54Z")
Japanese has the same four/death homonym. The kanji for “four” and “death” are, of course, different. However, they’re both pronounced “shi”. Although, there _is_ an alternative pronunciation for four, “yon”, that is actually more common (based on my limited Japanese knowledge) when combining numbers to make larger numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/16 "2003-06-15T07:03:53Z")
Ooh, Roger, that was your FOURTH post. (Actually reminds me of a story a friend has told me: when she was young, her family was unable to sell their home to an interested Chinese family. Why did the Chinese family change their minds? The house was number 444.) Anyway, my understanding - clearly less in depth than some here - is that Japan has not acknowledged a great number of atrocities it committed up to and including its actions in World War II against the Chinese and Koreans, which (if what I’ve heard and seen is true) ranged from the forced prostitution to Josef Mengele-style experimentation. ---
**Author:** ![MrO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/50afbb/32.png) [@MrO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrO)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/17 "2003-06-15T08:21:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Roger Explosion \* > **Korean, like Japanese has its roots in Chinese. I think about 60% of the language is based on the chinese.** Sort of a nitpick, and probably a continued hijack, but it isn’t actually the language that has roots in Chinese. It’s true that a large part of the _vocabulary_ derives from Chinese loanwords (more than 50%, according to [this site](http://www.declan-software.com/korean.htm#Origins_)), but the language itself probably has Altaic roots, like Mongolian, Turkish, and some others. In other respects, I agree. And welcome to the boards. Back to the topic: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by non-native \* > **As a korean, i may be a bit biased but I think that the korean hatred or dislike for japan is understandable, but i don’t know where the japanese are coming from.** Not a Korean, but a resident of Korea for nine years, and I tend to agree with this too. I think the Japanese tendency to look down on Koreans may have something to do with not being able to endure the feelings of guilt that would come with facing the truth. I suspect it’s similar to the tendency of some US white folks to look down on US blacks. It’s hard to forgive someone who has wronged you, but it’s often harder to “forgive” those you’ve wronged. In defense of Japanese people (as opposed to the government), the young Japanese people I have known do feel some shame for the part of their history that concerns WWII. And as I mentioned earlier, none of them seem to have any particular hatred for Koreans, though many may have feelings of superiority, toward Koreans and others. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/18 "2003-06-15T14:20:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by butrscotch \* > \*\*I also noticed when we were living in Japan that Korean-made products, even if completely identical to Japanese ones except for the name on them, were invariably priced more cheaply because they were considered inferior. \*\* Very true. Always go for the Sumsung stuff when buying electronics: exactly the same quality for 10-20% less money. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2003, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/japanese-and-koreans/181938/19 "2003-06-15T14:24:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by butrscotch \* > but she’s of Korean descent so is not allowed to be a Japanese citizen. There’s some deep hatred there, to force a family to remain aliens after living there for several generations. Incorrect on two counts. One, Japan bases citizenship on parentage, not where one is born (except for one particular situation in which the citizenship of neither parent can be known, which has happened once). Hatred has nothing to do with that. Plenty of countries use the same system, which just happens to be different than the one the United States uses. Two, the young lady has the option to apply for naturalization to become a Japanese citizen. Feel free to contact the Japanese Consulate in your area to confirm this.