# Jordan Peterson **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 8, 2020, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650 "2020-02-08T23:12:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/41 "2020-02-10T17:49:56Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > He is so smart and articulate, we need more people with his wisdom and courage to engage the issues of the day. Do you think more people should have the wisdom and courage to switch to an ALL BEEF diet like JP? ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/42 "2020-02-10T18:25:18Z")
If he does manage to recover enough to return to the self-help/money-begging circuit… his advice needs to be publicly scrutinized/audited. If he ever suggests his followers to forgo standard medical treatments (for addiction recovery) in favour of his cold-turkey/coma method, people could die. That’s no joke. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/43 "2020-02-10T18:31:45Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > The article goes on to say that Jordan Peterson was put in a medical coma for eight days and tried to cold-turkey his withdrawal symptoms. (Unlike those wimpy Western docs who tried to taper him off just like everyone else who kicks benzos.) > > He has neurological damage from seizures endured while he was in the coma. (Because brave Russian Doctors have the courage not to treat side-effects!) “Welcome to Russia! We put you in coma now. No medicine, we use large mallet made of wood, like in Bugs Bunny cartoon! Nite-nite!” _ **\** _ ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/44 "2020-02-10T18:40:04Z")
I’ve watched, and paid close attention, to 6 hours of debates and conversations between him and Sam Harris. The smart things JP says are trite. The nonsense he pontificates is profound. ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/45 "2020-02-10T18:51:11Z")
I stumbled across _Maps of Meaning_ a while ago, and have made slow inroads with that. I think there’s an intriguing idea there, somewhere buried under lots of barely-intelligible and not often terribly well substantiated interpretation of myth across different cultures, but I’m not exactly sure what it is. Sometime after, I saw this _12 Rules_ thing pop up here and there, and lumped it in with _The Secret_ and things like that, but never really made the connection until now. Well, it seems like he’s found his audience… ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/46 "2020-02-10T20:43:04Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > If he does manage to recover enough to return to the self-help/money-begging circuit… his advice needs to be publicly scrutinized/audited. If he ever suggests his followers to forgo standard medical treatments (for addiction recovery) in favour of his cold-turkey/coma method, people could die. That’s no joke. Celebrities have been advocating health idiocy for a long time now, and sadly the suckers will keep swallowing it hook, line and sinker. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/47 "2020-02-10T21:43:46Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > “Welcome to Russia! We put you in coma now. No medicine, we use large mallet made of wood, like in Bugs Bunny cartoon! Nite-nite!” _ **\** _ Came home after a crazy day at work. Read this. Laughed out loud. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/48 "2020-02-10T22:37:33Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > The smart things JP says are trite. The nonsense he pontificates is profound. See this is lazy criticism, I barely see any point specific criticism of him and his ideas. Hey some of his thoughts I think are bit silly but on the whole he makes a lot of sense. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/49 "2020-02-10T23:16:49Z")
[2017 Maps of Meaning 08: Neuropsychology of Symbolic Representation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb5cBkbQpGY&t=1h45m32s) > [@](#): > > I really do believe this although. It’s very complicated to explain why I really believe **that’s a representation of DNA**. So and that t **hat representation that entwined double helix that is everywhere** , you can see it in Australian Aboriginal art and I’m using the Australians as an example because they were isolated in Australia for like 50,000 years. There’s the most archaic people that were ever discovered and they have clear representations of these double helix structures in their art. [Biblical Series IV: Adam and Eve: Self-Consciousness, Evil, and Death](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ifi5KkXig3s&feature=youtu.be&t=8543) > [@](#): > > Audience Member: …also explained that cultures around the world have these twin snakes > JBP: yeah they’re everywhere man > AM: Yeah and so you mentioned that you believe this is a representation of DNA? > JBP: I wouldn’t say I believe that I have my suspicions that that might be it. yeah because believe is too strong a word but those representations are everywhere and. Read this book. This is a good one…I think it’s called the Cosmic Serpent… > JBP: …I think people had \*\*intimations \*\*of Dna as the Cosmic Serpent forever… > AM: …but I don’t see how, we could perceive DNA as it is? > PB&J: Well, yes. We didn’t \*\*objectively \*\*but I’m not so sure we didn’t **subjectively**. But I mean its very strange that these double helixes exist in so many places and that they’re often utilized as healing symbols… Interpreting the depiction of two snakes entwining as an illusion to DNA is pretty crazy, JBP might not know that this is [simply how snakes mate](https://resize.indiatvnews.com/en/resize/newbucket/715_-/2017/04/snakes-mating-1491367501.jpg), but he should be aware he is talking out of his ass. His ideas are not the product of any sort of scholarly rigour or rational system. They are simply his personal “hot takes” on day-to-day stuff. No more informed then crazy uncle Joe, or radio jockey #47. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2020, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/50 "2020-02-10T23:28:20Z")
> [@pool](#): > > The coma thing reminds me of something I only learned of recently. I’m sure most of you have heard of electroshock therapy. > > But it was only recently I heard and read about Insulin shock therapy where depressives and especially schizophrenics were given overdoses of insulin in order to be put in a coma with a goal of helping them, quite fascinating actually. > > There were positive results for some, not so much for others, mostly because of a lot of follow-up care but it’s amazing how far we have come from a lot of pseudoscience. > > [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin\_shock\_therapy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_shock_therapy) ECT is still used; insulin shock quickly went by the wayside. About a decade ago, there was a lot of buzz about a treatment called “precipitated opiate withdrawal” that was initially believed to have a high success rate; in short, a person was put into a medically induced coma for several days and given various drugs to quickly get them off opiates, and just a quick Google search indicates that it too has largely gone the way of the dodo. ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/51 "2020-02-11T02:01:38Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > [2017 Maps of Meaning 08: Neuropsychology of Symbolic Representation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb5cBkbQpGY&t=1h45m32s) > [Biblical Series IV: Adam and Eve: Self-Consciousness, Evil, and Death](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ifi5KkXig3s&feature=youtu.be&t=8543)Interpreting the depiction of two snakes entwining as an illusion to DNA is pretty crazy, JBP might not know that this is [simply how snakes mate](https://resize.indiatvnews.com/en/resize/newbucket/715_-/2017/04/snakes-mating-1491367501.jpg), but he should be aware he is talking out of his ass. His ideas are not the product of any sort of scholarly rigour or rational system. They are simply his personal “hot takes” on day-to-day stuff. No more informed then crazy uncle Joe, or radio jockey #47. When I took organic chemistry the Professor who held many patents and seemed quite intelligent told us the first chemist to imagine a hydrocarbon ring structure got the idea from a most likely a cocaine fueled dream of a snake eating itself. I’m not making anything of it but I did think it was interesting. [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/August\_Kekulé](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/August_Kekul%C3%A9) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/52 "2020-02-11T05:26:49Z")
> [@pool](#): > > When I took organic chemistry the Professor who held many patents and seemed quite intelligent told us the first chemist to imagine a hydrocarbon ring structure got the idea from a most likely a cocaine fueled dream of a snake eating itself. I’m not making anything of it but I did think it was interesting. You do see the difference between someone _who was actively working on that aspect of organic chemistry_ having an insight in the form of a symbolic dream, and Australian aborigines intuitively using the theoretical structure of DNA as a foundation in their art, right? ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/53 "2020-02-11T05:44:20Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > You do see the difference between someone _who was actively working on that aspect of organic chemistry_ having an insight in the form of a symbolic dream, and Australian aborigines intuitively using the theoretical structure of DNA as a foundation in their art, right? You did read the last sentence of my post right? ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/54 "2020-02-11T08:43:31Z")
> [@pool](#): > > You did read the last sentence of my post right? The story about benzene is off topic for this thread then. Sent from my Redmi 5A using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![MrLee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f8ce5/32.png) [@MrLee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrLee)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/55 "2020-02-11T09:17:33Z")
I’ve read his ‘12 Rules’ book and watched a few talks and interviews. I feel like I’ve probably read and heard as much \*about \*him as \*by \*him. I really don’t see what the alt-right see in him; he is far from a frothing-at-the-mouth white supremacist. Likewise, many on the left see JP as some kind of monstrous caricature of far-right neo-nazi ideology - there are far more disagreeable (and illogical) people out there in the public sphere than JP. IMHO, he is an occasionally thought-provoking public speaker who is sometimes prone to exaggerating the ‘threat’ posed by the far-left, venturing too far away from his area(s) of expertise, and over-reliance on mythological and biblical interpretations. An often-repeated mantra of his is a slightly conspiracy-laden notion that there is a cabal of postmodernist/marxist academics who are - inadvertently or otherwise - advocating for the downfall of western civilization. This is a bit much. Still, his many of his critiques of socialism and feminism are pretty solid. A lot of the social sciences \*do \*make assumptions about privilege and inequality which are worth at least questioning. The parts of his that I struggle with the most are the boring and non-sensical diatribes about biblical passages and other mythologies. These usually combine with weird, unsupported generalisations such as ‘Chaos is feminine, order is masculine’ (what?). ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/56 "2020-02-11T09:30:30Z")
> [@pool](#): > > You did read the last sentence of my post right? " I’m not making anything of it but I did think it was interesting." My point is, it’s not. Or relevant, really. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/57 "2020-02-11T09:31:50Z")
> [@MrLee](#): > > Still, his many of his critiques of socialism and feminism are pretty solid. Such as…? ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/58 "2020-02-11T12:02:05Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > I know and respect smart people who are Jordan Peterson fans, but I’ve never actually heard him say anything I would consider intelligent. At best, he’s a less new-agey version of Deepak Chopra or something, just saying feelgood platitudes for his particular audience of young “rational” white dudes. \*\*At worst he is a holocaust denier who opines that the Nazis didn’t really do anything that bad. \*\*I don’t understand what people I respect see in him, but I guess we hear what we want to hear and see what we want to see. WTF?! I was on the fence about the guy until this. One of these things is not like the others. Anywhere I could find more detail about his opinions on the Holocaust? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/59 "2020-02-11T13:13:51Z")
**DrCube,** I would also be interested in cites on that matter. Until now the takes I’ve heard from him have been to the effect that it was not just monsters but also “the ‘good’ people” who just went along and collaborated in Nazism. > [@puddleglum](#): > > He is so smart and articulate, we need more people with his wisdom and courage You have just described four qualities that do not necessarily convey each other. He _is_ smart and articulate, but much of what has been reported indicates questionable if not scant wisdom, and I could be very courageous too speaking from a long-standing tenured position to randos on YouTube. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2020, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650/60 "2020-02-11T13:32:07Z")
> [@MrLee](#): > > . Still, his many of his critiques of socialism and feminism are pretty solid. Like the part where he thinks women have too much choice in finding mates these days, and should be forced into monogamous relationships so that they can’t flock to wealthy dudes, leaving unmated men to turn to violence when they’re out-competed in the free market dating market? > [@](#): > > The parts of his that I struggle with the most are the boring and non-sensical diatribes about biblical passages and other mythologies. These usually combine with weird, unsupported generalisations such as ‘Chaos is feminine, order is masculine’ (what?). Yeah, well that “chaos is feminine, witches are real and live in swamps, everyone knows men bring order” is central to his ideas about society and relationships. You can’t just handwave it off. That’s what Peterson uses as the basis for all his ideas. You’re right that it’s nonsensical and unsupported. That’s why serious thinkers are unimpressed by Peterson’s work. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jordan-peterson/847650.md?page=4)