# Jihadi parents sent 7 year-old daughter on suicide bombing mission **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 21, 2016, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308 "2016-12-21T17:08:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/41 "2016-12-22T18:12:01Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I know this is the Pit, but perhaps more Westerners would be willing to learn about Muslim beliefs if they were spoken to with less condescension and arrogance. Something plentiful in your posts on this Board. > > If you were truly interested in educating folks on Islam, you wouldn’t be such a snot about it. In fairness, you did not ask her to educate you on Islam you merely asked her to educate you and what she said was extremely valuable advice IMHO but what do I know? I’m just a person who so hates spreading misinformation so much I google almost everything that I post if I’m not certain about the facts and sometimes even when I am. I’ve learned a lot that way. I don’t know if this is true in this case but in 2005 I was on an airplane and the woman behind me, a professional woman from Pakistan struck up a conversation and during the conversation she asked me to keep an open mind and consider Islam. When I asked her for more information she simply said to read the Quran. She said it was a very short read. It seems to me that this was brilliant advice if someone truly wants to be educated on Islam. Why I don’t know if it’s true is because doing that would give me my interpretation of the religion and I believe what you’re asking is what you really want to know is what other people’s interpretation of what the book says is and you won’t get that by reading it just like you won’t learn about the difference between Catholic and Protestant beliefs by just reading the bible. Scrolling down and seeing her hostile post tells me that she would be the wrong person to educate you about the religion which is her right not to offer frankly. If you are truly interested I’ll bet you’d find any answer you need on the internet. You’ll get more rational less emotional responses as there are people who actually want to educate people about their religion and not use it as a sword to strike out at those who are ignorant of it. Some strike out physically obviously and others strike out verbally. Either way, answers won’t be had that way though I don’t really blame those who strike out verbally. To paraphrase Chris Rock, it’s wrong but I understand. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/42 "2016-12-22T18:18:13Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > Extrapolating: I don’t know, the person who made the blanket statement about what “fundamentlists” of a certain religion believe, without having any knowledge about them and just “extrapolating” from a book they read that does not even state such things? > > Of course there are the butt hurt people who rather than admit that they made up complete a non factual assertion, will make the complaints and play the martyr rather than openly admit their inventions and their gross errors. > > This can of course give us some insight into the psychology of the partisan who closes out the contradictory information and reacts to correction by the attacks and the denials. > > For the word doofus, I think this means someone who is stupid, uninformed and clumsy. Okay you think this applies to the persons who showed you completely invented some “facts” about the beliefs (we can use the pretext ‘extrapolated’ to make the excuses of course, but then if that is the case, I can extrapolate on this same basis that Trump intends to have the concentration camps, I read it somewhere). > > But you do not need to worry, the SDMB is a safe space, it is fine here to assert the protocols kind of discourse, it is only necessary to be very pollite as if we are in an English tea room discussing the possible inferiority of the wogs in the sudan. You wrote this while I was finishing up my post. Damn, you’re fast. I am truly impressed. The only thing I can add is that if you truly believe that the only reason to be polite is because you’re in a safe place all that means is that you’re a disagreeable person at least when you’re pissed off. You are wise to decline trying to educate people. It’d only make things worse. You haven’t the temperament for it at this time. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/43 "2016-12-22T18:33:09Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > In fairness, you did not ask her to educate you on Islam you merely asked her to educate you and what she said was extremely valuable advice IMHO but what do I know? I’m just a person who so hates spreading misinformation so much I google almost everything that I post if I’m not certain about the facts and sometimes even when I am. I’ve learned a lot that way. > > I don’t know if this is true in this case but in 2005 I was on an airplane and the woman behind me, a professional woman from Pakistan struck up a conversation and during the conversation she asked me to keep an open mind and consider Islam. When I asked her for more information she simply said to read the Quran. She said it was a very short read. It seems to me that this was brilliant advice if someone truly wants to be educated on Islam. > > Why I don’t know if it’s true is because doing that would give me my interpretation of the religion and I believe what you’re asking is what you really want to know is what other people’s interpretation of what the book says is and you won’t get that by reading it just like you won’t learn about the difference between Catholic and Protestant beliefs by just reading the bible. Very salient point. If Westerners have little knowledge of Islam, they have even less of the different interpretations within that religion, say between the Sunnis and the Shi’ites. Simply reading the Quran is not going to help there. But supposing that same woman on the airplane had told you, “Keep an open mind and consider Islam, you ignorant racist moron.” I think you would be less inclined to be persuaded to learn about Islam. From the totality of **Ramira’s** posts, it’s clear she has no interest in educating anyone. She just wants to bitch. A pity really, because she could be more than that. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/44 "2016-12-22T18:39:49Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > For the word doofus, I think this means someone who is stupid, uninformed and clumsy. Okay you think this applies to the persons who showed you completely invented some “facts” about the beliefs (we can use the pretext ‘extrapolated’ to make the excuses of course, but then if that is the case, I can extrapolate on this same basis that Trump intends to have the concentration camps, I read it somewhere). If you believe I am stupid, uninformed, and clumsy for extrapolating from something that I read somewhere, why are you doing it yourself “on this same basis”? Does that not make you stupid, uninformed and clumsy? Welcome to the club. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/45 "2016-12-22T18:41:31Z")
This story appears to have come from Syrian authorities, and I’m not prepared to accept its accuracy without seeing corroboration from some more independent source. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/46 "2016-12-22T18:52:30Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > Very salient point. If Westerners have little knowledge of Islam, they have even less of the different interpretations within that religion, say between the Sunnis and the Shi’ites. Simply reading the Quran is not going to help there. > > But supposing that same woman on the airplane had told you, “Keep an open mind and consider Islam, you ignorant racist moron.” I think you would be less inclined to be persuaded to learn about Islam. > > From the totality of **Ramira’s** posts, it’s clear she has no interest in educating anyone. She just wants to bitch. A pity really, because she could be more than that. I’d have taken it badly but then again, I’ve never given anyone a reason to believe that I am an ignorant racist moron. I can’t imagine why she would have done that. She breached the subject and admitted up front that she was frightened even talking to me because she felt scared that I would react badly to her because of 9 11. That was another eye opener to me. For her to flip like that after I assured her that I don’t get involved in the politics of religion I’d have considered her mentally ill … and then had her ass tossed from the plane. I kid. I already admitted that posting like she does now she should not be educating anone and she admitted that she did not want to educate you but curmudgeonly as she can be she clearly is one to listen to mainly to get ideas that I don’t have anyone else to share. I just overlook the personality ( which can so easily be misunderstood in writing and cross culture no less ) and listen to the ideas which I feel is good advice whether someone is caustic or overly charming. It’s admittedly hard to do though when you are the taking the brunt end of the personality no matter which extreme. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/47 "2016-12-22T18:57:28Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > If you believe I am stupid, uninformed, and clumsy for extrapolating from something that I read somewhere, why are you doing it yourself “on this same basis”? Does that not make you stupid, uninformed and clumsy? Welcome to the club. Um, you busted out the dufus term not her and she’s saying that if you can use the term against her she might as well do something that is dufusly. At least that’s what I think she’s saying. Could be wrong but that’s how I interpret an if then statement. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/48 "2016-12-22T19:23:23Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > Um, you busted out the dufus term not her and she’s saying that if you can use the term against her she might as well do something that is dufusly. At least that’s what I think she’s saying. Could be wrong but that’s how I interpret an if then statement. Actually, she was extrapolating about something she read, after calling me stupid for extrapolating about something I had read. After that, I pointed out that she was extrapolating herself, and THEN I broke out the term “doofus”. So, she did the doofusery before I pointed it out. Afterward, she said that if I could be a doofus, she could be a doofus “on the same basis”. To which I say, “Fine. Doofus away.” ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/49 "2016-12-22T19:28:51Z")
Alternatively, you could have said: “Huh, I guess I misunderstood what I read. Thanks for clarifying” ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/50 "2016-12-22T19:37:47Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Alternatively, you could have said: > > “Huh, I guess I misunderstood what I read. Thanks for clarifying” But playing the martyr (her term) is so much more fun. You get more virgins that way. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/51 "2016-12-22T19:41:43Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > Actually, she was extrapolating about something she read, after calling me stupid for extrapolating about something I had read. After that, I pointed out that she was extrapolating herself, and THEN I broke out the term “doofus”. So, she did the doofusery before I pointed it out. > > Afterward, she said that if I could be a doofus, she could be a doofus “on the same basis”. > To which I say, “Fine. Doofus away.” Ahh, her reaction to you calling her a snot. I dunno, I don’t find personal insult slinging as being extrapolating. They’re just insults and if you consider every insult an extrapolation ( which they actually are if you don’t know the person ) you’ve watered down the term to uselessness. I can see where you’re coming from though because she lashed out at an entire group of people but clearly I don’t believe it was meant as an true extrapolation rather as lashing out and it poses no threat that people will take it otherwise. It’s similar to using hyperbole when you are upset. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/52 "2016-12-22T19:43:51Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Alternatively, you could have said: > > “Huh, I guess I misunderstood what I read. Thanks for clarifying” Seconded for emphasis. That’s what an actually smart response would’ve looked like. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/53 "2016-12-22T19:50:10Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > But playing the martyr (her term) is so much more fun. You get more virgins that way. Yeah but you only get them once. That’s why you need so many. This is a case where you can’t have your cake and eat it too. Actually I am curious ( but not enough to look it up and I know better than to ask the person here who would know ) is that actually in the quran at all? What is the origin of this line of thought really? It is extremely stereotypical of what men are supposed to want that it sounds more like propaganda than doctrine. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/54 "2016-12-22T19:54:47Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > But playing the martyr (her term) is so much more fun. You get more virgins that way. Ok then. Wow. ---
**Author:** ![Debillw3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@Debillw3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debillw3)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/55 "2016-12-22T19:57:53Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > Actually I am curious ( but not enough to look it up and I know better than to ask the person here who would know ) is that actually in the quran at all? What is the origin of this line of thought really? It is extremely stereotypical of what men are supposed to want that it sounds more like propaganda than doctrine. Technically, it depends. There is (what can be considered) talk of virgins. Some scholars say that it’s a perpetual mistranslation. For the record, some say the same about the use of the word in the New Testament. As the only classical language that I personally speak is Latin, I don’t have the ability to see for myself how accurate those claims are. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/56 "2016-12-22T20:03:19Z")
> [@Debillw3](#): > > As the only classical language that I personally speak is Latin, I don’t have the ability to see for myself how accurate those claims are. YMMV. Unfortunately the same can be said about the New Testament here too. Without enough education we’re always at the whim of the translations we read and even if one believes that the originals were divinely written all bets are off with the translations. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/57 "2016-12-22T20:07:34Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > Ahh, her reaction to you calling her a snot. I dunno, I don’t find personal insult slinging as being extrapolating. They’re just insults and if you consider every insult an extrapolation ( which they actually are if you don’t know the person ) you’ve watered down the term to uselessness. No, her calling me stupid was not extrapolating. Her saying that Muslims would be lucky to survive Donald Trump’s concentration camp plans was extrapolating. That’s why I said, “Who’s extrapolating now, doofus?” I see that the discussion has moved on from this as I was typing this response. I’m glad of that. ---
**Author:** ![Debillw3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@Debillw3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debillw3)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/58 "2016-12-22T20:15:12Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > Unfortunately the same can be said about the New Testament here too. Without enough education we’re always at the whim of the translations we read and even if one believes that the originals were divinely written all bets are off with the translations. The problem is that even with enough education, that’s still the case. A word for word translation of these texts is impossible. Even in English, as we know and speak it, words can carry multiple definitions that have the same basis but overall different meanings. What results is a need for interpretation, based on what we believe that’s being said. In the cases of the likes of English, we’re either native speakers or surrounded by native speakers, so that interpretation is easy to come to consensus on (in many cases, we do it subconsciously). With classical languages, we don’t have that luxury. We’re left with a need to essentially guess about what’s being said, based on context and the historical customs with which we’re familiar. Even then, it’s not necessarily a guarantee that we’ll come to the same conclusion as anyone else. The one with which I’m most intimately familiar is from the Old Testament–my belief, as well as that of many scholars, is that Eve bit into a pomegranate, rather than an apple. Overall, it’s inconsequential, but, at the same time, it serves to highlight the issues that plague these texts. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/59 "2016-12-22T20:25:32Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > No, her calling me stupid was not extrapolating. Her saying that Muslims would be lucky to survive Donald Trump’s concentration camp plans was extrapolating. > > That’s why I said, “Who’s extrapolating now, doofus?” > > Yes, “Thank you for clarifying that.” would’ve been a smarter response, but then I’m a doofus so what do you expect? The timeline makes no sense. You’d said: > [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > More than one decade here tells me that there is no end to the bigottry and the ignorance, and I am not paid to be your educator. > > > > The Westerners give no fucks about the Muslim beliefs and there is not going to be any learning about them, if we avoid the fate of the European Jews, we will be lucky. It makes me sympathetic to the Israel aliya at one level. > > Who’s extrapolating now, doofus? This was two posts before I started replying this morning and far before her Trump post. Unless you’re Merlin or something I don’t get the timeline you want me to believe. Are you perhaps a psychic and knew she was going to make the Trump statement in the future? Then shouldn’t you have said “Who’s going to be extrapolating here in a little bit, doofus?” because that damned sure looks like you’re calling her a doofus about you know, the statement you were replying to. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308/60 "2016-12-22T20:28:37Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I see that the discussion has moved on from this as I was typing this response. I’m glad of that. You really can’t admit when you screw up can you? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jihadi-parents-sent-7-year-old-daughter-on-suicide-bombing-mission/775308.md?page=4)