# Joel Stein and the Cauldron of Mediocrity (a Harry Potter related pitting... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 12, 2005, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248 "2005-07-12T23:46:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2005, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/101 "2005-07-20T23:13:37Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > No, no - the joke was that anybody who read both _Harry Potter_ and _Ulysses_ was most likely a 40 year-old virgin. Why 40-years old, and why a virgin? I find nothing about either of those books that suggests a reader has to be over 39 and can’t have enjoyed a sexual relationship. I also don’t see a joke, since “the presence of humor,” is an essential criteria to the joke-like nature of a comment. I just see a really, really dumb ad hominem attack from someone with absolutely no other argument for a really week position. Even in the admittedly low standards of the pit, “oh yeah, well I bet you’re a virgin” has to be of the most insipid and juvenile comebacks possible. I’m fully prepared to say, “so’s your mama!” with all entailing logical paradoxes. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/102 "2005-07-21T01:20:50Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Why 40-years old, and why a virgin? I find nothing about either of those books that suggests a reader has to be over 39 and can’t have enjoyed a sexual relationship. I also don’t see a joke, since “the presence of humor,” is an essential criteria to the joke-like nature of a comment. I just see a really, really dumb ad hominem attack from someone with absolutely no other argument for a really week position. Even in the admittedly low standards of the pit, “oh yeah, well I bet you’re a virgin” has to be of the most insipid and juvenile comebacks possible. I’m fully prepared to say, “so’s your mama!” with all entailing logical paradoxes. Jesus. Because the movie’s actually called _40 Year-Old Virgin_, that’s why. And because HP and Ulysses are both geeky in their own ways, and combining the two = twice the geek. You’re right, it isn’t funny, especially when it has to be explained twice. Maybe I should have prefaced it with the remark that I’ve read _Ulysses_, too, so you wouldn’t have taken it so personally. Now you know. And maybe now you can stop being such a fucking pussy about it. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/103 "2005-07-21T02:34:38Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Jesus. Because the movie’s actually called _40 Year-Old Virgin_, that’s why. Well, good luck with your autobiography. > [@](#): > > And maybe now you can stop being such a fucking pussy about it. Just because somebody calls you out for being a prat doesn’t make them a sexually active feline, any more than reading a book now and then makes them a sexually inexperienced quadragenarian. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/104 "2005-07-21T03:33:20Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Well, good luck with your autobiography. Come now. Certainly someone so well-versed in the brilliant and original works of Rowling can come up with a wittier comeback than this. > [@cricetus](#): > > Just because somebody calls you out for being a prat doesn’t make them a sexually active feline, any more than reading a book now and then makes them a sexually inexperienced quadragenarian. First of all, I thought the definition of “prat” was “someone who doesn’t hail from the UK who uses the word ‘prat’”. Secondly, make up your mind. First you get offended because you think I’m accusing you of being a virgin, then it’s because I infer that you’re a sexually active feline. There’s no winning with you, it seems. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/105 "2005-07-21T03:48:52Z")
Ah, I’m not offended. I was just winding you up. I don’t have a dog in this fight. I do like the def. of prat, which I will use at the first opportunity. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/106 "2005-07-21T03:53:49Z")
> **[The 40-Year-Old Virgin (2005) - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405422/)** > > The 40-Year-Old Virgin: Directed by Judd Apatow. With Steve Carell, Catherine Keener, Paul Rudd, Romany Malco. Goaded by his buddies, a nerdy guy who's never "done the deed" only finds the pressure mounting when he meets a single mother. The movie. Steve Carell! ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/107 "2005-07-21T04:21:16Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Ah, I’m not offended. I was just winding you up. I don’t have a dog in this fight. Yeah, same here. It’s a nice release sometimes - keeps you from slapping your boss across the face or something. No personal offense intended, as I’ve always, IIRC, enjoyed your posts. > [@E-Sabbath](#): > > [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405422/](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405422/) > > The movie. Steve Carell! Yeah, written by him and Judd Apatow, too. Might actually be much better than it appears. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/108 "2005-07-21T04:23:19Z")
Anything with Catherine Keener goes in my netflix queue. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/109 "2005-07-21T04:24:56Z")
Oh, and the guy from the American “The Office.” I didn’t recognize him. Interesting cast. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Highwayman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@The\_Highwayman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Highwayman)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/110 "2005-07-21T08:43:44Z")
This is interesting but I have to once again call foul on the use of the works of Joyce as some sort of example of bad literature. _Ulysses_, which I have read as well as many of you, is a masterpiece of Literature. Granted that it is hard to read but a masterful work nonetheless. Please don’t let this argument be about misunderstanding the art. I’m sure you are aware of all the bellyaching about artists such as Jackson Pollack not really producing art. It is the means by which they express their art that makes it such. With our example, Pollack transferred energy and rhythm onto the canvas without relying on form. Many artists felt that the camera had trumped them when it came to depicting form and so new means of expression were sought. Jackson’s art also had the appeal of being _Avant Garde_ or something never seen before. A great artist is able to communicate that they understand mainstream art, like Picasso before Cubism, but choose a new means of expressing it. So Joyce, with _Portrait of an Artist as a Young Man_, shows that he is master at less original forms of prose but then totally blows our minds with the stream of consciousness of Ulysses. In the 30’s this was revolutionary stuff. I will admit that _Finnegan’s Wake_ is a bit over the top and somewhat incomprehensible but it still is a masterpiece of Literature. I read it and after a month of reading, I was half way through and couldn’t even explain anything of the plot. I’m sure however, that it has merit. Now juxtapose the works of[Pollack](http://www.artcyclopedia.com/artists/pollock_jackson.html) with those of [Thomas Kinkaid](http://www.thomaskinkade.com/magi/servlet/com.asucon.ebiz.home.web.tk.HomeServlet) , “Painter of Light,” that most people think is art. You begin to understand the relationship of Joyce to Rowling. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/111 "2005-07-21T12:20:05Z")
> [@The Highwayman](#): > > This is interesting but I have to once again call foul on the use of the works of Joyce as some sort of example of bad literature. Nobody did that. ---
**Author:** ![beergeek279](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@beergeek279](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beergeek279)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2005, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248/112 "2005-07-21T23:44:51Z")
> [@Green Bean](#): > > Did you explode? Ahh, I guess that fate was saved for poor Mikey, I suppose. I do have to say that they did tend to tingle the dental work that I had a lot less of when I was a lot younger 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/joel-stein-and-the-cauldron-of-mediocrity-a-harry-potter-related-pitting/312248.md?page=5)