# Jimmy Carter: Basic requirements for a fair election are missing in Florida **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 28, 2004, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519 "2004-09-28T17:24:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/21 "2004-09-28T20:59:44Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Camp David Accords. Panama Canal Treaty. Habitat for Humanity. 1993 treaty with North Korea. The Iran hostage crisis. Stagflation. His response to the energy crisis, which was to put on a sweater. Although the Camp David accords were an achievement, as was the boycott of the Olympics. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > Perhaps, if he had been reelected-September 11 would never have happened. No one to step up arming those who would become the Taliban in Afghanistan. No Iran-Contra. No Gulf War and Saddam Hussein. Pardon me while I wet myself laughing. Do I, a Republican, need to remind you that Osama bin Laden is Saudi, not Afghani? And I rather doubt that, if the Soviets had no fear of invading Afghanistan while Carter was dithering about in the White House, that Saddam would pay all that much attention to him either. Especially not a decade later. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/22 "2004-09-28T21:01:44Z")
The problem in '00 in Florida was simply a matter of an election being too close to call. I’m not sure the same situation wouldn’t have happened in other states, had they been that close. Florida has had plenty of fair elections in the past with exactly the “problems” that Carter is pointing out. Just MHO, but I’m going to go out on a limb here and predict that Florida will not be an issue in the election this year. If there are issues, they’ll be something we hadn’t thouight about yet. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/23 "2004-09-28T21:15:27Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Pardon me while I wet myself laughing. Do I, a Republican, need to remind you that Osama bin Laden is Saudi, not Afghani? I’m not going to say I think that Al Qaeda wouldn’t have happened, but even you, a Republican, know that bin Laden developed his philosophy and built his movement in Afghanistan based on the financial and military support given to the Mujihideen, who came from a variety of countries. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/24 "2004-09-28T21:28:44Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > The problem in '00 in Florida was simply a matter of an election being too close to call. I’m not sure the same situation wouldn’t have happened in other states, had they been that close. You are ignoring the Republican dirty tricks of Florida in 2000, such as the purge of “felons” from the rolls. If the election had been run honestly, Gore would have won by a solid margin. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/25 "2004-09-28T21:39:42Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > You are ignoring the Republican dirty tricks of Florida in 2000, such as the purge of “felons” from the rolls. If the election had been run honestly, Gore would have won by a solid margin. Exactly how many convictions were there for these alleged dirty tricks? IIRC, none. ---
**Author:** ![mks57](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@mks57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mks57)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/26 "2004-09-28T21:41:06Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > You are ignoring the Republican dirty tricks of Florida in 2000, such as the purge of “felons” from the rolls. If the election had been run honestly, Gore would have won by a solid margin. I suspect that if the voter rolls had been purged of felons, aliens and other ineligible voters, Bush would have won by a solid margin. Why does the Democratic Party oppose any attempts to clean up the voter rolls? Why were they such enthusiastic supporters of the “Motor Voter” law, that helped get us in this mess? Why do they oppose any efforts to verify the identity of voters? Simple self-interest. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/27 "2004-09-28T21:44:07Z")
**Shodan:** \*For heaven’s sake, this is the guy who came within a whisker of being beat by Jerry Ford after Ford pardoned Nixon. \* Er, speaking of Ford, you did notice this part of the OP’s link, didn’t you? > [@](#): > > After the debacle in Florida four years ago, former president Gerald Ford and I were asked to lead a blue-ribbon commission to recommend changes in the American electoral process. After months of concerted effort by a dedicated and bipartisan group of experts, we presented unanimous recommendations to the president and Congress. In other words, the original diagnosis of the electoral problems was made by a bipartisan commission led by Carter **and** Ford. I don’t see how you can shrug off those findings by dismissing Carter as an “incompetent dolt”. All Carter is doing **now** is pointing out that many of the recommendations that he and Ford and the other commission members made, and that the government mandated in 2002, have not been implemented in Florida. What grounds do you have for rejecting that claim, **besides** what appears to be your knee-jerk contempt for Carter? After all, it seems like a pretty simple assertion of fact—either the mandated changes **have** been properly implemented in Florida or they have not. Since you apparently disagree with Carter’s assessment, could you tell us what your reasons are for believing that Florida has adequately met the provisions of the “Help America Vote” Act? Just saying that you’ll say the opposite of whatever Carter’s saying because you think he’s an incompetent dolt doesn’t cut it. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/28 "2004-09-28T21:47:28Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I DO think there will be a ‘fair’ election in Florida. Most of my qualifiers boil down to ‘fair’ being equal to ‘as fair as in any other state in the Union, within a certain small margin’. Understand that election shanagans have been going on in the US for ever, and neither sides hands are clean. “As fair as any other state in the union” isn’t a great standard for me. Things are bad, but they’re bad everywhere just sucks. Although I’m sure neither sides’ hands are clean, the Republicans’ are a lot dirtier. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/29 "2004-09-28T21:49:46Z")
> [@mks57](#): > > I suspect that if the voter rolls had been purged of felons, aliens and other ineligible voters, Bush would have won by a solid margin. Why does the Democratic Party oppose any attempts to clean up the voter rolls? Why were they such enthusiastic supporters of the “Motor Voter” law, that helped get us in this mess? Why do they oppose any efforts to verify the identity of voters? Simple self-interest. You know why **BrainGlutton** put “felons” in quotes, don’t you? ---
**Author:** ![mks57](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@mks57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mks57)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/30 "2004-09-28T21:58:41Z")
> [@bup](#): > > You know why **BrainGlutton** put “felons” in quotes, don’t you? Yes, and I don’t care if they are white, brown, black, or green with orange polka-dots. If they are ineligible to vote, they shouldn’t be on the state’s voter rolls. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/31 "2004-09-28T22:01:06Z")
> [@mks57](#): > > I suspect that if the voter rolls had been purged of felons, aliens and other ineligible voters, Bush would have won by a solid margin. Why does the Democratic Party oppose any attempts to clean up the voter rolls? Why were they such enthusiastic supporters of the “Motor Voter” law, that helped get us in this mess? Why do they oppose any efforts to verify the identity of voters? Simple self-interest. :rolleyes: Did you pay any attention at all to the coverage of that story? Or the several GD threads in which we’ve discussed it? (See [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=265501](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=265501) and [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268623.)](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268623.)) The rolls **were** purged in 2000, but thousands of those purged were **not** convicted felons but legally eligible voters who were included on the “felons list” by mistake – e.g., because they happened to have a similar name to a felon. Some were persons who had been convicted of a felony in another state but who had had their rights restored in that state. And none of them were informed about their “ineligible status” until election day, when it was too late to do anything about it. And apparently, most of them are **still off the rolls and still can’t vote.** That’s what Palast said today; I haven’t checked up on it. If those mostly African-American voters had not been improperly and unlawfully denied their right to vote, Gore, not Bush, would have won Florida by a comfortable margin. This ain’t all in the past, either. It’s only a month since the Florida Department of Law Enforcement sent state police into the homes of black get-out-the-vote organizers in Orlando in an alleged “voter fraud” investigation, the nature of which the FDLE refused to disclose. See [Opinion: Suppress the Vote? - DER SPIEGEL](http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,313458,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/32 "2004-09-28T22:54:46Z")
The Florida Department of Corrections [settled a lawsuit](http://www.aclufl.org/news_events/archive/2003/fcbslfinalorder072503.cfm) about not properly reinstating eligible voters, and admitted its failure to perform its obligations in that regard: > [@](#): > > During the course of the lawsuit, the Department of Corrections (DOC) acknowledged that 124,769 offenders who were released between 1992 and 2001 did not receive assistance pursuant to Florida Statute § 944.293, which requires that the department assist inmates who are about to be released from custody or supervision with the application for restoration of civil rights. In other words, **mks:** we’re talking here about people who **were** eligible to vote but were misidentified on the voter rolls as ineligible (or, in the case above, should have been reinstated as eligible but weren’t). ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/33 "2004-09-28T23:03:40Z")
Once upon a time there were two strong political parties in America which, each in its own way, stood for what makes this country strong and free. Once I was proud to be an upstate New York Republican. It’s simply amazing to me that the G.O.P. has largely turned into a group of self-righteous “protectors of America” who, like the infamous commander in Vietnam said of a village, are out to destroy our freedom in order to protect our freedom. **Shodan** and others, I do not much care what your opinion of Jimmy Carter may be – the issue at hand is whether Florida (and other states) have implemented protections against the problems that were unquestionably encountered there. And according to a **bipartisan** commission for which Carter is speaking, they have not. As for purging the voter rolls of felons, if Florida is determined to continue disenfranchising felons who have served out their sentence, then they have the right to do so – fairly, not selectively, not ensuring (as was done) that the majority of felons wiped from the rolls are Democrats, and that Democrats who happen to have the same name as felons have their franchise removed. Corruption is corruption, no matter what the party affiliation. And if party loyalty blinds you to that, then I truly pity you – because you have lost sight of what it means to be an American. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/34 "2004-09-28T23:08:22Z")
Time’s running out, but the good fight is still being fought! Here’s an update from today’s (September 28, 2004) _Tampa Tribune_ – : > [@](#): > > TALLAHASSEE - A federal appeals court in Atlanta on Monday revived a lawsuit by a Democratic congressman calling for a paper trail of Florida’s touch-screen votes. > > The Florida secretary of state’s office, meanwhile, reiterated in a separate case that paper receipts ``will not be part of the solution’’ to manually recounting electronic votes in the Nov. 2 election. > > In April, Secretary of State Glenda Hood prohibited manual recounts of undervotes and overvotes on touch-screen systems, saying the machines are incapable of misinterpreting voter intent. The ruling was challenged by a coalition of voters’ rights advocates. > > In August, an administrative law judge said Hood lacked the authority to prohibit manual recounts. Hood decided Monday against appealing that case. > > Jenny Nash, a spokeswoman in the secretary of state’s office, said new orders to county elections supervisors would be ready by Nov. 2. > > `We will take into consideration the guidance the judge gave us,'' Nash said. No voting machine vendor has submitted for certification a system that can provide voter-verifiable receipts, she said, so `that will not be part of the solution.’’ > > Ben Wilcox, head of Common Cause Florida, said the secretary of state’s stance ``baffles me.’’ > > ``I don’t understand how they think they can comply with the ruling without requiring some sort of paper ballot that could be recounted,’’ Wilcox said. > > Meanwhile, the 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Atlanta revived a lawsuit filed by U.S. Rep. Robert Wexler, D-Boca Raton, calling for printed records of touch-screen machines. The suit claims touch- screen voters would be denied due process should a recount be necessary. > > A South Florida judge threw out Wexler’s suit on procedural grounds, but on Monday the appeals court ordered the Florida judge to take up the case. And from the same edition – [http://tampatrib.com/News/MGB7GWHKNZD.html:](http://tampatrib.com/News/MGB7GWHKNZD.html:) > [@](#): > > TAMPA - Hillsborough County’s touch-screen voting system could be vulnerable to fraud because it relies on common software that security experts warn can be used to manipulate vote totals without leaving a trace. > The risk was discovered last week during a demonstration of the $13 million voting system conducted for The Tampa Tribune. > > Computers used by Hillsborough elections officials to retrieve vote totals registered in the touch-screen machines are equipped with the popular Microsoft Office Suite software package, which includes the Excel spreadsheet and Access database programs. Office Suite uses the same format as the touch-screen system’s tabulation software, according to security experts, and could allow vote totals to be altered without producing an electronic entry on the system’s activity log. > > **Security Procedures Vary** > > The patchwork of resulting procedures for protecting the integrity of touch-screen systems is evident in the three counties using the touch- screen system in the Tampa Bay area: > > Pasco County, aware of the software warnings, operates its computers without the standard-issue Microsoft Office package; Pinellas County uses the Microsoft software but has a mechanism to prevent the information from being altered by it; Hillsborough County Supervisor of Elections Buddy Johnson said he was unaware of the concern. > > A spokeswoman for Secretary of State Glenda Hood, whose office is responsible for certifying the security of voting systems before they are used, said the ``local supervisors then have the responsibility to make the decisions on how their systems are configured.’’ > > The spokeswoman, Jenny Nash, said proprietary agreements with voting machine makers prevent her from discussing whether state-certified systems contain Microsoft Office Suite. > > Hillsborough County’s touch-screen machines were built by Oakland, Calif.-based Sequoia Voting Systems. A company spokeswoman said it advises its customers to make sure only the software that comes with the voting machines is used to tabulate results. The manufacturer of the other type of touch-screen machines being used in Florida, Omaha-based Election Systems and Software Inc., provides the same advice to its customers. > > \*\*No Way To Track Fraud\*\* University of Iowa computer science Professor Douglas W. Jones, who advised Miami- Dade and is a national expert on touch-screen voting security issues, said he recommends counties use a video projector to provide a live display of the computer screens the night of the election so tabulation can be more closely monitored. > > ``Watching people at computers doing computer things is not always informative. We should see what they are doing up close. We should ask them for explanations for what they are doing,’’ Jones said. > > Jones said Hillsborough’s use of Microsoft Office Suite is especially troublesome because, unlike other opportunities for fraud, it leaves no entry on the Sequoia vote tabulation software’s activity log. > > ``As long as you are using the Sequoia management system, it contains a nice log of who has done what, when, but if you shut it down and use one of those database tools, there won’t be a record in the change log,’’ Jones said. > > ``In the event of a recount, in the event of an audit, there will be no record of 20 funny votes being added to Candidate X’s tally, if that’s what happens.’’ > > Additionally, it is unlikely the standard audit procedures in Hillsborough County would trigger closer inspection because votes could be swapped from one candidate to another without a trace. The audit compares signature logs from the polling place to determine that the total number of votes counted matches the total number of voters casting electronic ballots. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/35 "2004-09-28T23:09:09Z")
The first Presidential ballot I was old enough to cast was for Carter in 1980. Too bad he inherited an economic disaster in the aftermath of Vietnam, but he was making progress with the kind of austere budgetary measures that Republicans supposedly favor but never actually enact. What a surprise that Florida is still a mess. One thing I never understood was how it was possible for the Secretary of State, Florida’s chief election officer, to at the same time be an active participant in the campaign of one of the two main candidates. How in the world can that be legal? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/36 "2004-09-28T23:12:13Z")
**Poly:** \* the issue at hand is whether Florida (and other states) have implemented protections against the problems that were unquestionably encountered there. And according to a bipartisan commission for which Carter is speaking, they have not.\* Nitpick—AFAICT, the bipartisan commission recommended the protections, the “Help America Vote” Act made them legally required, and it’s Carter (along with other commentators) who’s saying that the protections haven’t been properly implemented. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/37 "2004-09-28T23:25:58Z")
I find it interesting that the folks taking potshots at Mr. Carter (a) don’t bother to refute the allegations he raise, and (b) tend to be big supporters of Ronald Reagan, who sanctioned nun-raping priest-murdering thugs in Central America during _his_ tenure in office. ---
**Author:** ![rfgdxm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c0e974/32.png) [@rfgdxm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rfgdxm)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2004, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/38 "2004-09-28T23:38:31Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I find it interesting that the folks taking potshots at Mr. Carter (a) don’t bother to refute the allegations he raise, and (b) tend to be big supporters of Ronald Reagan, who sanctioned nun-raping priest-murdering thugs in Central America during _his_ tenure in office. Note that Ford is also involved in this. The idea of fair elections is non-partisan. Heck, one thing that has hurt Bush is that there has been a cloud over whether he really won Florida. ---
**Author:** ![jshore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b5e925/32.png) [@jshore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jshore)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2004, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/39 "2004-09-29T00:15:08Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Exactly how many convictions were there for these alleged dirty tricks? IIRC, none. No convictions as far as I know…But, there was a [lawsuit settled out of court](http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/09/04/politics/main520754.shtml): > [@](#): > > Florida’s top elections officials and a leading U.S. civil rights group said on Tuesday they had settled a lawsuit that alleged Florida systematically excluded thousands of minority voters from the 2000 presidential election. > > The class-action lawsuit, filed in January 2001 after George W. Bush claimed the U.S. presidency by just 537 Florida votes, alleged election officials systematically kept blacks away from voting booths by illegally dropping them from voter rolls, improperly handling their registrations so they did not appear on voter lists or by simply turning them away from polling places. > > … > > “The most significant part of the settlement is how the central voter database will be set up, restoring to the rolls the people who were wrongfully purged,” said Anita Hodgkiss, a plaintiffs’ attorney with the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights. > > … > > The settlement will help restore voters improperly purged from voter lists, improve voter registration methods and help fix communication problems at polling stations. > > Although the agreement effectively ended the litigation, Hodgkiss said the plaintiffs would be carefully monitoring future elections to make sure elections officials were abiding by it. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > The rolls were purged in 2000, but thousands of those purged were not convicted felons but legally eligible voters who were included on the “felons list” by mistake – e.g., because they happened to have a similar name to a felon. It is worth noting other interesting facts that Palast alleges and, to my knowledge, have not been refuted: (1) Not only were thousand purged but the percentage who were on the lists erroneously was phenomenally high…I seem to recall Palast finding the error rate on the order of 80-90%. (2) The company who produced this list was hired to replace another company, was paid a phenomenal amount by industry standards for the amount of work that they did and warned the state that the list had to be verified. The state decided to skip the verification step. It is hard to read all these facts taken together as being merely incompetence. There are lots of other fun things you can read about the whole debacle at [Palast’s website](http://www.gregpalast.com/contents.htm). (Click on the Chapter 1 link.) ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2004, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519/40 "2004-09-29T00:19:40Z")
According to an Associated Press article by Erica Werner, a group of international observers from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, a 55 state nation group that was **invited by the Bush Administration** , election problems may again delay the outcome past November 2. Problems include voter registration lists, provisional and absentee ballots, allegations of voter intimidation, equipment changes and slow implementation of the Help America Vote Act. This report was released today. [http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040928/ap\_on\_el\_pr/election\_observers](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040928/ap_on_el_pr/election_observers) “In general, the nationwide replacement of voting equipment, inspired by the disputes witnessed during the 2000 elections, primarily in Florida, may potentially become a source of even greater controversy during the forthcoming elections,” said the 11-page report. Many of the new touch-screen machines that will be used by up to 50 million voters on Nov. 2 do not produce the paper ballots needed for a manual recount of votes, the report said. This “may cause postelection disputes and litigation, potentially delaying the announcement of final results,” it said. The OSCE (news - web sites) observers were in the United States from Sept. 7-10. A larger group will return for the election and focus on the potential problems noted in Tuesday’s report. Among them: Slow implementation of the Help America Vote Act of 2002, which authorized $3.86 billion to replace outdated machines and reform election procedures. \_Poorly maintained voter registration lists and a hodgepodge of procedures for handling absentee and provisional ballots could result in voter disenfranchisement and postelection litigation. Provisional ballots are a new feature, meant to allow anyone who shows up at the polls to vote even if their name isn’t on precinct lists. \_The report criticized steps by states to allow military and overseas voters to fax rather than mail their completed ballots, calling them inconsistent “with the principle of the secrecy of the vote.” \_The observers said the scale of complaints about intimidation of minority voters was difficult to assess but that “such allegations were repeated by Democratic Party representatives, while the Republican Party officials did not seem to share these concerns.” [/quote] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jimmy-carter-basic-requirements-for-a-fair-election-are-missing-in-florida/266519.md?page=3)