# JFK Airport - Are there usually armed military guys in the check-in area? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 6, 2016, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779 "2016-10-06T16:28:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/21 "2016-10-07T15:54:43Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > They’re almost certainly NY National Guard. Every time there’s an _incident_, they start showing up at train stations and airports for a few weeks after. I believe **quimper** ’s theory about the Chelsea bombing is correct. I wonder if there’s a regional component to this, and/or wonder who exactly makes that decision. I mean, is it Andrew Cuomo deciding to put some NY National Guardsmen in JFK Airport, or is it some Homeland Security/TSA person? Also, for those of you who see them regularly, are you in international airports or domestic-only ones? Maybe that has something to do with it? I could totally see some governors being willing to detail a handful of NG troops to their international airports on occasion, with other governors not being concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/22 "2016-10-07T16:05:04Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Are you sure they’re military? > > The NY Port Authority police and the customs / ICE guys have teams that wear pretty much military style clothing and carry pretty much military style weapons. TSA has SWAT teams that dress that way too. > > If you saw military rank and US ARMY embroidered over a pocket it’s military for sure. If not, it’s probably not. > > Which is not to say that military are never seen doing guard duty at airports. But that at JFK at least the odds of a random guy with a big gun seen on a random day being military is rather low. Team of about four, wearing camo fatigues and caps, boots, slim back-packs, and all carrying what looked to my untrained eye like M-16 rifles. Didn’t notice any unit badges. That’s police? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/23 "2016-10-07T16:18:22Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > That’s police? Could be. There are many different law enforcement organizations that could be patrolling at JFK. I certainly saw folks outfitted like that at the Boston Marathon starting line who weren’t military. ---
**Author:** ![Billdo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billdo/32/315_2.png) [@Billdo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billdo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/24 "2016-10-07T19:13:11Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Team of about four, wearing camo fatigues and caps, boots, slim back-packs, and all carrying what looked to my untrained eye like M-16 rifles. Didn’t notice any unit badges. > > That’s police? If they are wearing camo fatigues, they are most likely National Guard/ANG troops. The NYPD unit that you would see patrolling with assault rifles, the Emergency Service Unit, wear dark fatigues. (See [picture 2 here](http://theblinker.com/mainpage/2014/08/18/5-facts-you-may-not-know-about-the-most-militarized-unit-of-the-nypd/)). At the airports, it would most likely not be the NYPD, but the Port Authority Police. Apparently their ESU also wear [dark fatigues](http://www.panynj.gov/police/services.html). ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/25 "2016-10-07T19:27:26Z")
Apparently the New York National Guard has had a [“Joint Task Force Empire Shield”](http://www.nationalguard.mil/News/Article-View/Article/939398/ny-national-guards-joint-task-force-empire-shield-guarding-nyc-transit-hubs-sin/) continuously since 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/26 "2016-10-07T19:46:27Z")
Yup; and per a [NY National Guard handout](http://dmna.ny.gov/blog/resources/jtfes_info.pdf). > [@](#): > > Per authorization of the > President of the United States, New York Military Forces began augmenting > **law enforcement at all major airports on 1 October 2001**. The mission > expanded to providing forces on State Active Duty (SAD) t**o augment law > enforcement **at Nuclear Power Plants, MTA Police at** Penn and Grand Central > Station in NYC**. They are “there to augment law enforcement”; which seems to be similar to the common law (and commonwealth) concept of “in aid of civil power”. Interesting thing I once saw at Penn (where most of the soldiers on the LIRR section seem to be standing before the Starbucks for some reason); there was a group of military officers (probably Allied officers) passing through while I was waiting and the lady soldier on duty ignored them. About 5 seconds later a Sargent magically appeared and tore into her extremely loudly; something about saluting, now imagine a station like Penn; guy could be heard all over; hell I suspect he could be heard in Queens. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/27 "2016-10-07T20:24:11Z")
> [@JacobSwan](#): > > Here in the UK armed police are very rare. I pass through Stansted airport about 50 times a year and there’s almost always a couple of police walking around with big guns. I’ve seen the same thing at other UK airports, but not with the same regularity. Stansted is the UKs dedicated hijack and terrorist airport\* though so that may be why. Europe and the UK have had squads of law enforcement armed with rifles or submachine guns at airports when the US had just some regular police or security with sidearms, though US security became much more thorough after 9/11. In the 90s, it was not uncommon for an American visitor to Europe to be unnerved by the heavy firepower on display at an airport. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2016, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/28 "2016-10-08T03:01:37Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Yup; and per a [NY National Guard handout](http://dmna.ny.gov/blog/resources/jtfes_info.pdf). > > They are “there to augment law enforcement”; which seems to be similar to the common law (and commonwealth) concept of “in aid of civil power”. So yeah, a state related thing apparently. I was thinking that I’ve been through DFW a few times, as well as O’Hare and San Antonio international airports, without seeing a single military person on-duty as a security person. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2016, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/29 "2016-10-08T09:12:07Z")
> [@bump](#): > > So yeah, a state related thing apparently. I was thinking that I’ve been through DFW a few times, as well as O’Hare and San Antonio international airports, without seeing a single military person on-duty as a security person. JFK is by far the largest US Airport by international arrivals. O’Hare gets a third as many (and many are probably from Canada), while DFW gets a fifth as many). Are there any at LAX? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2016, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/30 "2016-10-08T14:01:26Z")
I’m not recalling having seen military at LAX, despite passing through there every month or so. My carrier operates a decent amount of trans-Pacific flights through our terminal, but far more are operated collectively by the various foreign carriers who operate out of a different terminal I never visit. So there might be military on duty there who I’d never have an opportunity to see. The really interesting observation is that the heavy police/military presence at an airport is not to defend the country against baddies arriving on flights. It’s to protect the assembled mass of departing passengers from local bad guys attacking from within the country. Which raises the interesting question: If you’re a US-based terrorist of whatever ethnicity and allegiance, would you be more effective shooting up or blowing up: A) A terminal mostly full of US citizens leaving on domestic flights? B) A terminal mostly full of US citizens leaving on international flights? C) A terminal mostly full of foreigners leaving on international flights to many different countries? D) A terminal mostly full of foreigners leaving on international flights to one particular country or region? There are certainly plenty of mostly-binary conflicts in the world where you could imagine terrorists loyal to side A would want to target a terminal full of side B citizens about to fly to a major city in side B. The thrust of this question being that although I certainly agree with **AK84** ’s facts about JFK being inordinately full of international arrivals and departures, I don’t know whether that makes it \*a priori \*a more or less attractive target. On thing NYC in general has going for it is a large immigrant population from darn near everywhere which affords foreign bad guys a community to hide within. So far fully home-grown terrorists with purely domestic US complaints such as Timothy McVeigh don’t seem real interested in airplanes and airports. NYC also has a very high media profile. Any atrocity anywhere will get heavy media coverage, but the same event in NYC will be an even yuuger media circus. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/31 "2016-10-08T15:34:51Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > They are “there to augment law enforcement”; which seems to be similar to the common law (and commonwealth) concept of “in aid of civil power”. > [@bump](#): > > So yeah, a state related thing apparently. Yes, because National Guard Forces do have that function, as the successors to the State Militia Regiments. ---
**Author:** ![Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shinna_Minna_Ma)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2016, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/32 "2016-10-08T19:48:13Z")
I’ve seen paramilitary patrol persons, off and on, at both JFK and Newark. I was able to identify them as being from the Port Authority. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/33 "2016-10-09T08:17:47Z")
Not the US, but I was in Singapore recently and there were quite a few armed police/border security guys there in full tac gear with H&K G36 assault rifles; I was surprised because it’s pretty unusual IME to see the serious hardware openly on display like that when travelling. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/34 "2016-10-09T08:30:32Z")
The US is unusual in that its largest airports (O’Hare, Atlanta) are also not its largest International port of entry by air. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2016, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/35 "2016-10-10T14:12:32Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Yes, because National Guard Forces do have that function, as the successors to the State Militia Regiments. Beyond that, without being federalized into the actual Army/Air Force, they’re wholly under the control of their respective state governors, so it’s entirely possible that the Governor of New York might want a handful of NG troops obviously in his airports, while the TX and CA governors might not feel it to be necessary. Which would explain why JFK might have some uniformed troops, while DFW, IAH and LAX seem to have none. A good thing for a check would be to compare the presence of uniformed troops in JFK vs Newark (the 1st and 4th largest airports in the US in terms of international flights). They’re not very far apart, but reside in two different states. ---
**Author:** ![LurkerInNJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ed655f/32.png) [@LurkerInNJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkerInNJ)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/36 "2016-10-11T16:03:15Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Just wondering if that’s standard in US airports? Don’t know about the rest of the USA, but here it’s status quo. Sometimes they are visible, sometimes they aren’t. It’s the National Guard who provide the armed military presence. They are at the airports, tunnels, bridges, in subway stations, at the Port Authority bus terminal, Grand Central, etc. Yes, they can be seen at Newark also. It’s part of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey infrastructure. [http://www.panynj.gov/about/facilities-services.html](http://www.panynj.gov/about/facilities-services.html) ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/37 "2016-10-11T16:09:40Z")
> [@LurkerInNJ](#): > > Don’t know about the rest of the USA, but here it’s status quo. Sometimes they are visible, sometimes they aren’t. > > It’s the National Guard who provide the armed military presence. Definitely NOT the status quo in Texas; haven’t seen a National Guardsman on duty at an airport, commuter train station, bus stop, or anywhere else like that since about 6-9 months post 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779/38 "2016-10-11T19:40:05Z")
I’m guessing there probably are (I usually fly out of Newark). The Port Authority, PATH stations, Grand Central and Penn Station always have armed National Guardsmen standing around. Police (sometimes in SWAT gear, sometimes just regular) and K-9 units too. I’m pretty sure they are military. They have a sort of board look of someone who was taken off of their regular job and told to stand guard duty for hours. The law enforcement types seem to be more active in their observing people, even when it doesn’t look like they are. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-airport-are-there-usually-armed-military-guys-in-the-check-in-area/767779.md?page=1)