# Jonathan Chance, where IS that list of things I'm supposed to remain silent on? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [May 10, 2014, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147 "2014-05-10T21:08:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/81 "2014-05-11T19:55:59Z")
> [@j666](#): > > She does if she is the one who is pregnant. > > To imply a woman who has evaluated her situation, abilities, and options, and decided that it would not be advisable to have a child a killer or murderer is inflammatory. > > ETA: I certainly don’t find “child-killer” ambiguous. Well, when someone posts “child-killer” in GD, you should report them, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/82 "2014-05-11T20:10:39Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Save yourself, **Der Trihs**. It really is possible for decent folks to disagree on issues like this. Many years ago, I really thought that conservatives could not be decent folks. But I learned, largely in the Navy, that many conservatives (and liberals and moderates) would gladly risk their lives to save mine. They were decent folks (well, most of them), even if they’re wrong on many political issues. That doesn’t mean that Republican Congressman aren’t total pricks who are hurting America, or that much of Republican rhetoric doesn’t seem to often coincidentally and suspiciously appeal to racist white people, but it means that many of their supporters might just be wrong for honest reasons. > > One can fiercely oppose the Republican and conservative agenda in America without insisting that all or most Republicans and conservatives are evil, and I think such demonization is counter-productive. As far as I can tell he has been very careful to not post much personal information. Which is fine no one says you have to. But that allows people to make their own assumptions. My assumption is that he has not been exposed to a wide range of people outside of his family. If you get most of your information from exploring the depths of the internet it is inevitable that you will draw extreme conclusions. I don’t claim that this assumption and others I have made are fact but I’ll continue to feel that way until I see evidence to the contrary. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/83 "2014-05-11T21:17:49Z")
To nobody in particular: The thing is, **DerTrihs** has a history. This thread should not be about abortion. There’s already a thread about that. You want to debate the meaning of “fetus” or some such? Go to that one. **Der Trihs** , however, has a history. That’s what we need to talk about. Whether it’s abortion or politics or religion or the military or, God help us, “men’s rights”, the guy is unfailingly ascerbic and hateful. He is in no way a troll, but I believe he really does hate. The problem that all of his apologists forget is that he really does hate. His opinions may be honest, but they are not based on logic and reason. They are based on hate. So to the people who are tempted to defend him, know that. You can hate injustice, that’s fine and I’m on board with that, but this guy hates _groups_. That’s how bigotry starts. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/84 "2014-05-11T21:29:40Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Well, when someone posts “child-killer” in GD, you should report them, I guess. Mmm, problem with that - I stay the hell out of those threads, lest I go all Der Trihs on someone’s ass. I get in quite enough trouble in analog. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/85 "2014-05-11T23:12:01Z")
> [@armedmonkey](#): > > So to the people who are tempted to defend him, know that. You can hate injustice, that’s fine and I’m on board with that, but this guy hates _groups_. That’s how bigotry starts. To be fair, the groups he hates are generally the most powerful groups, the groups best equipped to shrug off hatred of them. He also hates belief-based groups, not birth-based groups, and that’s a far more rational basis of hatred. There’s no real equivalence between his hatred of Republicans, for example, and someone else’s hatred of black people. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/86 "2014-05-11T23:20:53Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > To be fair, the groups he hates are generally the most powerful groups, the groups best equipped to shrug off hatred of them. He also hates belief-based groups, not birth-based groups, and that’s a far more rational basis of hatred. There’s no real equivalence between his hatred of Republicans, for example, and someone else’s hatred of black people. And his hatred of Americans? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/87 "2014-05-11T23:28:43Z")
The US has the largest economy, the most powerful military, world class universities, a mass culture powerhouse, a research juggernaut and world class competitive eating champions. I think we can take on Der Trihs. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/88 "2014-05-12T00:15:55Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > To be fair, the groups he hates are generally the most powerful groups, the groups best equipped to shrug off hatred of them. He also hates belief-based groups, not birth-based groups, and that’s a far more rational basis of hatred. There’s no real equivalence between his hatred of Republicans, for example, and someone else’s hatred of black people. Are you really defending hatred of groups? Is that what you are doing here? Can I get your argument about how hate based stereotyping is a good thing? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/89 "2014-05-12T00:20:17Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > And his hatred of Americans? Americans! Americans, fer the luvva God! Now he’s gone too far! Mmmmmmmm Murica! ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/90 "2014-05-12T00:27:23Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > And his hatred of Americans? I assume you’re saying that Americans don’t fit under the rubric of belief-based groups, right, not that they don’t fit under the rubric of powerful groups? If so, you’re correct. I’m not sure that his hatred of Americans is as fierce as his hatred of religious leaders and Republicans, but maybe I’m wrong. I’m no DT scholar. > [@armedmonkey](#): > > Are you really defending hatred of groups? Is that what you are doing here? No. Edit: if someone compares drunken assaults to genocide, I’ll criticize the comparison, but that doesn’t mean I’m defending drunken assaults. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/91 "2014-05-12T01:01:00Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Edit: if someone compares drunken assaults to genocide, I’ll criticize the comparison, but that doesn’t mean I’m defending drunken assaults. Whah, ya lousy sumbitch, I oughta… getthe game, calla pizza with a… house… ya buttahfermaglassaff…zzzzzzzzzz… ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/92 "2014-05-12T01:07:50Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I assume you’re saying that Americans don’t fit under the rubric of belief-based groups, right, not that they don’t fit under the rubric of powerful groups? If so, you’re correct. I’m not sure that his hatred of Americans is as fierce as his hatred of religious leaders and Republicans, but maybe I’m wrong. I’m no DT scholar. With the poster in questions, there is only on and off. There are no degrees of fierceness. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/93 "2014-05-12T01:09:33Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Whah, ya lousy sumbitch, I oughta… getthe game, calla pizza with a… house… ya buttahfermaglassaff…zzzzzzzzzz… That’s it, I’m calling the Hague. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Edit: if someone compares drunken assaults to genocide, I’ll criticize the comparison, but that doesn’t mean I’m defending drunken assaults. And now to be fair, you didn’t explicitly compare DT’s rants to anti-black bigotry, so if I misunderstood you, my apologies. It read to me as if you were treating all bigotry the same, and I don’t think that’s a reasonable position, however, and if that’s what you were doing, no apologies at all. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/94 "2014-05-12T01:29:07Z")
He once said he was happy when soldiers in Iraq were killed, because they were all murderers, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Baal\_Houtham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baal_houtham/32/13604_2.png) [@Baal\_Houtham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baal_Houtham)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/95 "2014-05-12T02:14:24Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > He once said he was happy when soldiers in Iraq were killed, because they were all murderers, IIRC. As long as he’s not directly addressing a poster who’s fighting there, big deal. It was a U.S. war of aggression that seems to have directly led to the death of hundreds of thousands. (Drops out of highjack, now.) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/96 "2014-05-12T02:34:37Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > He once said he was happy when soldiers in Iraq were killed, because they were all murderers, IIRC. While I strongly disagree with that, that’s an irrelevant example: it’s a belief about a group of people who not only are united by a belief, but are united by a willingness to do violence in pursuit of that belief. That’s very different from disliking all Americans, which is what I was talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/97 "2014-05-12T02:43:44Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > To be fair, the groups he hates are generally the most powerful groups, the groups best equipped to shrug off hatred of them. He also hates belief-based groups, not birth-based groups, and that’s a far more rational basis of hatred. There’s no real equivalence between his hatred of Republicans, for example, and someone else’s hatred of black people. Women are “the most powerful of groups”? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/98 "2014-05-12T02:48:10Z")
> [@Baal\_Houtham](#): > > As long as he’s not directly addressing a poster who’s fighting there, big deal. It was a U.S. war of aggression that seems to have directly led to the death of hundreds of thousands. (Drops out of highjack, now.) To bad some of us had family over there. And not everyone joins the military because they wanted to follow Bush and kill innocent people. Besides, his comments on conservatives hating women? This is the same guy who once said you should never trust a woman you’re sleeping with NOT to accuse you of rape. (This was in a [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=593029) about whether it would be a good idea to secretly tape your sexual encounters). ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/99 "2014-05-12T03:02:59Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > To be fair, the groups he hates are generally the most powerful groups, the groups best equipped to shrug off hatred of them. He also hates belief-based groups, not birth-based groups, and that’s a far more rational basis of hatred. There’s no real equivalence between his hatred of Republicans, for example, and someone else’s hatred of black people. This post really, _really_ bugs me. It does sound like you are saying it’s OK to hate somebody because they believe in something you don’t because, hey, they can take it. From a pure logical standpoint, I have a problem with that. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147/100 "2014-05-12T03:04:15Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Women are “the most powerful of groups”? Whoops. They’re also clearly a “birth based group” not a “belief based group”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jonathan-chance-where-is-that-list-of-things-im-supposed-to-remain-silent-on/688147.md?page=6)