# Jim Quinn: Slaves were better off than those on welfare **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 3, 2009, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645 "2009-01-03T00:03:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/21 "2009-01-03T14:47:17Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Sure, that’s saying that white people were better off when black people were slaves rather than on welfare. > > Which is more than gross; it’s horrific. And horrifically stupid. The idea as its put across suggests that slavery was somehow done for black’s benefit, just like welfare. They got so much free stuff, you see. Free clothes (made out of cotton that slaves grew and harvested), free food (that slaves grew and harvested), and free housing (constructed by slaves, made out of materials supplied and purchased by slave labor). So much free stuff. Those benevolent whites gave them so much free stuff I fail to see what the problem was, really. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/22 "2009-01-03T15:25:39Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > I know you all will love the opportunity to jump all over me again, but I am not reading this as his saying that slaves were better off than those on welfare. What I am seeing is that those on welfare are living in the same sort of poverty (supported by either the government or the owner) as slaves, but at least the slaves worked. I am reading this as him just saying that the slaves were a better bargain for the money. Which is gross, but totally different than slaves were better off than welfare people are now. Yeah, he’s not saying slaves were better off, he’s saying society was, because it got it’s money’s worth out of slaves. I don’t know a nasty enough word for this guy. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/23 "2009-01-03T15:38:03Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > And horrifically stupid. The idea as its put across suggests that slavery was somehow done for black’s benefit, just like welfare. They got so much free stuff, you see. Free clothes (made out of cotton that slaves grew and harvested), free food (that slaves grew and harvested), and free housing (constructed by slaves, made out of materials supplied and purchased by slave labor). So much free stuff. > > Those benevolent whites gave them so much free stuff I fail to see what the problem was, really. I read it more like Boyo Jim did. I don’t think the author can even pretend to give a rat’s ass about black people. He’s complaining that whites aren’t getting their money’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/24 "2009-01-03T17:14:43Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I read it more like Boyo Jim did. I don’t think the author can even pretend to give a rat’s ass about black people. He’s complaining that whites aren’t getting their money’s worth. Which grossly, intentionally ignores the reality that there are more white people benefitting from any and all entitlement programs both in raw numbers _and per capita_ than blacks or any other minority, while simultaneously, intentionally reinforcing the stereotypes of blacks where welfare is concerned. Quinn is nothing if not careful in how he crafts his particularly heinous lines of bullshit. He’s a troglodyte, but he’s a _calculating_ one. One the eve of the inauguration of our first black president, it’s not at all surprising that he’s attempting to sow seeds of racial disharmony. Not surprising one little bit. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/25 "2009-01-03T17:19:52Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Which grossly, intentionally ignores the reality that there are more white people benefitting from any and all entitlement programs both in raw numbers _and per capita_ than blacks or any other minority, while simultaneously, intentionally reinforcing the stereotypes of blacks where welfare is concerned. Yep. It’s calculated racism, and his fans will swallow it down like candy. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/26 "2009-01-03T17:24:36Z")
Sounds just like Barbara Bush [saying](http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/barbara2.asp) the poor blacks living in the Astrodome after Katrina were better off because they had been “underprivileged” back in New Orleans. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/27 "2009-01-03T17:50:06Z")
Using a distorted version of another poster’s username is childish to the point where it makes me ignore what else you’re saying. So, one more guy with a talk radio show who’s either a genuine idiot (like Sean Hannity) or says ridiculously stupid things just to get a reaction (like Rush Limbaugh). ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/28 "2009-01-03T17:55:00Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > And he credits the “eye-opening” he got about the evil liberal feminists who have made it impossible for a man to _say on the radio to an audience of tens of thousands that his co-worker had things tattooed on her scalp about her oral sex preferences_ for his current political beliefs. > > Jim Quinn is a douchebag. He was one when he hung out with an idiot called Banana, and he’s still one today. At least Don Jefferson (“Banana”) seems to have matured, somewhat, from what I’ve seen. > [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > I might add that Americans of the 1860s are not the same as they are today as well. No shit-what’s your point? I’d like to know where he got the part about “free money”? Since when did slaves get ANY money? Wouldn’t that make it, well, not slavery? ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/29 "2009-01-03T18:21:43Z")
How long has it been since Reagan died? How long has it been since his mental abilities have…uh…declined? Does anyone really still think that welfare in the U.S. is a racial issue? Hasn’t anyone realized that the vast majority of poor Americans (living under the “official” poverty line) are white? And that the vast majority of those on welfare are white? Something like 80%? Even if they wanted to, and even if it were possible, they couldn’t become slaves today simply because they’re not black. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/30 "2009-01-03T18:22:36Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Which grossly, intentionally ignores the reality that there are more white people benefitting from any and all entitlement programs both in raw numbers _ **and per capita** _ than blacks or any other minority, while simultaneously, intentionally reinforcing the stereotypes of blacks where welfare is concerned. Re the emphasized portion: the statement right before it is (just barely) true. The bolded portion isn’t, though: black Americans are just about 12% of the population but make up about 37% of the recipients of AFDC. Whites are a slightly larger proportion of the raw number of recipients (almost 39%), but that makes for a much lower per capita number when it’s considered that they are somewhere North of 70%-80% of the population as a whole. Cite: [People on welfare are usually black, teenage mothers who stay on ten years at a time](http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfareblack.htm) (not an official source, but it cites, seemingly reliably, to government stats, and is left-leaning so I figure unincentivized to fabricate to the detriment of the underprivileged). ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/31 "2009-01-03T19:31:58Z")
AFDC isn’t the only entitlement program. There are probably more whites taking advantage of other entitlement programs because they live longer. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/32 "2009-01-03T19:35:10Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > AFDC isn’t the only entitlement program. There are probably more whites taking advantage of other entitlement programs because they live longer. Some truth to that, but she said “any and all.” And Medicare, SS, and the like are a bit different to AFDC/WIC, etc. because there is some non-trivial user contribution. ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2009, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/33 "2009-01-03T20:09:47Z")
For the record, there is no AFDC any more, and hasn’t been in a dozen years. It was eliminated with the Welfare to Work program of the Clinton administration and cash payments to needy people are now coordinated under TANF. (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families.) ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/34 "2009-01-04T02:01:57Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Sure, that’s saying that white people were better off when black people were slaves rather than on welfare. Where did you get that? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/35 "2009-01-04T02:04:30Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Yeah, he’s not saying slaves were better off, he’s saying society was, because it got it’s money’s worth out of slaves. I don’t know a nasty enough word for this guy. I don’t know him at all, but from what I have read in this thread, I’m surprised he still has a job. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/36 "2009-01-04T02:21:15Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > I don’t know him at all, but from what I have read in this thread, I’m surprised he still has a job. Having read websites such as Free Republic and the like, I’m not. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/37 "2009-01-04T02:34:21Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Having read websites such as Free Republic and the like, I’m not. I probably don’t want to spend the time looking that up, do I? ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/38 "2009-01-04T03:00:36Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > Using a distorted version of another poster’s username is childish to the point where it makes me ignore what else you’re saying. Like we care what you think, BaldLoser. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/39 "2009-01-04T05:50:24Z")
Guy sounds like a grade one loser. This argument was previously made by insane philosopher George Fitzhugh back before the War of Southern Treason. [George Fitzhugh - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Fitzhugh) Fitzhugh argued that slavery was better for all “lesser” people regardless of skin color because they had someone to take care of them. Alas, that some people who are nominally “American” put so little value on freedom. The problem isn’t that blacks, Jews, Catholics, Latinos, whitey, Asians or others are stabbing us in the back or taking all the jobs or whatever. The problem is that the human condition is an interesting proposition in interesting times. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2009, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645/40 "2009-01-04T06:06:20Z")
Slavery was definitely superior to… well, in most cases… death. That’s about it. You could argue that in terms of diet, housing, and life expectancy slaves had standards of living that were no worse than many poor white farmers, factory workers, or their ancestors/relatives in Africa, etc. (i.e. like the medievalist once said “life was brutal, nasty, and short” all over if you weren’t rich and starvation always loomed) and some evidence in some places would actually bear you out. Pity those little things like the knowledge those you loved most could (and at least some probably would) be sold away from you, or that while your master probably _wouldn’t_ beat you to death or until you’re permanently disabled he _could_ with complete impunity, or the knowledge that the correct response to “take a walk while I fuck your 13 year old daughter” is “Yassuh, will do, and might I say I love that hat you wearin” are so perceived as drawbacks by some without any regard for cultural context. What I wonder most when I read comments like these is do the assholes themselves believe them (i.e. are they really that ignorant/evil/apathetic to suffering/clueless/simplistic/socially retarded/etc.) or are they just amoral and willing to say anything to get print and money? Which is what I wonder second-most, which is how in the hell do these people convert the ability to say stupid mean hateful idiotic things into money? Because, obviously, they do. (Must admit I’m not terribly sure who Jim Quinn is- I know the name but that’s about it and I haven’t wiki’d him- but I’m guessing he’s not the current Lincoln scholar in residence at Urbana-Champaign). [QUOTE=Second Stone] This argument was previously made by insane philosopher George Fitzhugh back before the War of Southern Treason. [/QUOTE] Which came about 80 years after the end of The War of North American Treason IIRC. _Dixiephrenia- she is a bitch._ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jim-quinn-slaves-were-better-off-than-those-on-welfare/479645.md?page=3)