# Joe Arpaio's trial starts today **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 26, 2017, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923 "2017-06-26T16:08:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/101 "2017-08-26T03:02:21Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Of course that vote will probably be suppressed or thrown out for a while. > > I think I’ve said it before: a majority of white America will have to reject the GOP/fascism/ conservatism. Uh, I think that here you do forget that Arizona voted the scumbag Arpaio out of office. It seems to me that people eventually did learn that they must stop supporting a yahoo’s stupid authoritarian and wasteful act. They failed of course to understand that Trump was of the same mold and the state voted for Trump; but then again, people that did learn that Arpaio needed to go are more likely to learn that Trump also needs to go. And if the GOP will not bother, then to hell with them. We must then throw all the rascals out in the next elections. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/102 "2017-08-26T03:04:46Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Does this pardon set up the precedent that the president of the United States can act above the Constitution? I mean, can a Democratic president encourage law enforcement to confiscate guns under cover of pardon? No. Because the concern would be civil suits against the law enforcement officers rather than criminal sanctions. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/103 "2017-08-26T03:06:12Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > But the presidential pardon requires a confession of guilt. He just declared that he’s not guilty. Can he go into a court and say he’s guilty to get his pardon if he just declared on twitter that he’s not guilty? Using the pardon is an admission of guilt, but there is no separate confession required, and there is no means for a court to reject a pardon because it doesn’t believe that the pardoned person really truly believes in their heart that they are guilty. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/104 "2017-08-26T03:10:10Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Has anyone ever been pardoned for contempt of court before? That seems pretty damn unusual, since it’s a crime specifically about the authority of courts. “It is the general policy of the Department of Justice not to process applications for pardon of federal misdemeanor convictions, since most civil disabilities imposed as the result of a federal conviction are triggered by conviction for a felony offense rather than a misdemeanor crime.” I could be wrong, and would welcome the correction, but I’ve heard this is the first presidential pardon of a misdemeanor. Throw that on top of the steaming pile of “Go ahead and ignore federal court decisions” that this implies, and you’ve got a gigantic, entirely self-inflicted mess. It takes a special kind of stupid to think this is a good idea, but again, it’s Trump. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/105 "2017-08-26T03:10:24Z")
A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/106 "2017-08-26T03:12:32Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. 3/10. ---
**Author:** ![ataraxy22](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ataraxy22/32/307_2.png) [@ataraxy22](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ataraxy22)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/107 "2017-08-26T03:16:17Z")
Hopefully he will be subject to myriad civil suits til the end of his days, which hopefully will be soon. Disgusted beyond comprehension tonight. I wish I were dead rather than have to live in this country in 2017. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/108 "2017-08-26T03:17:20Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. You forgot your /s. If you didn’t, then may your next sheriff follow in Arpaio’s footsteps. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/109 "2017-08-26T03:22:12Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? No, you certified idiot, as per his age he was bound to get probation. The point was still valid. No one should be above the law and his conviction was one of the big factors that made him lose his election. > [@aldiboronti](#): > > The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. It is only good for idiots that ignore what was going on under the mishandling of Joe Arpaio. > **[Maricopa County to Pay $3.5 Million for Botched Sheriff's Office Rape...](https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/maricopa-county-to-pay-35-million-for-botched-sheriffs-office-rape-investigation-7287590)** > > Maricopa County will pay $3.5 million for one of Sheriff Joe Arpaio's mishandled rape investigations. The county Board of Supervisors voted 5-0 on Wednesday to approve the settlement for a Valley family who sued in Superior Court over the botched... > [@](#): > > Hundreds of poorly investigated cases came from the small, west-side town of El Mirage, which had been policed by the Sheriff’s Office from 2005 to 2007 following problems with the town’s police force. Deputy Chief Frank Munnell detailed the scandal in his 63-page memo to Sheriff Arpaio that contained a litany of complaints. The office re-opened numerous cases, finding that more than 500 had been mishandled. While some of the sexual-assault reports were likely invalid, many weren’t. The news media, including New Times, found several disturbing cases in which apparently legitimate rape accusations were pushed to the side by a staff overloaded with work that, in retrospect, seems trivial. > > In 2012, the U.S. Department of Justice tied the scandal to the systemic discrimination of Hispanics going on in the department. > > “Faced with such an increase in crime and the risk of harm presented by unaddressed sexual assaults, a law enforcement agency ordinarily would be expected to prioritize more serious offenses, such as crimes of sexual violence, over less serious offenses, such as low-level immigration offenses,” the Justice Department’s May 2012 report on the MCSO states. By the way, I do see also the same misogyny of Trump with what Arpaio was doing by ignoring what women that were raped were going trough when seeking justice under Arpaio. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/110 "2017-08-26T03:46:21Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. I hope you never get laid. You are so fucking stupid your genes need to be removed from the pool forever. ---
**Author:** ![ataraxy22](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ataraxy22/32/307_2.png) [@ataraxy22](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ataraxy22)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/111 "2017-08-26T04:22:11Z")
Fuck the 85 year old. Hopeful he will die soon. Why do evil people live so long? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/112 "2017-08-26T04:25:22Z")
Just another example of how Republicans are soft on crime. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/113 "2017-08-26T04:32:43Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. I’d agree with this if the President had waited for sentence to be imposed and then, if that sentence included jail, commuted that sentence. This would had served the worthy goal you mention - not imprisoning an 85 year old. And it also would have recognized that the guy was found guilty because the facts supported that finding, and left his conviction undisturbed. But this outcome, no. Sorry. I don’t share your reaction. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/114 "2017-08-26T04:57:49Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > A pardon was the right thing to do. The guy is 85 years old for God’s sake.Are his political opponents really eager to see him in prison, someone who served his country in the military, who has done nothing but try to keep the US border secure? The way some Democrats are baying for his blood one would think him a murderer at the very least. His offense was simply contempt of a politically-motivated court. Many on the left have praised such contempt to the skies when it is practised for their ideals. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Oh look, the stupid piece of shit troll acts like a dumb asshole. Must be a day that ends in y. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/115 "2017-08-26T05:04:03Z")
So let me see if I understand this: the POTUS just invoked the law to pardon a guy who was convicted of ignoring the law that said guy had sworn to uphold, in direct contravention to directives lawfully issued to him by another member of the law enforcement community. And I’m supposed to respect the POTUS’s invocation of the law to pardon the guy who was convicted of ignoring the law, because that guy did such a good job of upholding the law (which a court convicted him for not upholding). This isn’t justice. And this won’t go unnoticed. In fact, it’s further evidence to the American populace that the justice system is rigged and illegitimate. I can’t wait to see how this affects future police-citizen interactions and attitudes! ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/116 "2017-08-26T05:26:33Z")
This goes way beyond Arpaio. If the president feels that he can pardon anyone who defies a federal court order then we have a serious situation. I hope that the Republicans in Congress will see that and will look beyond their own reelection prospects. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/117 "2017-08-26T05:49:04Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > This goes way beyond Arpaio. If the president feels that he can pardon anyone who defies a federal court order then we have a serious situation. I hope that the Republicans in Congress will see that and will look beyond their own reelection prospects. More likely is that they hope that the hurricane issue will allow the Republicans in congress to once again normalize the Cheeto in chief. Let’s face it, we need to throw all the rascals out when they continue to see no evil, hear no evil and _tweak_ evil… ---
**Author:** ![CoastalMaineiac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e8c25b/32.png) [@CoastalMaineiac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CoastalMaineiac)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/118 "2017-08-26T05:52:29Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > This goes way beyond Arpaio. If the president feels that he can pardon anyone who defies a federal court order then we have a serious situation. I hope that the Republicans in Congress will see that and will look beyond their own reelection prospects. I was actually quite flabbergasted that he pardoned him, as I was under the impression that one could not be pardoned for contempt of court by the president, since it is an offense against that specific court, and not an “offense against the United States,” which is what the POTUS has the power to pardon. Will anyone try to challenge this in court? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/119 "2017-08-26T05:59:23Z")
> [@CoastalMaineiac](#): > > I was actually quite flabbergasted that he pardoned him, as I was under the impression that one could not be pardoned for contempt of court by the president, since it is an offense against that specific court, and not an “offense against the United States,” which is what the POTUS has the power to pardon. Will anyone try to challenge this in court? As one has to find the party that suffers in this case it could be the judges that had to go trough the Arpaio gauntlet, but AFAIK it is not likely to get challenged. In another item I don’t know if his pardon included his clear attempt at subverting justice when he self attempted to get a mistrial by investigating (or by claiming in the witness stage to investigate) the wife of the judge in his court case. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923/120 "2017-08-26T06:23:42Z")
> [@CoastalMaineiac](#): > > I was actually quite flabbergasted that he pardoned him, as I was under the impression that one could not be pardoned for contempt of court by the president, since it is an offense against that specific court, and not an “offense against the United States,” which is what the POTUS has the power to pardon. Will anyone try to challenge this in court? This was a criminal contempt charge. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joe-arpaios-trial-starts-today/789923.md?page=7)