# John Carter is not the biggest box office bomb of all time **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 25, 2012, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741 "2012-03-25T05:09:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/41 "2012-03-26T15:11:41Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Exactly. The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. hmm, I’m not completely tuned into pop culture, but for $100 million, you’d think I would have heard _something_ about this movie before this thread. I’m drawing a complete blank. Will go watch the trailer now. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/42 "2012-03-26T15:37:14Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Those examples aside, as a general rule, the bigger studios usually target either summertime (now generally defined as early May through Labor Day) or November / December for their big releases. That said, we’ve now had two “big” movies released this month. I’ve read articles saying that summers have gotten so crowded with a blockbuster a week mentality that studios are deliberately trying to lengthen the season. Pushing it back to March seems to work pretty well so I assume we’ll see that every year from now on. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/43 "2012-03-26T15:39:17Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. “Damn, I was really hoping we’d tap into all the Barsoom fans.” “That was the problem. We did get all the Barsoom fans.” ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/44 "2012-03-26T15:41:47Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I’ve read articles saying that summers have gotten so crowded with a blockbuster a week mentality that studios are deliberately trying to lengthen the season. Pushing it back to March seems to work pretty well so I assume we’ll see that every year from now on. Yes, it used to be the Summer Movie Season. When that got full, they aimed for the Holiday Movie Season (Thanksgiving to New Years). Now they’re trying for the Spring Break Movie Season. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/45 "2012-03-26T15:59:56Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > I’m out of the loop - what’s the theory on why it did badly? No buzz? No big stars? Saturation of big action fantasy films? My theory - they budgeted $200 million on CGI and then hired somebody’s illiterate nephew to write the story. That nephew was sure he knew how to tell a story better than ERB. He was wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/46 "2012-03-26T16:06:57Z")
They didn’t name it **A Princess of Mars** which is the actual moderately revered book the movie is based on because they thought it wouldn’t appeal to guys. So they named it **John Carter** , which sounds like a british euphemism for a guy’s junk. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/47 "2012-03-26T16:13:57Z")
Here’s a concrete example of just how bad the marketing was: I’m one of those guys who _did_ read the books, and wanted to see it just on those grounds. They didn’t have to work very hard at all to get me in the theater. And I _still_ almost missed seeing it, _because I didn’t even know when it was opening_. I mean, that’s pretty close to the bare minimum requirement of marketing: You need to let your customers know that your product exists (OK, they managed that part), and you need to let them know how they can buy it (fail). Trying to convince them to actually do so doesn’t come until the next step. It looks to me like they didn’t actually spend $100 million on marketing. It looks to me like they spent about $3.50 on marketing, and at the same time their marketing department embezzled $100 million from them. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/48 "2012-03-26T16:26:36Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Here’s a concrete example of just how bad the marketing was: I’m one of those guys who _did_ read the books, and wanted to see it just on those grounds. They didn’t have to work very hard at all to get me in the theater. And I _still_ almost missed seeing it, _because I didn’t even know when it was opening_. I mean, that’s pretty close to the bare minimum requirement of marketing: You need to let your customers know that your product exists (OK, they managed that part), and you need to let them know how they can buy it (fail). Trying to convince them to actually do so doesn’t come until the next step. It’s been a bit different for me. I grew up reading the books, and i’ve always wanted to see a movie based on them. I knew when the movie was opening. The main problem for me was that the trailer doesn’t really look like a movie that i want to see. I still haven’t seen it, and am still trying to decide whether to bother to drag my ass to it this week, or just wait until it hits the shelves on Blu-Ray. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/49 "2012-03-26T16:27:07Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > They didn’t name it **A Princess of Mars** which is the actual moderately revered book the movie is based on because they thought it wouldn’t appeal to guys. > > So they named it **John Carter** , which sounds like a british euphemism for a guy’s junk. :rolleyes: It was going to be “John Carter of Mars,” but the director thought the word “Mars” was a bad idea, since there have been several flops recently with “Mars” in the title. I’d go with something with “Barsoom” in the title. Those familiar with the books would know what you mean, and the title would sound different enough to pique the interest of those who didn’t know about them. ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/50 "2012-03-26T16:39:07Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > They messed up the marketing, big-time. The posters sucked, the title was changed to something that doesn’t tell anybody anything, and the trailers were all desert sword-and-sandal cheese and no story. Yeah, the marketing did a really shitty job of conveying just what this movie was about. And the title “John Carter” didn’t really tell you anything either. It sounds like it’s a movie about a Midwestern school teacher, or perhaps the long lost brother of Jimmy Carter. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/51 "2012-03-26T16:53:02Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > It’s been a bit different for me. > > I grew up reading the books, and i’ve always wanted to see a movie based on them. I knew when the movie was opening. The main problem for me was that the trailer doesn’t really look like a movie that i want to see. > > I still haven’t seen it, and am still trying to decide whether to bother to drag my ass to it this week, or just wait until it hits the shelves on Blu-Ray. See it in the theater. I like sci-fi/action movies in general, but had never read the Barsoom books and wasn’t particularly interested in _John Carter_. I would not have gone to see it if it weren’t for the word-of-finger advertising I encountered here on the Dope. I’m glad I did. It’s sort of a Tesla Model X of a movie: partly old-fashioned/clunky-looking but in a classic and comfortable way, and partly intriguing and innovative but in a classic and comfortable way. I’d go see it again. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/52 "2012-03-26T17:53:47Z")
**mhendo** , see the movie. It’s pretty good on its own merits, and it follows the books reasonably closely. Carter isn’t as superhuman as he is in the books, but really, it would have made for a pretty boring movie if he were. Yeah, Disney is taking a bath on it, but that’s their problem, not ours. Just because they’re not enjoying it, doesn’t mean we can’t. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/53 "2012-03-26T18:03:26Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > It didn’t cost that much to _make_. $100mil of that is marketing, which often isn’t included in budgets when it’s a hit, but seems to always be included when it’s considered a failure. > > I also believe the $250mil that’s quoted is exaggerated, because it includes all the aborted attempts that had been made in the preceding ten years; at least three attempts were made, at my count, and each one had at least a year of pre-production costs. That’s interesting, including the budget of previous attempts to make it. Doesn’t really add up. And I haven’t seen a single ad for it. I watch TV including scifi channels, and the only time I heard of this film was on this board. I am planning on going to see it next week. > [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > They didn’t name it **A Princess of Mars** which is the actual moderately revered book the movie is based on because they thought it wouldn’t appeal to guys. > > So they named it **John Carter** , which sounds like a british euphemism for a guy’s junk. :rolleyes: Does it? 😕 It is a very dull title, though, and doesn’t tell you anything about it. > [@RealityChuck](#): > > Exactly. The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. > > Fans have made far better trailers, including[this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzPVYy7LHIo) that makes the background clear. That’s very well done. Hope they don’t pull it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/54 "2012-03-26T21:51:24Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > They didn’t name it **A Princess of Mars** which is the actual moderately revered book the movie is based on because they thought it wouldn’t appeal to guys. Another problem is that there was a really cheap adaptation of [A Princess of Mars](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_of_Mars) made three years ago. Considering nobody had made a Barsoom movie in the ninety years since Burroughs wrote the book, I’m assuming this was made in an attempt to cash in on the then-upcoming Disney production. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/55 "2012-03-26T22:14:55Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Another problem is that there was a really cheap adaptation of [A Princess of Mars](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_of_Mars) made three years ago. Traci Lords and Antonio Sabato Jr? How could it not be a hit? ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/56 "2012-03-26T22:33:45Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > It’s been a bit different for me. > > I grew up reading the books, and i’ve always wanted to see a movie based on them. I knew when the movie was opening. The main problem for me was that the trailer doesn’t really look like a movie that i want to see. > > I still haven’t seen it, and am still trying to decide whether to bother to drag my ass to it this week, or just wait until it hits the shelves on Blu-Ray. Same here. I loved the books and was eagerly following the pre-release tidbits waiting for the opening. The trailer came across as a generic Michael Bay explodey-cgi-fest, and my first thought was “Well, that’s going to suck.” Having Disney’s name so highly prominent didn’t help build the case for it being an interesting original movie. I’ll wait to catch it on Netflix. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/57 "2012-03-26T22:40:11Z")
I can tell you that I saw the preview for this movie probably 3 or 4 times in the theater and had absolutely no freaking clue what the movie was about. I’m not a sci-fi person or anything, so I had no idea this was even an existing story. If they wanted me in their theater, they should have made it more obvious what the movie is about. Because, hell, I STILL have no idea what that movie is about. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/58 "2012-03-26T23:13:41Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Exactly. The director had the last say in marketing and the director thought _everyone_ knew who John Carter was. > > Fans have made far better trailers, including[this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzPVYy7LHIo) that makes the background clear. Cool! So, when are they going to release _that_ movie? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2012, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/59 "2012-03-26T23:51:51Z")
The thing is, the [first teaser trailer](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8xblwyKtfo)was actually pretty good. I mean, Peter Gabriel helped a lot, but it definitely aroused my curiosity. It’s interested how all the following (official) trailers were completely different from the first one, as if they had suddenly decided to abandon their entire marketing plan and start afresh. Right now, as we speak, someone is writing a 15-page article for the New Yorker or Vanity Fair or the Atlantic featuring the complete, in-depth story of how and why this film was made and marketed the way it was. I can’t wait to read it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741/60 "2012-03-27T01:34:27Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > I can tell you that I saw the preview for this movie probably 3 or 4 times in the theater and had absolutely no freaking clue what the movie was about. I’m not a sci-fi person or anything, so I had no idea this was even an existing story. > > If they wanted me in their theater, they should have made it more obvious what the movie is about. Because, hell, I STILL have no idea what that movie is about. Here’s something funny. Look at the [poster](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/76/TheThreeMusketeers2011Poster.jpg) for the 2011 remake of _The Three Musketeers_. They managed to make that look like it was a SF action thriller. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-carter-is-not-the-biggest-box-office-bomb-of-all-time/616741.md?page=4)