# Jazz Heads: Rudy Van Gelder and Toots Thielemanns have both died. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 26, 2016, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004 "2016-08-26T10:42:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/1 "2016-08-26T10:42:26Z")
RVG: [Rudy Van Gelder - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudy_Van_Gelder) Toots: [Toots Thielemans - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toots_Thielemans) Rudy was a preeminent jazz record producer. His recordings have a warm intimacy given how he placed the mics and set levels. His name on the engineer credit came to be a real geek’s priority - when Blue Note had him remaster his tracks for CD, they were branded the Rudy Van Gelder Collection. Very cool. Toots was a masterful jazz harpist/harmonica player, which says something merely by existing. He got used a lot in the 70’s so we hear him a lot more often than you might think, e.g. The Sesame Street theme. Thanks to both. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/2 "2016-08-26T12:03:38Z")
Thanks for this. I had heard about Toots’ passing (pretty much created the sound defining a '70s childhood), but not Rudy’s. Until now, I knew nothing about Rudy other than his so-familiar name, printed on dozens of CDs strewn throughout my house and car. ---
**Author:** ![Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/les_espaces_du_sommeil/32/308_2.png) [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Les_Espaces_Du_Sommeil)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/3 "2016-08-26T13:30:22Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > … Toots was a masterful jazz harpist/harmonica player, which says something merely by existing. He got used a lot in the 70’s so we hear him a lot more often than you might think, e.g. The Sesame Street theme… Are you sure about the harpist bit? I knew he played guitar and harmonica but not harp. Anyway, he played with **Benny Goodman, Oscar Peterson, Bill Evans, Dizzy Gillespie, Pat Metheny** and **Jaco Pastorius** among many others so most jazz fans have heard him at one point or another. He also played on a lot of film soundtracks. I’ve always liked this [picture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toots_Thielemans#/media/File:Toots_Thielemans_1975.jpg) of him, taken, it seems in 1975. The clothes, posters, furniture, hairdos (and facial hair !) remind me of the Belgium of my childhood. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/4 "2016-08-26T13:34:15Z")
> [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](#): > > Are you sure about the harpist bit? I knew he played guitar and harmonica but not harp. > > Anyway, he played with **Benny Goodman, Oscar Peterson, Bill Evans, Dizzy Gillespie, Pat Metheny** and **Jaco Pastorius** among many others so most jazz fans have heard him at one point or another. He also played on a lot of film soundtracks. > > I’ve always liked this [picture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toots_Thielemans#/media/File:Toots_Thielemans_1975.jpg) of him, taken, it seems in 1975. The clothes, posters, furniture, hairdos (and facial hair !) remind me of the Belgium of my childhood. **LEPS** - in the U.S., “Harmonica Player” is often shortened to “Harpist” - and a blues harmonica is often referred to a as a “Blues harp.” I had just typed jazz harpist, then went back and specifically included harmonica player in case that wasn’t a universal thing. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/5 "2016-08-26T13:39:47Z")
He was also a master whistler. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/6 "2016-08-26T13:42:00Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > He was also a master whistler. Yes - in the Tributes I read and listened to, they stressed what a great _musician_ he was. Could play many things with great musicality. Again, getting a jazz harmonica a credible role in a lot of songs pretty much says it all. ---
**Author:** ![Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/les_espaces_du_sommeil/32/308_2.png) [@Les\_Espaces\_Du\_Sommeil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Les_Espaces_Du_Sommeil)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/7 "2016-08-26T13:56:37Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > **LEPS** - in the U.S., “Harmonica Player” is often shortened to “Harpist” - and a blues harmonica is often referred to a as a “Blues harp.” > > I had just typed jazz harpist, then went back and specifically included harmonica player in case that wasn’t a universal thing. I didn’t know that, thanks ! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/8 "2016-08-26T16:07:29Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Yes - in the Tributes I read and listened to, they stressed what a great _musician_ he was. Could play many things with great musicality. Again, getting a jazz harmonica a credible role in a lot of songs pretty much says it all. That style of harmonica playing is, of course, a quintessentially French sound, which I love. To make it appeal to an American audience was quite a feat. ---
**Author:** ![Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/soul_brother_number_two/32/3515_2.png) [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/9 "2016-08-26T21:42:07Z")
I was lucky enough to see Toots, twice. With Kenny Werner, Airto, Oscar Castro-Neves (sp?). He exuded joy. What a beautiful person, and a very great musician. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/10 "2016-08-26T23:25:37Z")
A wonderful tribute to RVG in The New Yorker: [Postscript: Rudy Van Gelder (1924-2016), Modern Jazz’s Listener of Genius | The New Yorker](http://www.newyorker.com/culture/richard-brody/postscript-rudy-van-gelder-1924-2016-modern-jazzs-listener-of-genius) ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2016, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/11 "2016-08-26T23:45:27Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > He was also a master whistler. Amen. Sad news. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2016, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/12 "2016-08-27T00:42:17Z")
Very sad. I was never a big fan of his, but regard him fondly for lending his talent to Laura Nyro’s first album, **More Than a New Discovery** (1967, reissued in 1974 as **The First Songs**.). That’s him wailing away on the classics “And When I Die,” “Stoney End,” and “Wedding Bell Blues.” Laura got some great jazzmen – Stan Getz, Lew Soloff, etc. – to contribute to her later masterpieces, but Toots got there first. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2016, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/13 "2016-08-27T00:50:47Z")
Sorry, NOT Stan Getz…it was **Zoot Sims** who took the tenor saxophone solos on **Eli and the Thirteenth Confession** (1968). Best wishes to Rudy too, of course. I have hundreds of his albums in my jazz collection. He must have been a swell guy in person, because Mingus hated him. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2016, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/14 "2016-08-27T05:23:28Z")
Damn, two names I sadly wasn’t aware I was listening to regularly and loving it until they died. Thanks for letting me put names to the sounds, **WordMan** , and happy trails to old friends whose names I just learned. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2016, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/15 "2016-08-27T05:24:58Z")
Credits for laura nyro - More than a New Discovery: Buddy Lucas: Harmonica on “And When I Die”, “Wedding Bell Blues” and “California Shoeshine Boys” Lou Mauro: Bass Jimmy Sedlar: Horns Toots Thielemans: Harmonica on “Billy’s Blues”, “Lazy Susan” and “He’s A Runner” Not Stoney End though ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2016, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jazz-heads-rudy-van-gelder-and-toots-thielemanns-have-both-died/764004/16 "2016-08-27T05:58:34Z")
Sorry, I just listened to Stoney End and there is a harmonica in the beginning. I don’t know who it is.