# Jess Hart, It's on, Babe **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 21, 2010, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904 "2010-12-21T02:17:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/221 "2010-12-24T16:49:48Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > What you said was fairly sound (although it’s unlikely that anyone losing weight in order to be underweight and look skinny would lose so much muscle mass without losing a great deal of their fat mass as well). It’s clear though that you don’t have a grasp on what an ‘obese’ body fat percentage is (over 30% for women), or what people look like at different body fat percentages. ‘Skinny-fat’ obese-by-body-fat-percentage women do not look like Jess Hart. They may look small/thin enough in clothes, but put them in a bathing suit and they are soft and squishy all over. They do not have defined arm, shoulder, back and ab muscles. Like I said, she’s probably right around 18-20% - on the lower side of the ideal range for women. Concur. “Skinny-fat” is basically zero or almost zero visible muscle definition. The linked photos of Jess Hart show a woman that, while not totally ripped, definitely has visible definition. Not “skinny-fat,” IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/222 "2010-12-24T20:49:05Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > What you said was fairly sound (although it’s unlikely that anyone losing weight in order to be underweight and look skinny would lose so much muscle mass without losing a great deal of their fat mass as well). Yeah, well, I guess you did the example very well. I talked about yo-yo dieting. A person loses fat and muscle while dieting, they have a lower caloric requirement and when they return to what had been their maintenance level diet they gain fat. If they do this over and over they lose muscle and gain fat and end up skinny fat. That’s what I said, so I’m surprised you’re responding as if I didn’t say it. > [@](#): > > It’s clear though that you don’t have a grasp on what an ‘obese’ body fat percentage is (over 30% for women), or what people look like at different body fat percentages. Really? huh. Well, it’s clear that you don’t have a grasp of what I have a grasp on. > [@](#): > > ‘Skinny-fat’ obese-by-body-fat-percentage women do not look like Jess Hart. They may look small/thin enough in clothes, but put them in a bathing suit and they are soft and squishy all over. They do not have defined arm, shoulder, back and ab muscles. Like I said, she’s probably right around 18-20% - on the lower side of the ideal range for women. I disagree. Younger women don’t look as soft and squishy when they are technically obese because gravity has not yet had its way with them, and all their collagen is still holding everything up. > [@](#): > > So, you are totally wrong that Jess Hart has a high body fat percentage, and it’s kind of fucked-up to accuse her of having one. [Here](http://www.leighpeele.com/body-fat-pictures-and-percentages) [are some visual guides](http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/body_fat_categories.htm) to body fat percentage, for your edification. I don’t really see much if any muscle definition on her at all. As I’ve said before, age makes a big difference. > [@](#): > > I also know you’re wrong because I’ve had my own body fat tested by DEXA and 7-point caliper several times. How does receiving a test make you an expert? I’ve had that test, too, so by that criteria, I am just as much an expert as you. Anyway, your links are to a bodybuilding site showing one example of each category. It’s a bit more complex than that. Age, genetics and musculature all play a role in determining what a body fat percentage is going to look like. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/223 "2010-12-24T20:50:41Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > Look, your OP is basically ‘Jess, you made a snotty comment that bothered me. That’s your right so I won’t comment on that but I will try to use a lot of mumbo jumbo to call you names’. It’s silly. Well, yes. I knew that when I was writing it. Did you think I was writing a warning letter to her Doctor? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/224 "2010-12-24T20:53:08Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > 41, male. I’m afraid I don’t understand any of the other questions. Sorry, I was asking about how fast you can run 3 miles, and how many pushups, chinups and leg raises you could do. This would give me an idea of how well you manage your body weight and what kind of muscle you have to support it. Since you asked for a serious answer, that’s the kind of info I need to take a swing at giving you one. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/225 "2010-12-24T21:06:07Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Sorry, I was asking about how fast you can run 3 miles, and how many pushups, chinups and leg raises you could do. This would give me an idea of how well you manage your body weight and what kind of muscle you have to support it. Since you asked for a serious answer, that’s the kind of info I need to take a swing at giving you one. But you’ve already demonstrated in this thread that you’re willing to give a “serious answer” without any such pertinent information. You arrived at your evaluation of the model with nothing more than some photos and pull-it-out-your-ass guesswork. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/226 "2010-12-24T21:10:38Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > But you’ve already demonstrated in this thread that you’re willing to give a “serious answer” without any such pertinent information. You arrived at your evaluation of the model with nothing more than some photos and pull-it-out-your-ass guesswork. Shouldn’t you be out playing with the other children? ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/227 "2010-12-24T21:23:50Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Shouldn’t you be out playing with the other children? Oh, Zing!!! You got me good. Now, why don’t you provide some evidence for the baseless assertions you’ve made about Jess Hart’s alleged obesity in this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Brandinho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Brandinho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brandinho)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/228 "2010-12-24T21:30:01Z")
I totally agree with Ms. Hart and would not dare to approach her first in a bar. Primarily because I don’t find skinny, shapeless white girls with a hideous gap toothed smile to be worth hitting on. I’ve had better when I’ve gone slumming. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/229 "2010-12-24T21:42:53Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Oh, Zing!!! > > You got me good. > > Now, why don’t you provide some evidence for the baseless assertions you’ve made about Jess Hart’s alleged obesity in this thread? You do this a lot, you know? When I wrote a thread about a bird that shit on my truck, you ended up getting all OCD about the emissions of my Honda Ridgeline. Which was beside the point. Now, in this thread, a supermodel makes a nasty comment, and I respond by creatively insulting her. You know, it really doesn’t matter if she is actually scientifically obese, or not, or what her BMI is. That’s just the justification I made up for saying she wasn’t going to age well. It’s an insult, not a scientific dissertation. I would think that you would get that, but you seem to do this a lot. Are you retarded or mentally ill, or socially disable in some way that you are unable to see past the literal? Seriously, are you? How do you not get that it’s just a way of insulting her for her comment? Is there a grain of truth to it? Maybe, maybe not, who cares? ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/230 "2010-12-24T21:55:15Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Now, in this thread, a supermodel makes a nasty comment, and I respond by creatively insulting her. You know, it really doesn’t matter if she is actually scientifically obese, or not, or what her BMI is. That’s just the justification I made up for saying she wasn’t going to age well. It’s an insult, not a scientific dissertation. > > \ > > How do you not get that it’s just a way of insulting her for her comment? Is there a grain of truth to it? Maybe, maybe not, who cares? I sort of do get that, and i’d be willing to believe you if you hadn’t also spent a whole bunch of posts arguing that skinny people can be technically obese. But your arguments in this thread have suggested that it’s not simply a creative insult, and that you actually believed that this particular person is, in fact, technically obese. Put simply, i don’t believe your current assertion that it was only ever meant as a “creative insult,” because your subsequent defense of it suggests otherwise. If you had come right out, when you were first criticized for using the term “technically obese,” and said that it was just a creative insult, i might have believed you. Now, i don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Brandinho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Brandinho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brandinho)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/231 "2010-12-24T22:03:59Z")
People keep getting hung up on the specific term “technically obese”, which I agree is grossly misused in this context. She’s not obese. But Scylla is correct in the sense that, for a skinny girl, she’s in awful shape. She doesn’t look healthy and likely won’t age well. Silly technical jargon isn’t necessary to see something so obvious. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/232 "2010-12-24T22:09:48Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Did you think I was writing a warning letter to her Doctor? No. As a 43 year old, balding, married father of two I think you bristled at the thought of not having a shot at her. That combined with her comment sent you over the edge. Your complaints of her in the OP does not follow your criticism of her comment. Claudia Schiffer gets a pass because she was decent to you. You seem to be as shallow as you accuse JH of being. You have a strong following around here. I myself enjoy a lot of your writings. I have no general beef with you but your OP was bullshit. I’m sure you expected the usual suspects to join in your outrage… and they might have had you addressed her comment only and stayed out of the schoolyard taunt arena. The bottom line is that you have no idea what her body fat level is or what her general level of fitness is. Nor do you know what she will look like in the future. You can spout all the hypothetical nonsense you want about her “obesity”, but fact is it’s just that - hypothetical nonsense. ~On preview I see you given up the scientific justifications and admitted you’ve made the whole thing up as a childish way of lashing out at her. Why you think this would win you any brownie points is anyones guess. If she’s worth pitting at all, why not just pit her for what she said, wasn’t that enough? > [@](#): > > **Scylla** : Is there a grain of truth to it? Maybe, maybe not, who cares? The Dope does. You’ve been around here long enough to know that. Fighting ignorance and all… ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/233 "2010-12-24T22:12:31Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > No. As a 43 year old, balding, married father of two I think you bristled at the thought of not having a shot at her. That combined with her comment sent you over the edge. Your complaints of her in the OP does not follow your criticism of her comment. Claudia Schiffer gets a pass because she was decent to you. You seem to be as shallow as you accuse JH of being. Liking people who are nice, and disliking people who are not nice, has never struck me as particularly shallow. Also, I think it’s been a good five years since **Scylla** had any sort of following around here. Unless you count a lynch mob as a following. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/234 "2010-12-24T22:13:16Z")
And this is important to you because… Seriously, why is your analysis of my motivations worthy of my effort to repond and attempt to convince you? I don’t really care what you think. I do think there’s something off with you. Your threadshitting is annoying. Convince me why I should make the effort to justify and explain my actions to you. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/235 "2010-12-24T22:19:37Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Liking people who are nice, and disliking people who are not nice, has never struck me as particularly shallow. It’s not about liking or not liking, it’s about his “technical” assessment of her. “Claudia Schiffer is good because she let me take her picture. Jess Hart is bad because she is obese (when she’s not).” Shallow comparison. > [@](#): > > Also, I think it’s been a good five years since **Scylla** had any sort of following around here. I disagree. . ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/236 "2010-12-24T22:52:02Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > It’s not about liking or not liking, it’s about his “technical” assessment of her. “Claudia Schiffer is good because she let me take her picture. Jess Hart is bad because she is obese (when she’s not).” Shallow comparison. > . You think that’s what I’m saying? You think I’m saying JH is bad because she’s technically obese? That’s how you read the OP? Really?? ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Hartwick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7feea3/32.png) [@Dave\_Hartwick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Hartwick)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/237 "2010-12-24T23:18:52Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > You think that’s what I’m saying? You think I’m saying JH is bad because she’s technically obese? That’s how you read the OP? Really?? I think your OP was bad because you called her technically obese. Plus it’s stupid and whiny. ---
**Author:** ![Gestalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/90ced4/32.png) [@Gestalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gestalt)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2010, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/238 "2010-12-24T23:39:49Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Yeah, well, I guess you did the example very well. I talked about yo-yo dieting. A person loses fat and muscle while dieting, they have a lower caloric requirement and when they return to what had been their maintenance level diet they gain fat. If they do this over and over they lose muscle and gain fat and end up skinny fat. [Not true](http://www.win.niddk.nih.gov/publications/cycling.htm#willweight). This is from the NIDDK, btw. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2010, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/239 "2010-12-25T00:47:03Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > You think that’s what I’m saying? You think I’m saying JH is bad because she’s technically obese? That’s how you read the OP? Really?? Yes. Please quote the part of your OP that explains otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904/240 "2010-12-25T03:17:37Z")
> [@Gestalt](#): > > [Not true](http://www.win.niddk.nih.gov/publications/cycling.htm#willweight). This is from the NIDDK, btw. The conclusion seems to be that people that yo-yo tend to be thicker in the middle than those that don’t. That neither agrees nor disagrees with my statement that they lose muscle. Obviously not everybody who yo-yos becomes skinny fat. Most just become fat fat. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jess-hart-its-on-babe/564904.md?page=13)