# Jesse vs. Imus vs. MSNBC **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 12, 2007, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782 "2007-04-12T11:22:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Caridwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c89c15/32.png) [@Caridwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caridwen)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/41 "2007-04-12T17:08:24Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] I’m not the one who placed Sharpton right in the middle of this whole mess. If I was dragging his name into a conversation where he had no role at all, you’d have a point, **Caridwen**. What Imus said was objectively wrong. But with Sharpton in the conversation as well, it is necessary to discuss his own objective wrongs, which he has never answered for in any substantial way. [/QUOTE] Well that was a great non-answer. Back up the time machine to the day before Sharpton said anything. Were the remarks sexist/racist or not? Were they offensive to these young girls? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/42 "2007-04-12T17:12:01Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] But with Sharpton in the conversation as well, it is necessary to discuss his own objective wrongs, which he has never answered for in any substantial way. [/QUOTE] Why? This is a free country, and anyone has a right to be a jerk and a bigot, even to get famous being one. Even Sharpton. Even Imus. Even Coulter. The question is, why give an Imus or a Sharpton or a Coulter free air time or free publicity? Why should major institutions or public figures validate any one of them, and why shouldn’t we come down on them like a ton of bricks when they do? I don’t mind that Imus is a world-class jerk. All I want is that he disseminate his jerkitude on, say, www.don\_imus.com. If people flock to his website and it makes him a ton of money, then such is life. But let him do it without the help of the public airwaves or allegedly responsible institutions like NBC. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/43 "2007-04-12T17:13:23Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] Why? This is a free country, and anyone has a right to be a jerk and a bigot, even to get famous being one. Even Sharpton. Even Imus. Even Coulter. The question is, why give an Imus or a Sharpton or a Coulter free air time or free publicity? Why should major institutions or public figures validate any one of them, and why shouldn’t we come down on them like a ton of bricks when they do? I don’t mind that Imus is a world-class jerk. All I want is that he disseminate his jerkitude on, say, www.don\_imus.com. If people flock to his website and it makes him a ton of money, then such is life. But let him do it without the help of the public airwaves or allegedly responsible institutions like NBC. [/QUOTE] Well said. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/44 "2007-04-12T17:49:45Z")
I’m for that. I’ve said in the past that I wished the various stations would stop calling Coulter up for commentary. That goes for Imus as well. The Democratic National Committee got over $14 million in public funds for their national convention in 2004. Air time was given to them for the purpose of broadcasting the events. A portion of both were given to Al Sharpton so that he could speak. Given his record, **RTFirefly** , and your opinions about the use of public accomodations for the promotion of “jerkitude”, do you endorse this? Or should the Democrats have told Sharpton that he wasn’t on the list of speakers that year, or any year leading up to never. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/45 "2007-04-12T18:05:02Z")
[QUOTE=Lamar Mundane] Imus made these comments toward some 18-21 year old kids whose only crime was to make it against great odds to the NCAA basketball finals. That is at the heart of it. He victimised those girls. [/QUOTE] Victimized? What does that mean. I agree that he insulted them, and for no good reason. But “victimize”? That’s the sort of language that turns this into what it is not. It was a dumb, uncaqlled for, insensetive statment. A direct insult for no apparent reason. He owes those girls a sincere apology. No one else. Certainly no the likes of Sharpton and the shake-down artist Jackson. And every time Sharpton (who I kinda like) opens his mouth about this, the only response should be to ask him why he still hasn’t apologized for the phony Tawana Brawley accustions he leveled against cops. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/46 "2007-04-12T18:16:31Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Given his record, **RTFirefly** , and your opinions about the use of public accomodations for the promotion of “jerkitude”, do you endorse this? Or should the Democrats have told Sharpton that he wasn’t on the list of speakers that year, or any year leading up to never. [/QUOTE] Can’t swear to it, but I think I mentioned my unhappiness about it here at the time. The main thing I have against Sharpton is, of course, his role in the Tawana Brawley matter. I am pretty unfamiliar with his track record in the two decades since (yeah, I know, that was plenty bad all by itself), other than his run for the Dem nomination in 2004. So when you mention “his record” without specifics, I’d appreciate it if you’d be more specific about your objections. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/47 "2007-04-12T18:28:58Z")
Well, many New Yorkers are unable to forget his role in the [Crown Heights Riots and especially the Freddy’s Fashion Mart disaster](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverend_Al_Sharpton#Crown_Heights_Riot) (the fire killed one black and six Latinos, BTW, no whites, and the site actually was being bought by a black-owned church.) It’s not so much just what he said that set off unstable idiots, it’s that he still says the same things DESPITE those tragedies; he never seems to learn or moderate his talk no matter what the result. He also is a publicity hound who rushes to the side of any family member who’ll allow him after any incident with any possible racial tinge in the five boros, as long as the victims are black or Latino; he sure wasn’t there for the family or fiancee of [Nicole duFresne.](http://www.nypost.com/seven/09302006/news/regionalnews/fianc __recalls_his_whispered_plea_to_shot___ dying_beauty___stay_with_me_regionalnews_laura_italiano.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/48 "2007-04-12T18:42:35Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] I am pretty unfamiliar with his track record in the two decades since (yeah, I know, that was plenty bad all by itself), other than his run for the Dem nomination in 2004. So when you mention “his record” without specifics, I’d appreciate it if you’d be more specific about your objections. [/QUOTE] 1. Crown Heights riot. Sharpton whips up the crowd with rhetoric about “diamond merchants”. A youth named Lemrick Nelson, fueled by chants of “Kill the Jews!” murders a visiting rabbinical student, Yankel Rosenbaum. 2. The United House of Prayer, a large Harlem based black church, raises the rent on property it rents to Freddy’s Fashion Mart. The Jewish owner of the store promptly raises the rents of his subtenants, one of which is a black owned record store. Sharpton leads protests against Freddy’s, calling them “white interlopers.” Some of the protesters chant “Burn down the Jew store,” and on December 8th, one of those protesters does so. He breaks into the store, shoots four employees point-blank, and then torches the place. Seven employees of Freddy’s Fashion Mart die. This is the man who spoke at the convention. Tawana Brawley was the least of his crimes. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/49 "2007-04-12T18:45:40Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] I’m not the one who placed Sharpton right in the middle of this whole mess. If I was dragging his name into a conversation where he had no role at all, you’d have a point, **Caridwen**. What Imus said was objectively wrong. But with Sharpton in the conversation as well, it is necessary to discuss his own objective wrongs, which he has never answered for in any substantial way. [/QUOTE] I haven’t been following the story all that closely, but wasn’t Imus the one who dragged Sharpton into the middle of things? He’s the one who went to Sharpton to issue his apology, and just judging from what I’ve been reading here on the boards, I’m starting to wonder if that wasn’t a deliberate move on Imus’s part to make the debate about Sharpton instead of him. Because that’s certainly the topic that’s dominated the Imus threads here ever since. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/50 "2007-04-12T18:51:44Z")
It’s possible that it was done for those reasons. Pretty dumb move, though, even if it were so. I think apologies ought to seem sincere. If you ask me, Imus should have avoided Sharpton and spoken to [T.D. Jakes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T.D._Jakes) instead. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/51 "2007-04-12T19:07:51Z")
The Onion interviewed a lady on the street who had a great line- “Cut Imus some slack. The man is under immense pressure to be an asshole every single morning.” — Lisa Wanless, Systems Analyst She looked really familiar… ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/52 "2007-04-12T20:32:04Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] It’s possible that it was done for those reasons. Pretty dumb move, though, even if it were so. I think apologies ought to seem sincere. If you ask me, Imus should have avoided Sharpton and spoken to [T.D. Jakes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T.D._Jakes) instead. [/QUOTE] Why? Just because T.D. Jakes is black? I think if he MUST talk to someone besides the girls he insulted, then it would make sense to go to a prominent black woman. And there’s plenty of them he could have gone to. Imus actually turned this whole thing into more of a spectacle by talking to Sharpton, who–despite his incinderary comments and outrageous behavior in the past, I have lots of respect for. If Imus was really sorry and not just being a media whore (or is it “ho”?), he would have had a private talk with the girls and let that be it. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/53 "2007-04-12T20:45:42Z")
[QUOTE=monstro] I think if he MUST talk to someone besides the girls he insulted, then it would make sense to go to a prominent black woman. And there’s plenty of them he could have gone to. [/QUOTE] I would have enjoyed seeing him sit down with Gwen Ifle. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/54 "2007-04-12T20:49:46Z")
[QUOTE=monstro] Why? Just because T.D. Jakes is black? I think if he MUST talk to someone besides the girls he insulted, then it would make sense to go to a prominent black woman. And there’s plenty of them he could have gone to. Imus actually turned this whole thing into more of a spectacle by talking to Sharpton, who–despite his incinderary comments and outrageous behavior in the past, I have lots of respect for. If Imus was really sorry and not just being a media whore (or is it “ho”?), he would have had a private talk with the girls and let that be it. [/QUOTE] No. But if he was compelled to speak to a black clergyman, better it was one with a following as such and some credibility. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/55 "2007-04-12T20:50:23Z")
CBS has dropped the Imus show. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/56 "2007-04-12T20:54:58Z")
Sponsor pressure. Eight major sponsors quit. I suppose we all knew that that is where the judgment would end. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/57 "2007-04-12T21:03:39Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] 1991. Crown Heights riot. Sharpton whips up the crowd with rhetoric about “diamond merchants”. A youth named Lemrick Nelson, fueled by chants of “Kill the Jews!” murders a visiting rabbinical student, Yankel Rosenbaum. 1. The United House of Prayer, a large Harlem based black church, raises the rent on property it rents to Freddy’s Fashion Mart. The Jewish owner of the store promptly raises the rents of his subtenants, one of which is a black owned record store. Sharpton leads protests against Freddy’s, calling them “white interlopers.” Some of the protesters chant “Burn down the Jew store,” and on December 8th, one of those protesters does so. He breaks into the store, shoots four employees point-blank, and then torches the place. Seven employees of Freddy’s Fashion Mart die. This is the man who spoke at the convention. Tawana Brawley was the least of his crimes. [/QUOTE] Thank you for filling me in. In 1991, I was living in Florence, SC. In 1995, I was living in Bristol, VA/TN. I don’t watch TV, except for football, and I guess those stories didn’t get much play in the crappy local papers. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/58 "2007-04-12T21:36:02Z")
Next up for Al, getting Imus’ wife kicked out of her bridge club, and his son barred from Little League 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/59 "2007-04-12T21:44:06Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] CBS has dropped the Imus show. [/QUOTE] DONE! He’s all done. WOW. Count me as being at least a _little_ surprised… ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2007, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782/60 "2007-04-12T22:01:01Z")
[QUOTE=Phlosphr] DONE! He’s all done. WOW. Count me as being at least a _little_ surprised… [/QUOTE] I’m not surprised given the firestorm it’s created. It’s sad in a way, because he has done a lot of good. But sometimes that’s simply not enough. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesse-vs-imus-vs-msnbc/399782.md?page=4)