# John Carter is not the biggest box office bomb of all time **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 25, 2012, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741 "2012-03-25T05:09:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/21 "2012-03-25T21:44:57Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > That means **Hunger Games** needs $875 million worldwide ($250M production + $100M marketing times 2.5). That would be 25th all time. Hunger Games needs only $445 million ($78M production + $100M marketing times 2.5). Which of these is more likely? I think you mean **John Carter** there, right? ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/22 "2012-03-25T21:53:06Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > That used to be true, but I think I read recently that those rules have changed, because theatrical runs are so short these days. I wonder if this run will be as short as your average “flop”, though. I saw it this weekend in 3-D and there were almost a couple dozen people in it still. That’s a couple hundred bucks per showing which is better than most movies do in the third week considering it had 7 showings that night including 2-D. I expected the theatre to be _empty_. ---
**Author:** ![well\_he\_s\_back](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3ab097/32.png) [@well\_he\_s\_back](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/well_he_s_back)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/23 "2012-03-25T21:55:47Z")
I’m out of the loop - what’s the theory on why it did badly? No buzz? No big stars? Saturation of big action fantasy films? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/24 "2012-03-25T21:57:05Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Such a negative spin coming from inside a studio means one thing: Whoever greenlit this dud is in trouble and the people looking to take his/her place are putting out negative publicity in order to speed the inevitable firing. There may be some overstating of the losses for political reasons, but since Disney doesn’t really seem to be denying it (and denying something that is true gets them in trouble with stockholders), it’s probably true. > > It’s not the biggest box office bomb … yet. I think the person who greenlighted is long gone. That lets Disney put out negative publicity blaming him. As long as Disney remains in business, it’s not the worst flop ( **Heaven’s Gate** also nearly brought down a studio). It’s clearly not going to break even, but it looks like it will do better than **Mars Needs Moms** overall. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/25 "2012-03-25T22:05:56Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > I’m out of the loop - what’s the theory on why it did badly? No buzz? No big stars? Saturation of big action fantasy films? They messed up the marketing, big-time. The posters sucked, the title was changed to something that doesn’t tell anybody anything, and the trailers were all desert sword-and-sandal cheese and no story. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/26 "2012-03-25T22:40:04Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > Yes; everybody can. It’s friggin’ Wikipedia. Everyone except the subject of the page… hence my earlier post. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/27 "2012-03-25T23:46:47Z")
As a related question, why did this movie cost $350 million to make? That’s got to be creative accounting, no? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/28 "2012-03-26T00:06:28Z")
> [@](#): > > They messed up the marketing, big-time. The posters sucked, the title was changed to something that doesn’t tell anybody anything, and the trailers were all desert sword-and-sandal cheese and no story. That, and who releases an action movie in March? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/29 "2012-03-26T00:08:53Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > As a related question, why did this movie cost $350 million to make? It didn’t cost that much to _make_. $100mil of that is marketing, which often isn’t included in budgets when it’s a hit, but seems to always be included when it’s considered a failure. I also believe the $250mil that’s quoted is exaggerated, because it includes all the aborted attempts that had been made in the preceding ten years; at least three attempts were made, at my count, and each one had at least a year of pre-production costs. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/30 "2012-03-26T00:26:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > That, and who releases an action movie in March? Hey, some of us live in Florida, and have no friends, and like to get a good buzz on before seeing a movie, which hopefully does not entail walking in 90+ degree weather. Not that it matters with a good enough buzz ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/31 "2012-03-26T00:29:10Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I think you mean **John Carter** there, right? Yeah, my mind runs way ahead of my fingers. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/32 "2012-03-26T00:50:01Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > That, and who releases an action movie in March? It worked for 300 and THE MATRIX. (And cue the Lloyd Bentsen paraphrase.) ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/33 "2012-03-26T04:52:32Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > It worked for 300 and THE MATRIX. (And cue the Lloyd Bentsen paraphrase.) Those examples aside, as a general rule, the bigger studios usually target either summertime (now generally defined as early May through Labor Day) or November / December for their big releases. That said, we’ve now had two “big” movies released this month. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/34 "2012-03-26T05:11:06Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > Although it was a neat idea, I think that in retrospect it was a mistake for Disney to actually shoot the film on Mars. Too expensive. > [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > Yeah, a sound stage in Nevada would have made a lot more sense. They should have used the Florida aircraft hanger where NASA shot the hoax moon landing films. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/35 "2012-03-26T05:13:50Z")
I think the biggest problem is that John Carter of Mars is a movie that nobody really had any interest in seeing. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/36 "2012-03-26T11:17:40Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > I think the biggest problem is that John Carter of Mars is a movie that nobody really had any interest in seeing. In other words, the marketing campaign failed. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/37 "2012-03-26T11:49:30Z")
> [@blueslipper](#): > > So can someone please take it off this list [List of biggest box-office bombs - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_biggest_box_office_bombs) until its theatrical run is finished. > No movie should be on that list until its theatrical run is finished. > Why not put the Hunger games down there-its budget was around $100 million and it has only made $68 million so far! Yeah, and it’s only been out like a day. > [@blueslipper](#): > > I have been following the news on John Carter. Oh so that was you!😃 > [@blueslipper](#): > > All the news agencies are just loving running box office flop - John Carter stories. They also like running megablockbuster - Hunger Game stories. > [@blueslipper](#): > > But it has made 180 million in 2 weeks. That is huge. The only thing making it a flop is the huge Production Budget. I do not think marketing should be included in that total. If we are conservative we can say it cost around 200 million and has so far made $180 million. It will not make a huge profit , but I think it will break even overall. Yeah and the only thing keeping me from buying a Park Avenue penthouse is the high mortgage. If it’s part of the costs of the movie, it’s part of the cost. It doesn’t matter if it’s marketing, special effects budget or catering costs. > [@RealityChuck](#): > > In other words, the marketing campaign failed. That it did. I mean I have a vague idea that John Carter is sort of an olde tymie Tarzan in space story. But the trailers didn’t really compel me to see what looked like a two hour CGI kick-ass-a-thon. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/38 "2012-03-26T12:42:47Z")
Exactly. The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. Fans have made far better trailers, including[this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzPVYy7LHIo) that makes the background clear. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/39 "2012-03-26T13:36:36Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Exactly. The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. > > Fans have made far better trailers, including[this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzPVYy7LHIo) that makes the background clear. Damn, that was good. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/40 "2012-03-26T15:03:10Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > This becomes true as the movie continues to play, but is not even close for the first week. Interesting. And if the whole budget includes failed attempts to adapt the movie, it sounds like they’re just getting it all off the books now. And yes, the DVD sales and other things will be counted later. But even with all of that in mind, the movie is going to lose a bunch of money. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741.md?page=3)