# Jehovah's Witnesses and Blood Transfusions **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 18, 2012, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140 "2012-03-18T16:01:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/22 "2012-03-19T08:38:39Z")
**raindog** , what happens (both in typical practical and doctrinal/spiritual terms) to a JW who, for whatever reason (lets say a moment of personal weakness that could happen to anyone) _knowingly accepts_ a blood transfusion? ---
**Author:** ![Pitchmeister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pitchmeister/32/3459_2.png) [@Pitchmeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitchmeister)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/23 "2012-03-19T09:20:15Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > This whole blood transfusion controversy has always mildly puzzled me. It is an accepted part of almost all cultures that there are things worth giving your life for. > > Churches regularly have ceremonies celebrating the life of a soldier who “gave his life for his country.” And not just Churches; secular society places a great value on the life given for some greater good. > > We would never simply state that any soldier wants to die. We know the soldier wants to serve his/her country and return home to family, work etc. > > JWs do not want to die. They assert no “right to die.” They are as interested in getting the very best medical care they possibly can----within the limited constraints of their beliefs. > > What JWs are asserting is the same right everyone would want----the legal right to self-determination; the right to practice their religion without interference. > > I’ve always found it mildly ironic when people of all religious stripes implicitly acknowledge that God is superior to Country, and while it is a noble thing to die for your flag/constitution/political ideals/“freedom”\*\*\* it is somehow offensive to die for your God. > > In other words, the issue isn’t that a person is willing to die for something they believe in. Even in western society we accept that there things worth giving your life for. The controversy comes in when you’re willing to give up your life for a value that I disagree with. > \*\*\*And not just noble to die, but to kill in the process, even if it means killing other Christians. Do you honestly not see the difference between a soldier being killed in the process of fighting for his country (regardless what one may think of the reasons for this war) and a person dying for basically no good reason? While both are tragic, I just feel that “If only he had taken that blood transfusion.” is a little more immediate than “If only he hadn’t joined the Army 16 months ago.” I do see your point, but I for one am not puzzled that people are upset about this very, very non-standard way of thinking, especially if it majorly impacts other people, as in the DUI example mentioned above. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/24 "2012-03-19T09:50:01Z")
Someone else’s weirdness is always more weird and unreasonable than our own weirdness. ---
**Author:** ![Weirofhermiston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e274bd/32.png) [@Weirofhermiston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirofhermiston)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/25 "2012-03-19T10:24:05Z")
The JW position is not as clear as it might once have been. In exchange for concessions on military conscription the JWs in Bulgaria have agreed to permit blood transfusions, insofar as they have undertaken not to take action against members who receive them. How that works in practice is going to be hard to establish from outside a small sect in a foreign country. I can’t find much clarity on this. The JWs seem reluctant to make their position clear and explicit. I offer the following as a cite, the result of the briefest of searches. It’s from an evangelical organisation but I really can’t tell how accurate or impartial it is. They may just be knocking the competition. [http://www.watchman.org/jw/bloodbulgaria.htm](http://www.watchman.org/jw/bloodbulgaria.htm) ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/26 "2012-03-19T11:56:42Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Someone else’s weirdness is always more weird and unreasonable than our own weirdness. +1 ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/27 "2012-03-19T13:26:31Z")
> [@DannyHaszard](#): > > Jehovah’s Witnesses blood transfusion confusion > > ## Jehovahs Witnesses take blood products now in 2012. They take all fractions of blood.This includes hemoglobin, albumin, clotting factors, cryosupernatant and cryopoor too, and many, many, others. If one adds up all the blood fractions the JWs takes, it equals a whole unit of blood. Any, many of these fractions are made from thousands upon thousands of units of donated blood. Jehovah’s Witnesses can take Bovine _cows blood_ as long as it is euphemistically called synthetic Hemopure. Jehovah’s Witnesses now accept every fraction of blood except the membrane of the red blood cell. JWs now accept blood transfusions. The fact that the JW blood issue is so unclear is downright dangerous in the emergency room. > > Danny Haszard [http://www.ajwrb.org](http://www.ajwrb.org) > JW blood reform site Is your claim that this is the widespread belief of all Jehovah’s Witnesses in the US, or is this the belief of Associated Jehovah’s Witnesses For Reform on Blood (where your link goes to)? If the later, then okay. If the former, I’ve got to tell you that there are several Kingdom Halls in Chicago that could use your newletter, because their members haven’t gotten the memo. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/28 "2012-03-19T14:08:55Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Is your claim that this is the widespread belief of all Jehovah’s Witnesses in the US, or is this the belief of Associated Jehovah’s Witnesses For Reform on Blood (where your link goes to)? If the later, then okay. If the former, I’ve got to tell you that there are several Kingdom Halls in Chicago that could use your newletter, because their members haven’t gotten the memo. **WhyNot** , you’re right. Like most religions there are small groups pressing for reform/changes. Just like the Catholic groups pressing the Vatican for changes on abortion, contraception, gay rights, etc this group doesn’t speak for the hierarchy, nor the common JW. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/29 "2012-03-19T14:10:21Z")
> [@Weirofhermiston](#): > > The JW position is not as clear as it might once have been. > > In exchange for concessions on military conscription the JWs in Bulgaria have agreed to permit blood transfusions, insofar as they have undertaken not to take action against members who receive them. How that works in practice is going to be hard to establish from outside a small sect in a foreign country. > > I can’t find much clarity on this. The JWs seem reluctant to make their position clear and explicit. I offer the following as a cite, the result of the briefest of searches. It’s from an evangelical organisation but I really can’t tell how accurate or impartial it is. They may just be knocking the competition. > > [http://www.watchman.org/jw/bloodbulgaria.htm](http://www.watchman.org/jw/bloodbulgaria.htm) Next up, the KKK offers us a critique of President Obama’s presidency. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/30 "2012-03-19T14:25:23Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > **WhyNot** , you’re right. > > Like most religions there are small groups pressing for reform/changes. > > Just like the Catholic groups pressing the Vatican for changes on abortion, contraception, gay rights, etc this group doesn’t speak for the hierarchy, nor the common JW. Thank you. And…darn. I was kind of hoping it was a widespread reform so I could ask some of my patient’s Brothers and Sisters to explain to her that it’s okay to take blood now. (Although she still couldn’t take RBC’s, it seems, which is what she really needs.) ☹ ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/31 "2012-03-19T14:30:51Z")
> [@Pitchmeister](#): > > Do you honestly not see the difference between a soldier being killed in the process of fighting for his country (regardless what one may think of the reasons for this war) and a person dying for basically no good reason? It’s not “no good reason” to them. To take blood would mean they could never meet Jehovah. Never go to heaven. Be separated from all their loved ones for all eternity. This isn’t some stuff in a book they find vaguely interesting to discuss on a message board, this is one of their most fundamental deeply held truths. Compared to all eternity, a soldier’s death is a blip on the radar. If he didn’t take blood, he’ll get life everlasting in Paradise; his death right now is a minor inconvenience, a rest stop on his journey to Jehovah. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/32 "2012-03-19T15:02:45Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > It’s not “no good reason” to them. To take blood would mean they could never meet Jehovah. Never go to heaven. Be separated from all their loved ones for all eternity. This isn’t some stuff in a book they find vaguely interesting to discuss on a message board, this is one of their most fundamental deeply held truths. > > Compared to all eternity, a soldier’s death is a blip on the radar. If he didn’t take blood, he’ll get life everlasting in Paradise; his death right now is a minor inconvenience, a rest stop on his journey to Jehovah. I had a much longer post that responds to **Pitchmeister** , but I saw yours first. I think yours says it better and more succinctly. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/33 "2012-03-19T15:06:04Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > **raindog** , what happens (both in typical practical and doctrinal/spiritual terms) to a JW who, for whatever reason (lets say a moment of personal weakness that could happen to anyone) _knowingly accepts_ a blood transfusion? I suspect nothing, really. I suspect the person would receive counsel and encouragement. I’ve never known anyone in that situation. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/34 "2012-03-19T15:06:28Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > I had a much longer post that responds to **Pitchmeister** , but I saw yours first. I think yours says it better and more succinctly. I hope it says it accurately, as well. As I said, I’ve heard a lot of this over the past few months, but I’m not a JW myself. …and I just got a phone call that she’s back in the hospital again. Crap. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/35 "2012-03-19T18:00:34Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > Can someone get a medical directive to refuse any and all medical care and then take a bottle full of pills? Yes, actually - every time I’ve done anything at a hospital (surgery, blood draw, whatever) part of the paperwork includes a document saying I have the right to refuse treatment. Now, if my loved ones found me after downing those pills, and rushed me to the hospital, the staff “might not notice” the document I was clutching in my hand, or might take the stance that I was not in my right mind when I drew up the document, or something - and get a judge to issue an order that I be treated (assuming I was unconscious - if I were conscious it would be harder). There was one of those “true ER” shows on a while back where they re-enacted a tale where a teenage boy (15 or so) was badly injured and needed a transfusion or he would die. His mother, being JW, refused it even given the argument that “if he were 3 years older he could choose, you’re taking that choice away”. The hospital got a judge to issue a court order, they transfused the boy, and he lived. His mother, far from being angry, basically said “it was God’s will for things to work out that way” and was grateful. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/36 "2012-03-19T18:41:09Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Is your claim that this is the widespread belief of all Jehovah’s Witnesses in the US, or is this the belief of Associated Jehovah’s Witnesses For Reform on Blood (where your link goes to)? If the later, then okay. If the former, I’ve got to tell you that there are several Kingdom Halls in Chicago that could use your newletter, because their members haven’t gotten the memo. If you believe that the leaders of your religion have gone astray on doctrine, then why would you remain a part of that religion rather than converting to another or starting your own? ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/37 "2012-03-19T18:53:59Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > If you believe that the leaders of your religion have gone astray on doctrine, then why would you remain a part of that religion rather than converting to another or starting your own? Can you clarify the question? I’m having trouble thinking of a way to answer it as presented without it being a complete hijack of the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/38 "2012-03-19T21:17:32Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > If you believe that the leaders of your religion have gone astray on doctrine, then why would you remain a part of that religion rather than converting to another or starting your own? Not every point of doctrine is make-or-break. People can quite happily remain a member of the same church as friends and family while only agreeing with 95% of the doctrine (or 50% or 10%—depends on the person). ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/39 "2012-03-19T23:49:52Z")
Please note that I in no way meant to criticize the beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses. I was just curious if this particular belief was unique to them, and how it works for these folks in the real world, especially if they are unconscious as a result of an accident or illness. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/40 "2012-03-20T00:38:55Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > I suspect nothing, really. I suspect the person would receive counsel and encouragement. I’ve never known anyone in that situation. Thank you - so is it not generally considered the case that such a person has irredeemably transgressed? If not, is that a matter of definition, or more a case of it not being appropriate to pass judgment? Hope you don’t mind me asking these questions. Feel free to decline any of them. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140/41 "2012-03-20T00:47:49Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > It’s not “no good reason” to them. To take blood would mean they could never meet Jehovah. Never go to heaven. Be separated from all their loved ones for all eternity. What I don’t get is, how can you possibly reconcile the idea of a loving merciful god with a god that would punish your for eternity for accepting a medical treatment? Either god is loving and merciful, in which case he/she would forgive you for accepting treatment in a life threatening situation, OR he’s a jealous spiteful petty rules lawyer that condemns people to eternal damnation for arbitrary infractions. You can’t have it both ways, pick one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-transfusions/616140.md?page=3)