# John Mace Says: "Americans are too stupid to educate themselves..." **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 15, 2010, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703 "2010-11-15T04:02:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/121 "2011-03-26T04:09:54Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > Ever heard of the phrase “if everyone else is stupid but you, the problem probably is not them”? Quoted, (a second time), for truth and ultimate irony. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/122 "2011-03-26T04:18:32Z")
Jacquelope is so pathetic it entertains me. Reading his arguments is like watching a one legged cat trying to bury its turds on a frozen lake. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/123 "2011-03-26T05:49:15Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > America’s jobless folks, thanks to all this H1B’ing and offshoring, will do far better off by leaving the United States. The ship has sailed and is far out of port for them here. > > The H1B’s can come here and America’s unemployed can go there. Would that sound fair? In order to get an H1B (or TN or greencard) the sponsor company must prove to the Department of Labor that they can’t find an American do fill the position. It is very expensive and means posting the job for at least a month, providing proof of the applicants they rejected, then showing why the foreign applicant is better. The American economy needs H1B/TN’s to function, because companies need them those employees to function. But nice attempt trying to blame foreigners for your shitty lot in life, worked out great for Idi Amin. Who is next, the Jews? Women? ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/124 "2011-03-26T06:37:50Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Quoted, (a second time), for truth and ultimate irony. 80% of America sides with me and not you. You would be very wise not to try and quote that against me when you have utterly failed to convince THAT many people that you have any sort of case. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/125 "2011-03-26T06:46:42Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > Jacquelope is so pathetic it entertains me. Reading his arguments is like watching a one legged cat trying to bury its turds on a frozen lake. Reading your posts is like watching a monkey eat its own turds because it’s too weak to fling them. You’re just another masochistic sucker with lame insults and a desperate need to lash out at me because I’m making a flaming idiot out of John Headcase and his admirers. But you’ve already jumped the shark little organ grinder monkey boy. After this you don’t get to even try to come back at me. Bye bye little monkey. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/126 "2011-03-26T06:51:38Z")
Why I am winning this argument by a fucking landslide and the rest of you weak minded monkeys are so pissed off: > [@](#): > > In fact, Matloff went on, the nation is “wasting the innovation” that Americans could create because they are being driven from technical and scientific fields by the influx of foreigners. “There are a lot of good people who are displaced,” he said. In the tech field, this does not occur because of talent, education, productivity or ability but with age, and ultimately with pay, he stated. Employers prefer to bring in young foreign workers who are cheaper in preference to employing experienced Americans who are more expensive. In a number of tech companies, a majority of workers are foreign-born while many Americans being displaced “are of good quality.” Over 20 years ago, he noted, experts predicted that encouraging immigration would discourage citizens from entering these fields. It turns out that I’m not the only one who has been saying this. EXPERTS besides me have been warning about it, too. Absolute fact. You cannot and will not deny that. All you’ve got left now is to throw temper tantrums at me. Dumbfucks. Can you hear the American majority now, or do we have to shout louder, like when we mop up with you at the ballot box? So far you’ve made enemies of the independent voters, the Tea Party AND the liberals on this issue… who the fuck do you have left to support you? Sheesh. What the fuck. If you people were any more dense you’d have your own gravitational fields. You are a laughable minority now. You used to be a majority but your bullshit finally caught up with you. _When does this sink into your tiny little brains?_ ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/127 "2011-03-26T07:15:19Z")
The level of delusion you show is actually kind of admirable, in a twisted sort of way. I mean, as often as you’ve been shown to be an idiot on this board, yet you keep thinking that in actuality you are winning all of these arguments because you’ve got 'dopers like gonzomax to act as your echo chamber (not that you seemingly need one…you area one creature echo chamber)…well, it’s kind of touching. It shows…something… -XT ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/128 "2011-03-26T07:56:04Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > Why I am winning this argument by a fucking landslide and the rest of you weak minded monkeys are so pissed off: > > > [@](#): > > > > In fact, Matloff went on, the nation is “wasting the innovation” that Americans could create because **they are being driven from technical and scientific fields by the influx of foreigners. “There are a lot of good people who are displaced,”** he said. In the tech field, this does not occur because of talent, education, productivity or ability but with age, and ultimately with pay, he stated. Employers prefer to bring in young foreign workers who are cheaper in preference to employing experienced Americans who are more expensive. In a number of tech companies, a majority of workers are foreign-born while many Americans being displaced “are of good quality.” Over 20 years ago, he noted, experts predicted that encouraging immigration would discourage citizens from entering these fields. As I just said, foreigners can’t displace Americans in technical fields, the very definition of the H1B/TN does not allow for it. But I guess if you write it enough times you can consider that a win. And what’s with you now quoting “experts?” I thought you read that wiki page about appeal to authority. It also helps if you put everyone that proves you wrong on ignore. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/129 "2011-03-26T08:11:34Z")
n/m ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/130 "2011-03-26T08:57:07Z")
_…Checks dates on thread…_ Guess they must have closed the off-shoring thread eh Jaq? You know, if you start a new thread, you can get all the people who had already responded in this one, to perhaps reply again. That would be even more attention for you. You like attention, dont you? ---
**Author:** ![TravisFromOR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cc9497/32.png) [@TravisFromOR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TravisFromOR)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/131 "2011-03-26T09:15:21Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > _…Checks dates on thread…_ > > Guess they must have closed the off-shoring thread eh Jaq? You know, if you start a new thread, you can get all the people who had already responded in this one, to perhaps reply again. That would be even more attention for you. You like attention, dont you? They did close it. **Le Jackass** was caught using the board for his own personal blog. ---
**Author:** ![Jolly\_Roger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/91b2a8/32.png) [@Jolly\_Roger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jolly_Roger)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/132 "2011-03-26T10:37:19Z")
> [@TravisFromOR](#): > > They did close it. **Le Jackass** was caught using the board for his own personal blog. Now that has got to be entertaining. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/133 "2011-03-26T10:49:20Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > _…Checks dates on thread…_ > > Guess they must have closed the off-shoring thread eh Jaq? You know, if you start a new thread, you can get all the people who had already responded in this one, to perhaps reply again. That would be even more attention for you. You like attention, dont you? You’ll do anything to silence the anti-offshoring movement on here, but that’s neither here nor there. The article I posted was relevant to this thread. It’s a new development that shows people ARE in fact avoiding the ENTIRE technology sector. Now I can understand why none of you can man-up and nail yourself down to whether Norman Matloff is wrong. You’d have to bring up cites that contradict him and you can’t. But I knew that before I posted this. To quote you guys, you got nothin’. But that’s been true of you throughout this whole offshoring “debate” thing. From jump, you’ve had nothin’. A bunch of rote memorized economic platitudes that are hardly even relevant to what’s happening out there now. Once again… that’s why your views have gone from a large MAJORITY in America, to a laughable minority. And I’m gonna keep reminding you of that so you understand clearly what happened when reality caves in on you and America goes back to its protectionist roots. It’s coming. Buckle up for it. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/134 "2011-03-26T11:18:48Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > You’ll do anything to silence the anti-offshoring movement on here, but that’s neither here nor there. The article I posted was relevant to this thread. It’s a new development that shows people ARE in fact avoiding the ENTIRE technology sector. > > Now I can understand why none of you can man-up and nail yourself down to whether Norman Matloff is wrong. You’d have to bring up cites that contradict him and you can’t. But I knew that before I posted this. To quote you guys, you got nothin’. > > But that’s been true of you throughout this whole offshoring “debate” thing. From jump, you’ve had nothin’. A bunch of rote memorized economic platitudes that are hardly even relevant to what’s happening out there now. > > Once again… that’s why your views have gone from a large MAJORITY in America, to a laughable minority. And I’m gonna keep reminding you of that so you understand clearly what happened when reality caves in on you and America goes back to its protectionist roots. It’s coming. Buckle up for it. Sorry Jaqi, you must have me confused with the other bucketybuck, the American one. Its a common mistake. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/135 "2011-03-26T12:25:11Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, but did you read the article? He says that some of his best friends are immigrants! Sure they are. All those nice Korean girls down at the “Happy Endings” massage parlor? Bestest Friends Forever! ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/136 "2011-03-26T13:35:13Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Sure they are. All those nice Korean girls down at the “Happy Endings” massage parlor? Bestest Friends Forever! _Sigh_ Poor John Mace. His parents bought into globalism, too. They loaded their cupboards with glassware made in China and saved themselves a lot of money. All that damned cheap Chinese lead. I almost feel sorry for Headcase boy. Almost. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/137 "2011-03-26T21:24:21Z")
None of you understand even basic economics. I have talked to EXPERTS who deal in FACTS and your shriveled hydroencephaled brains can’t grasp it. All of the members on this board have alienated both the right and the left. You refuse to acknowledge that my major point is correct. You refuse to acknowledge that we need to develop a barter system so our money isn’t outsourced overseas. You want a car - you pay for it with sheep. The gas for your car? You buy a whale, pay for it with sheep, keep it in your backyard, and get oil from the whale. When the whale gets hungry, you feed it mexicans. This is FACTS and they are UNDISPUTED. I try to teach all of you economics, but you idiots don’t listen. A whale and sheep barter economy is the only way to prevent OUTSOURCING and IMMIGRATION and save our economy. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/138 "2011-03-26T21:34:14Z")
That’s one of those things that’s funny and sad at the same time. Funny because it’s so close to the reality. Sad because it’s so close to the reality. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/139 "2011-03-26T21:48:32Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > 80% of America sides with me and not you. No they don’t. > [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > You would be very wise not to try and quote that against me when you have utterly failed to convince THAT many people that you have any sort of case. I have not tried to persuade anyone on the issues about which you rant at length. (So you are just making stuff up to rationalize the foam on your chin.) ---
**Author:** ![trabajabamos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/47e85d/32.png) [@trabajabamos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/trabajabamos)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703/140 "2011-03-26T22:51:36Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > Why I am winning this argument by a fucking landslide and the rest of you weak minded monkeys are so pissed off I’m invincible! The Black Knight always triumphs! Have at you!! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/john-mace-says-americans-are-too-stupid-to-educate-themselves/560703.md?page=8)