# JFK fatal head shot **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 24, 2013, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117 "2013-10-24T15:13:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/21 "2013-10-24T17:00:50Z")
Some folks have chalked it up to his back brace acting like a canvas-and-steel corset: keeping him upright in general, and even snapping him backward in particular, upon getting shot from behind. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/22 "2013-10-24T17:04:24Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Agreed. This is not a matter of opinion, nor is it really debatable. > > There are the facts. Take it or leave it. > > Regards, > Shodan 1. All the facts point in the same direction-the only thing pointing elsewhere are conspiracy theories and people selling books to the paranoid, and more importantly, 2. _ **Shodan** and I are agreeing with each other!_ ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/23 "2013-10-24T17:07:46Z")
I also throw my support behind “a factual answer exists, whether it gets accepted or not.” This thread should be returned to GQ. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/24 "2013-10-24T17:27:45Z")
> [@Charredcasm](#): > > 1. All the facts point in the same direction-the only thing pointing elsewhere are conspiracy theories and people selling books to the paranoid, and more importantly, > 2. _ **Shodan** and I are agreeing with each other!_ [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/iRscbQQVRTY/hqdefault.jpg "Earth Explodes") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRscbQQVRTY) ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/25 "2013-10-24T17:31:23Z")
Geez, how many times is this question going to be asked? ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/26 "2013-10-24T17:35:55Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > If you viewed the head shot from above, the motion of the head would be more ore less circular, not forward or backwards. When viewed from the side, this makes the head appear to go forward, then backward, but it’s really one smooth circular motion. And the only shot that explains that motion comes from the rear, and strikes the head off center. > > **That’s what it looks like to me, and you’re going to have a hard time convincing me of anything else**. In my opinion, Penn and Teller are wrong, as are the folks who think the shot came from the front. That pretty much says it all, doesn’t it? The evidence and analysis by people actually qualified to opine on the issue be damned, “That’s what it looks like to me and I’m going with it”. Your intuitive view of physics is simply wrong, with very little actual examination of the forces at work. There is a clear answer to this question. You’re just ignoring it. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/27 "2013-10-24T17:43:42Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Geez, how many times is this question going to be asked? We’re coming up on the 50th anniversary, so I am going to say “A lot”. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/28 "2013-10-24T18:10:36Z")
> [@Charredcasm](#): > > 1. All the facts point in the same direction-the only thing pointing elsewhere are conspiracy theories and people selling books to the paranoid, and more importantly, > 2. _ **Shodan** and I are agreeing with each other!_ You know, I was all set to make an Hi, \*\*Opal \*\*joke there. And then I got sad all over again :(. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/29 "2013-10-24T18:22:42Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > That pretty much says it all, doesn’t it? The evidence and analysis by people actually qualified to opine on the issue be damned, “That’s what it looks like to me and I’m going with it”. Your intuitive view of physics is simply wrong, with very little actual examination of the forces at work. There is a clear answer to this question. You’re just ignoring it. I’m not ignoring anything. I have read quite a bit about the cue ball theory, the shot from the front theory, and many others. I also have what I think is a pretty fair understanding of both physics and firearms. Based on my understanding of things, and quite a bit of study and thought, that is the conclusion I have come to. Because I have put quite a lot of thought into it, it is going to be hard for you to change my mind. But I do actually have an open mind. Convince me I’m wrong. If you can, I’ll gladly change my mind. My problem with the cue ball theory is that it doesn’t match the motion of JFK’s head. In the Zapruder film, the head clearly moves forward and then back (again, download the stabilized video, put a yellow sticky on the screen, and advance it frame by frame and watch where the head goes first). In the Penn and Teller video, the melon does not go forward at all. It just rolls back. Sitting at your desk, tilt your head forward, then roll it around to the left rear. That’s the motion that JFK’s head is making. It’s a simple, fluid motion, and it’s explainable by very simple physics when you just keep in mind that the head isn’t a free floating melon but is in fact attached to the neck, which makes a pivot point. If you think I’m wrong, tell me where I goofed. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/30 "2013-10-24T18:36:19Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > Then came the internet, and someone posted a stabilized version of the Zapruder film. I downloaded the video and freeze-framed it just before the fatal shot. Then I put a yellow sticky on the computer screen and advanced it frame by frame. That made it clear that JFK’s head does not move back and to the left. It moves forward first, then snaps back. Got a link to the stabilized version you saw? > [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Geez, how many times is this question going to be asked? Considering this is the 50th anniversary year, and the date is next month, oh, I think a few more times here and other forums. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/31 "2013-10-24T18:42:32Z")
It makes one wonder - if you were orchestrating the assassination of JFK, and planning on pinning the crime on a lone patsy…why on Earth would you employ a gunman firing from the opposite direction of your patsy’s supposed sniper nest, or multiple gunmen? All it takes is a round striking Kennedy and fragmenting instead of leaving a messy exit wound, or a round striking the front of the car, or any of a dozen other uncontrollable variables, and the whole frame-up falls apart. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/32 "2013-10-24T18:44:25Z")
Where else could you put your gunman? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/33 "2013-10-24T18:48:51Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > My problem with the cue ball theory is that it doesn’t match the motion of JFK’s head. In the Zapruder film, the head clearly moves forward and then back … No, it doesn’t. The Zapruder film shows JFK’s head moving forward before it is hit, then it jerks backward after it is hit. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/34 "2013-10-24T18:49:40Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > Where else could you put your gunman? I’d put him where my patsy supposedly was: the 6th floor of the Texas School Book Depository. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/35 "2013-10-24T18:51:50Z")
I guess but the other employees might notice a strange man walking around ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/36 "2013-10-24T18:54:40Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > I guess but the other employees might notice a strange man walking around With the President about to drive by and crowds lining the streets, you have a distraction and an explanation if anyone confronts your gunman - he was looking for a high vantage point to see the President. Or, sneak him in overnight and have him hide out in a room full of books. If it doesn’t work out, abort. Firing from a totally different direction is much riskier, and unlike getting a gunman inside the Depository, it’s a risk that can’t be mitigated through planning. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/37 "2013-10-24T18:57:08Z")
Shooting from the grassy knoll just seems less complicated than trying to sneak someone into the book depository. And it worked - they’ve never found the grassy knoll gunman ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/38 "2013-10-24T19:01:51Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > It makes one wonder - if you were orchestrating the assassination of JFK, and planning on pinning the crime on a lone patsy…why on Earth would you employ a gunman firing from the opposite direction of your patsy’s supposed sniper nest, or multiple gunmen? All it takes is a round striking Kennedy and fragmenting instead of leaving a messy exit wound, or a round striking the front of the car, or any of a dozen other uncontrollable variables, and the whole frame-up falls apart. I think if I was orchestrating it, I’d have someone take out Zapruder first. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/39 "2013-10-24T19:03:50Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > Shooting from the grassy knoll just seems less complicated than trying to sneak someone into the book depository. And it worked - they’ve never found the grassy knoll gunman The grassy knoll was covered with people, that’s as complicated as a plan gets! And if you’re planning the shooting, are you really willing to stake everything on your shooter firing a shot that hits and kills the President, without betraying the fact that the shots came from a different direction than the Depository? If you’re willing to do that, why not have a patsy who was on the knoll? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2013, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117/40 "2013-10-24T19:09:24Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > I guess but the other employees might notice a strange man walking around Oswald worked there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jfk-fatal-head-shot/672117.md?page=3)