# Jeb Bush?!?!?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 20, 2011, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823 "2011-12-20T05:59:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/1 "2011-12-20T05:59:47Z")
[What the heck is _this_ about?](http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2011/12/15/the_mysterious_jeb_bush_poll.html) He said, and his people continue to say, he has no interest in running in 2012. So why would a pollster be asking New Hampshire voters about Jeb Bush? I really can’t believe the country would be willing to put another Bush in the WH this quickly. The discontent with this field of candidates just won’t stop will it? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/2 "2011-12-20T06:49:21Z")
My understanding of the situation is dimmer than I might wish. But as it stands, my understanding is that it is very, very difficult for a new candidate to impose himself. The ship has more or less sailed, and cannot be called back. As well, Jeb has baggage. He is not a fire-breather, but a more or less moderate and sane Republican, the sort of ruling class scion who oftimes felt a calling to public service. The oft repeated tale I’ve heard was that it was Jeb who was being groomed for higher office, not George and God knows, not Neal. In a lot of ways, he’s Romney all over again. He has the same electrifying charisma, he walks into the room and its like two people just left. And he’d have to be on fire, hotter than napalm Tabasco, there would have to be an absolute stampede of blazing lemmings, a tidal wave of flaming goobers…and even then, it would be a long shot. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/3 "2011-12-20T06:58:37Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > I really can’t believe the country would be willing to put another Bush in the WH this quickly. I think the people who voted for George W. Bush would do so again if they could, or for someone exactly like him. What have you seen to make you think otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/4 "2011-12-20T08:30:05Z")
Gingrich’s 15 minutes is up, and nobody seems to be getting interested in Paul or Santorum, so the media has to generate artificial buzz about SOMEONE. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/5 "2011-12-20T09:53:40Z")
> [@](#): > > **Robot Arm** : I think the people who voted for George W. Bush would do so again if they could, or for someone exactly like him. > > What have you seen to make you think otherwise? The question wasn’t directed at me, but I’m just passing through. It’s what I haven’t seen that makes me think otherwise. How often have you heard President George W. Bush’s name brought up in the Republican Debates? I don’t think I’ve heard it at all. Even this bunch doesn’t want to identify with him. They do talk about Reagan. Do you remember how low President Bush’s ratings were with the public by the time he left office? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/6 "2011-12-20T11:30:00Z")
They may talk about Reagan, but they’d never nominate anyone with his record. He (gasp) raised taxes! They may not talk about Bush, but they’d nominate his clone in a heartbeat. Warmonger? Check. Tax cuts for the rich? Check. Nominate radical right wingers to the Supreme Court? Check. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/7 "2011-12-20T14:38:09Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I think the people who voted for George W. Bush would do so again if they could, or for someone exactly like him. > > What have you seen to make you think otherwise? Not necessarily. I voted for Bush twice, but Obama last time and I’ll be voting for Obama again. In 2000 GWB fooled me with his “compassionate conservatism” agenda. In '04 I still believed in WMDs in Iraq. You know what they say, “fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice… … don’t get fooled again.” ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/8 "2011-12-20T14:49:34Z")
Right. There are (at least) three groups of Bush voter: 1. Disaffected former Republicans. Voted for Bush at least once (and maybe twice) but his performance (and that of his colleagues in Congress) have put them off the GOP for at least awhile. Possibly even caused them to reconsider some of the underpinning ideology that informed their voting in the past (tax cuts leading to increased growth, for example, or free-market approaches to health care). I’m in this camp, FTR. 2. Disaffected “Bush” voters. These realized by the end that Bush had made a number of mistakes (largely this disaffection centers around Iraq), but they still agree with the majority of the GOP message (low taxes, less govt, anti-abortion, anti-SSM, etc). They will vote for a candidate with the exact same positions as GWB as long as he doesn’t have the name Bush. Some percentage of these have become foreign-policy realists or even isolationists and are now more likely to support Ron Paul. 3. Die-hards. This 20% or so would vote for GWB again if possible. These are they guys with the “Miss me yet?” bumper stickers. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/9 "2011-12-20T15:13:34Z")
The primaries start in a few weeks and I think it has to be too late to put a national campaign organization together. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/10 "2011-12-20T15:17:33Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I think the people who voted for George W. Bush would do so again if they could, or for someone exactly like him. I think **most** of them would, by no means all. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/11 "2011-12-20T15:33:20Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > The question wasn’t directed at me, but I’m just passing through. It’s what I haven’t seen that makes me think otherwise. How often have you heard President George W. Bush’s name brought up in the Republican Debates? I don’t think I’ve heard it at all. Even this bunch doesn’t want to identify with him. They do talk about Reagan. Do you remember how low President Bush’s ratings were with the public by the time he left office? Bush’s name is not brought up in the Republican debates, but the candidates are in ideological lockstep with Bush. (As **Jas09** said, low taxes, less govt, anti-abortion, anti-SSM.) They never disagree with anything Bush did while in office. (They probably all want to repeal “Obamacare”, but how many have said they’d repeal the prescription drug benefit (Medicare Part D) which passed on Bush’s watch and will cost hundreds of billions of dollars.) Jas may be right, perhaps there are Bush voters who were so disaffected by him that they have reexamined their beliefs and policy goals, but I don’t see them having any impact on the nominating process so far. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/12 "2011-12-20T15:45:55Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Jas may be right, perhaps there are Bush voters who were so disaffected by him that they have reexamined their beliefs and policy goals, but I don’t see them having any impact on the nominating process so far. Well, Ron Paul may win Iowa. That would certainly be an impact and, I think, a direct result of Bush’s policies. Without the failures in Iraq there is no way an isolationist like Paul would have this kind of traction in a GOP primary. But other than that you’re right - they’re straight “Bush Doctrine” followers right down the line. If anything, they are to the right of Bush on a few issues (immigration being the most obvious). Interestingly, immigration policy is potentially the area that dooms any Jeb Bush momentum, even beyond the last name. He is rather more immigrant-friendly than the current field. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/13 "2011-12-20T15:51:04Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Well, Ron Paul may win Iowa. That would certainly be an impact and, I think, a direct result of Bush’s policies. Without the failures in Iraq there is no way an isolationist like Paul would have this kind of traction in a GOP primary. > > But other than that you’re right - they’re straight “Bush Doctrine” followers right down the line. If anything, they are to the right of Bush on a few issues (immigration being the most obvious). > > Interestingly, immigration policy is potentially the area that dooms any Jeb Bush momentum, even beyond the last name. He is rather more immigrant-friendly than the current field. [An article](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/20/us/politics/bias-in-ron-pauls-newsletters-draws-new-attention.html?_r=1&hp) in the NYT today noted that Paul’s conservative enemies are starting to rehash his old racist, anti-gay, anti-Israel screeds, even though he now disavows them. ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/14 "2011-12-20T15:55:42Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Interestingly, immigration policy is potentially the area that dooms any Jeb Bush momentum, even beyond the last name. He is rather more immigrant-friendly than the current field. His wife is also from Mexico, and don’t think for a second that she wouldn’t become the subject of some dirty campaign tactics. ---
**Author:** ![BlinkingDuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eada6e/32.png) [@BlinkingDuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlinkingDuck)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/15 "2011-12-20T16:10:38Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > His wife is also from Mexico, and don’t think for a second that she wouldn’t become the subject of some dirty campaign tactics. Oh for the love of Pete…he outsourced his WIFE? Is there no end to it? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/16 "2011-12-20T16:15:24Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > His wife is also from Mexico, and don’t think for a second that she wouldn’t become the subject of some dirty campaign tactics. I would prefer to make [her](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columba_Bush) the subject of other things, at least equally dirty. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/17 "2011-12-20T16:16:48Z")
I think a lot of names are being floated because they are candidates for the vice-presidential nomination. I wouldn’t object to Jeb Bush being the nominee. The trouble is that people that would make good presidents often are very boring candidates. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/18 "2011-12-20T19:19:46Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > Oh for the love of Pete…he outsourced his WIFE? > > Is there no end to it? for the win! ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2011, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/19 "2011-12-21T02:41:58Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > He is not a fire-breather, but a more or less moderate and sane Republican You obviously don’t live in Florida. I ain’t sure he’s sane, but I’m _damn_ sure he ain’t moderate. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2011, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823/20 "2011-12-21T02:49:49Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > You obviously don’t live in Florida. I ain’t sure he’s sane, but I’m _damn_ sure he ain’t moderate. For Florida he is quite moderate. He is a lot more moderate than Rick Scott. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeb-bush/606823.md?page=2)