# Jonathan Chance, where IS that list of things I'm supposed to remain silent on? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [May 10, 2014, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147 "2014-05-10T21:08:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/21 "2014-05-10T22:49:38Z")
The quote function is your friend. But as noted, if you think they should have been moderated, report them. If you didn’t report them, and you won’t quote them here, complaining about them is pretty silly. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/22 "2014-05-10T23:14:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The quote function is your friend. But as noted, if you think they should have been moderated, report them. If you didn’t report them, and you won’t quote them here, complaining about them is pretty silly. That argument presumes I’m a hypocrite. I didn’t report them because I didn’t care, right up until they were ignored in favor of singling me out. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/23 "2014-05-10T23:21:53Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > That argument presumes I’m a hypocrite. I didn’t report them because I didn’t care, right up until they were ignored in favor of singling me out. No, I’m not assuming you’re a hypocrite, but you are assuming that the mods read all posts, which they don’t. You’re also asserting that the other posts were as “bad” as yours, and without knowing which posts you are talking about, there’s no way we can decide whether or not we agree with you. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/24 "2014-05-10T23:25:36Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > In the thread I just got Warned in, that is the rhetoric being used. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/25 "2014-05-10T23:26:27Z")
The Somebody Else is Doing it Too defense doesn’t work with my kids, it doesn’t work in court and apparently doesn’t work with the Mods. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2014, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/26 "2014-05-10T23:50:12Z")
The mirror of your argument would be that pro-choice people support abortion rights not because they care about the mother’s welfare, but because they are all bloodthirsty monsters who derive actual physical pleasure from the thought of torturing and murdering defenseless babies. I can’t recall ever hearing any poster, nor any abortion opponent anywhere, say this. Even the staunchest anti’s see the other side as misguided, thoughtless, selfish, with priorities out of whack… nobody (that I know of) says that pro-choicers are driven by blood lust. If they did, it would be just as ludicrous as your cartoonish portrayal of their motivations, and just as unwelcome in Great Debates. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/27 "2014-05-11T00:34:04Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Cite? Two examples: > [@How come conservatives are against abortion?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-conservatives-are-against-abortion/688063/102): > > It definitely would be, if it didn’t involve murdering another human being. > [@How come conservatives are against abortion?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-conservatives-are-against-abortion/688063/130): > > Sure. Let the mother decide for herself whether to kill the kid or not. > [@VinylTurnip](#): > > The mirror of your argument would be that pro-choice people support abortion rights not because they care about the mother’s welfare, but because they are all bloodthirsty monsters who derive actual physical pleasure from the thought of torturing and murdering defenseless babies. I can’t recall ever hearing any poster, nor any abortion opponent anywhere, say this. Even the staunchest anti’s see the other side as misguided, thoughtless, selfish, with priorities out of whack… nobody (that I know of) says that pro-choicers are driven by blood lust. If they did, it would be just as ludicrous as your cartoonish portrayal of their motivations, and just as unwelcome in Great Debates. No it wouldn’t because it doesn’t fit the behavior of pro-choice people, while my accusations do fit the behavior of anti-choice people. And really, you haven’t noticed the anti-choicers using rhetoric like that? They certainly do talk about pro-choice people that way. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/28 "2014-05-11T00:43:46Z")
Der Trihs, this place (SDMB) is a better place with you in it. This is my opinion, and that is all. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/29 "2014-05-11T00:46:13Z")
I have to agree with Der Trihs. Referring to abortion as “murder” and the fetus as “kid” certainly is inflammatory. It also poisons the well for any further discussion. Yes, I know. Some people sincerely believe that abortion is the killing of a child. Those beliefs, no matter how sincere, are neither scientifically nor legally correct. Allowing them to frame the discussion to suit their unscientific and inaccurate beliefs prevents any genuine discussion of the topic. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/30 "2014-05-11T00:56:17Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > I have to agree with Der Trihs. Referring to abortion as “murder” and the fetus as “kid” certainly is inflammatory. It also poisons the well for any further discussion. > > Yes, I know. Some people sincerely believe that abortion is the killing of a child. Those beliefs, no matter how sincere, are neither scientifically nor legally correct. Allowing them to frame the discussion to suit their unscientific and inaccurate beliefs prevents any genuine discussion of the topic. So, when my pregnant friend says her baby [kid] is kicking, that’s inflammatory? Or does she have to actually use the word “kid”? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/31 "2014-05-11T00:59:18Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > So, when my pregnant friend says her baby [kid] is kicking, that’s inflammatory? Or does she have to actually use the word “kid”? The context is different, to put it mildly. She’s not using those terms to demonize anyone. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/32 "2014-05-11T01:01:27Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The context is different, to put it mildly. She’s not using those terms to demonize anyone. Do you have \*any \*perception of irony, whatsoever? A smidgen, even? ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/33 "2014-05-11T01:02:01Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > And how, exactly, would that be possible? And why is it only criticism of the Right that is “inflammatory”? Der, are you of the opinion that Chance is some sort of right-wing anti-abortion crusader? If not, your above claim makes little sense. Beyond that you’re complaining that you’re not being allowed to express what you “honestly feel.” SDMB has never given people a pass on trolling based on it being their “honest opinion”. If so, New Deal Democrat and a whole pile of other posters would still be here. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/34 "2014-05-11T01:04:33Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Do you have \*any \*perception of irony, whatsoever? A smidgen, even? I wasn’t demonizing anyone. I was being as restrained in my speech as I could manage without lying about them. The two sides are not equivalent, they are not mirror images of each other; claiming they must be is a [fallacy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/35 "2014-05-11T01:10:38Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I wasn’t demonizing anyone. I was being as restrained in my speech as I could manage without lying about them. > > The two sides are not equivalent, they are not mirror images of each other; claiming they must be is a [fallacy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation). He didn’t claim they must be. Only that they could be. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/36 "2014-05-11T01:11:04Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Der, are you of the opinion that Chance is some sort of right-wing anti-abortion crusader? Considering what he keeps coming down on me for, it certainly looked like it to me. It seemed more plausible than assuming he had some agenda against me personally. > [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Beyond that you’re complaining that you’re not being allowed to express what you “honestly feel.” > > SDMB has never given people a pass on trolling based on it being their “honest opinion”. It lets racists regularly argue that black people are born stupider than whites, to use one example. That’s plenty inflammatory - and tends to result in the non-racists getting Warnings when they lose their temper, while the racists go unchecked. And as I hear the term usually used trolling by definition is dishonest; if it’s honest, it isn’t trolling, whatever else it may be. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/37 "2014-05-11T01:12:29Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I wasn’t demonizing anyone. > [@Der Trihs](#): > > Because they hate women, and wish to oppress and torment them. If you fail to see where the quote above is a demonization, something I have a hard time believing really, then suffice it to say I believe your perception of reality needs a bit more calibration. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/38 "2014-05-11T01:23:15Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > If you fail to see where the quote above is a demonization, something I have a hard time believing really, then suffice it to say I believe your perception of reality needs a bit more calibration. But that’s his toned down opinion. If he said what he really feels watch out. So that makes it ok I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/39 "2014-05-11T02:02:04Z")
I would point out that **Brazil84** was never modded for saying that Africans have an average IQ of 70, a statement just as inflammatory as anything **Der Trihs** has ever said, and furthermore is a declaratory statement which is self-evident nonsense in addition to being offensive. And I know the mods were aware of his posts, since GD mods engaged Brazil84 as posters for some reason. So I’m not sure why **Trihs** is being singled out here. It’s not like he’s derailing the thread, which, let’s face it, is a pretty dumb thread to begin with. (“Abortion you say? Now that you mention it that does seem like it could be a controversial issue. I’d love to hear the points pro and con, which I have never heard before, as I was raised in a cave on Mars.”) ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/40 "2014-05-11T02:05:49Z")
You know what caused me to make that thread? It was a debate I was having with my friends at lunch about abortion. After, I thought, “Why are conservatives against abortion? I thought they were for freedom and all.” So then I asked in GD. Can you imagine that? This only reason this argument between **Der Trihs** , **Colibri** and **Jonathan Chance** that is happening and why **Der** \*\*Trihs \*\*received a warning is only because me and my friends decided to discuss abortion one day at lunch…lol. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147.md?page=3)