# Jesus and Mary Magdeline **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 19, 2001, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787 "2001-01-19T01:03:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tinker\_Grey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tinker_grey/32/8136_2.png) [@Tinker\_Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tinker_Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2001, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/21 "2001-01-19T23:36:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by puddleglum \* > Well, since you asked, in the movie while Jesus is up on the cross Satan tempts him by showing him what his life could be like if he got down off the cross. In the temptation he marries Mary and they live in Israel. Jesus refuses this temptation and dies on the cross. The author Niko Katzanzakas(sp) is a Greek Orthodox Christian, and wrote the book to explore the humanity of Jesus. \*\* Thanks! Tinker ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2001, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/22 "2001-01-19T23:44:17Z")
Let’s try to stick to the OP here. So far, it seems the consensus is that there exists no (even modestly reliable) evidence that Jesus moved to France. Is there a contridiction to the consensus? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2001, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/23 "2001-01-19T23:52:43Z")
Um…I thought Cecil answered this one! 😕 ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/24 "2001-01-20T00:04:49Z")
**Cecil** answered the Mary Madgelene part, [here](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/980918.html). Good catch! No word on settling down with the richie-riches in the south of France, though. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/25 "2001-01-20T00:12:20Z")
Thanks, Manny! 😉 Anyhoo, though, I don’t think France would’ve been very rich…weren’t they fighting the Brits and the Celts? Hey…maybe Jesus became Irish! ---
**Author:** ![tisiphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tisiphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tisiphone)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/26 "2001-01-20T00:37:00Z")
Just as a question, does that mean that the Nag Hammadi texts are pretty much dismissed? Cecil didn’t mention them at all. I am well aware that they were written with the Gnostic bias in mind, but much of the New Testament was written with Pauls um, peculiar biases in mind, so to me, that doesn’t wash as an excuse for dismissing them. Yeah, I’m gonna ask here. Since it’s vaguely related to the topic. Tisiphone ---
**Author:** ![omni-not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8dc957/32.png) [@omni-not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/omni-not)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/27 "2001-01-20T02:22:24Z")
> [@](#): > > Sorry for the King James, it’s all I’ve got in my purse. Know what? I’m seriously thinking of making this my sig. It has a little _je ne sais quoi_… ---
**Author:** ![DaveRaver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daveraver/32/1078_2.png) [@DaveRaver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaveRaver)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/28 "2001-01-20T02:39:14Z")
Was Magdeline her last name, or is it a compound name like Mary Jane? Did they even have family names in Biblical times? ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/29 "2001-01-20T03:23:49Z")
> [@](#): > > Richard Shindell’s song “The Ballad of Mary Magdalene” contains > > > [@](#): > > > > I’m sorry if I might offend > > But I will never see > > How the tenderness I shared with him > > Became a heresy > > Yikes! Yes, Jesus was tempted in every way we are, including sexual attraction, but to act like He was a fornicator _is_ heresy and blasphemy. \*\* Thats not what Shindell meant in his song…from [http://www.richardshindell.com/answers2.html](http://www.richardshindell.com/answers2.html) “The song explores one other aspect of being human - love. I’m not interested in whether or not Jesus and Mary had a sexual relationship. Fascination in that regard is just salacious tabloid scandal-mongering applied to the New Testament. The song has a simple message: they loved each other, and she misses him. Is this so terrible?” I’m a big RS fan 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/30 "2001-01-20T03:53:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\*Thanks, Manny! ;)maybe Jesus became Irish! > \*\* “And did those feet in ancient times walk upon ENGLAND’S mountains green…” (it seems the English have their own local angle on the New Testament, as well as dso the French) Well, if teenage Jesus visited Roman Britan with his merchant uncle Joseph, whay not a side trip to Ireland if there was a shekel to be made? But after Golgotha? Faking his death on the cross and skipping out to France? I doubt it. Jesus made his peace with the suicidal (if you’ll excuse the phrase - okay “sacrificial”) nature of his mission when he was arrested in the garden. And look at it from the Romans’ point of view: yet another rabble-rouser comes to town, an inflamable population waving palm fronds at him. He makes enemies of the native power base at the temple by throwing a one-man riot, giving you the excuse to silence him and get back to your main business of sending money back to your Emperor (Tiberius - not a man to take excuses for short-payments). And when the Romans crucified a guy, he stayed crucified. They used to say that all when all good Americans die they go to Paris, but there’s no evidence of that either. And it’s a good possibliity that Mary M. went back to the brothel - what other livelihood did she have? As enlightened as he was, Jesus didn’t make her an apostle (I guess he had only one last slot left and Judas got it) ---
**Author:** ![Opus1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/858c86/32.png) [@Opus1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Opus1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/31 "2001-01-20T04:04:53Z")
Mary came from the town of Magdala. Mary Magadalene is no more her name than is Jesus Nazarene. (In fact, we should probably be calling her Mary the Magdalene, a la Jesus the Nazarene.) And she was not a prostitute. In fact, the Bible says nearly nothing about her. She could have been a 60 year old widow for all we know. In fact, it’s likely that she was some sort of patron of Jesus, and as such would have had at least a fair amount of money to her name. ---
**Author:** ![Alonist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e68b1a/32.png) [@Alonist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alonist)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/32 "2001-01-20T12:27:02Z")
The “Gospel of Philip” from the Naq Hammadi scrolls seems to be the one quoted in support of the idea that Jesus and the Magdalene were married. Since the Naq Hammadi link in an earlier post doesn’t seem to be working right now, here’s a translation of [Philip’s gospel](http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gop.html). The Magdalene reference is about a third of the way down the page. “Jesus and Maggie were lovers- Oh Lordy, how they could love…” ---
**Author:** ![Cerowyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/82dd89/32.png) [@Cerowyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerowyn)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/33 "2001-01-20T16:06:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Opus1 \* > **Mary came from the town of Magdala. Mary Magadalene is no more her name than is Jesus Nazarene. (In fact, we should probably be calling her Mary the Magdalene, a la Jesus the Nazarene.)** While it’s true that Magdalene was probably not properly her surname, that **is** how last names developed. Origins, professions and nicknames were eventually adopted as proper surnames (e.g. John the Smith became John Smith, Eric the Cartwright became Eric Cartwright). My own surname, Leonard, came from an egotistical Norman ancestor who dubbed himself “Lion Heart.” ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2001, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/34 "2001-01-20T16:24:52Z")
I believe it was required in the days of Jesus, Joseph, etc. for a person to be married in order for him to be a rabbi. I have heard that Jesus was considered by some early scholars to have been a rabbi. His number of followers would lend credence to this belief (minimum of ten males for services). ---
**Author:** ![avacado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@avacado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/avacado)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/35 "2001-01-21T18:38:06Z")
The Catholic take on Jesus’s being called Rabbi is that he was a teacher, thus, referred to as Rabbi out of respect. I can’t find anything in the Bible that implies Jesus underwent formal Rabbinical training, but the New Testament isn’t famous for its inclusion of details. ---
**Author:** ![melchizedek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7cd45c/32.png) [@melchizedek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/melchizedek)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/36 "2001-01-21T19:44:03Z")
Referring to previous posts on the perpetual virginity of Mary, certainly Jesus did have brothers. Not only do the quotes previously mentioned state “Mary and Jesus’ brothers” but the cross reference in Mark mentions their names… Simeon, Joseph, James, and a sister (or more). The trouble with the Catholic Church, is it presuposes something and then states it as fact. It says the “brethren” were step Brothers, as Joseph MAY have been a widow and had kids by a previous marriage. OK. It’s possible… but the Bible makes NO referrence. Do they really expect us to base our salvation on what the book DOESNT say? In the meantime, as for was Jesus married? Why not? In John 2, you know, the miracle of turning water into wine (the opposite of my party trick…) It seems strange to me, that when the wine ran out, they would approach a guest. Now remember, Jesus hadn’t done any miracles at this point, so it’s not like they were expecting him to do it. It would have been such an insult to all concerned to go to a guest to supply more wine. Would they have rather gone to the Groom? Perhaps this was Jesus’ own wedding… honeymoon in Marseilles? Ok, so he could have been making arrangements for his sister’s wedding in the absence of Joseph, who just seemed to vanish. I did hear that the Bourbon Kings of France claimed to be descendants of Jesus, but how many ancient (I know, the Bourbons weren’t ancient) kings claimed direct ancestry from a godhead? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/37 "2001-01-21T21:57:20Z")
> [@](#): > > It seems strange to me, that when the wine ran out, they would approach a guest. Just to be picky, it never says any member of the wedding party approached Jesus. It says that Mary noticed that they were out of wine and she did the Mom thing: “Help these people out.” It would also be a stretch have have the bridegroom (or the brother-in-law) “invited” to the wedding. > [@](#): > > 1 On the third day there was a marriage at Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there; > 2 Jesus also was invited to the marriage, with his disciples. > 3 When the wine failed, the mother of Jesus said to him, “They have no wine.” > 4 And Jesus said to her, “O woman, what have you to do with me? My hour has not yet come.” > 5 His mother said to the servants, “Do whatever he tells you.” > 6 Now six stone jars were standing there, for the Jewish rites of purification, each holding twenty or thirty gallons. > 7 Jesus said to them, “Fill the jars with water.” And they filled them up to the brim. > 8 He said to them, “Now draw some out, and take it to the steward of the feast.” So they took it. > 9 When the steward of the feast tasted the water now become wine, and did not know where it came from (though the servants who had drawn the water knew), the steward of the feast called the bridegroom > 10 and said to him, “Every man serves the good wine first; and when men have drunk freely, then the poor wine; but you have kept the good wine until now.” > 11 This, the first of his signs, Jesus did at Cana in Galilee, and manifested his glory; and his disciples believed in him. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2001, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/38 "2001-01-22T00:04:10Z")
I thought Joseph died. I liked the story when Jesus went on a vacation retreat with his parents, and they went back, and Mary and Joseph were upset because they couldn’t find him-and he was in the temple. “Young man! You scared the beJESUS out of us!” Ha ha! ---
**Author:** ![Fillet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/2acd7d/32.png) [@Fillet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fillet)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2001, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/39 "2001-01-23T17:41:43Z")
An alternative view on Jesus’s life, post-Crucifixion: [Jesus in Japan](http://abcnews.go.com/sections/world/DailyNews/japan010123_jesus.html) No word on whether Mary Magdalane was supposed to have accompanied him, though. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2001, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787/40 "2001-01-23T18:21:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by beagledave \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > Richard Shindell’s song “The Ballad of Mary Magdalene” contains > > > > > [@](#): > > > > > > I’m sorry if I might offend > > > But I will never see > > > How the tenderness I shared with him > > > Became a heresy > > > > Yikes! Yes, Jesus was tempted in every way we are, including sexual attraction, but to act like He was a fornicator _is_ heresy and blasphemy. \*\* > > Thats not what Shindell meant in his song…from > > [Home - Richard Shindell](http://www.richardshindell.com/answers2.html) > “The song explores one other aspect of being human - love. I’m not interested in whether or not Jesus and Mary had a sexual relationship. Fascination in that regard is just salacious tabloid scandal-mongering applied to the New Testament. The song has a simple message: they loved each other, and she misses him. Is this so terrible?” > > I’m a big RS fan 🙂 \*\* Thanks, beagledave! I fell into the the same trap of thinking by intimacy he meant sex. Yet, the image of Jesus and Mary M. lying in each other’s arms at night is questionable–even fantasizing about sex is sinful and it would be hard for them not to while wrapped up physically. Anyway, thanks for the clarification; I’m glad RS thinks this is all tabloid crap too 🙂 but I wish he had explored it strictly as _agape_, where you would miss this tremendous person without a physical aspect to it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jesus-and-mary-magdeline/50787.md?page=3)