# Josh Duggar (Duggar kid 1/19) to be executive director of Family Research Council **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 19, 2013, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369 "2013-06-19T16:22:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/461 "2015-06-06T05:06:01Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > Super-Christian kneejerk jumping to the defense of an über-Christian? Unlikely. In fact, he’s taken great pains here in this thread to establish that he doesn’t generally find much that’s defensible about the Duggars’ whole schtick. ---
**Author:** ![jimbuff314](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c57346/32.png) [@jimbuff314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimbuff314)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/462 "2015-06-06T05:26:36Z")
Yeah. As far as I can tell, **Bricker** just wants a cite for the assertion that the parent Duggars hold the girls in some way responsible for their brother’s molestation of them. For this _ **specific** _ claim, I have seen no direct evidence either. I _spit_ on the parent Duggars. Spuh! Spuh! **lugee launching** ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/463 "2015-06-06T06:53:14Z")
> [@jimbuff314](#): > > Yeah. As far as I can tell, **Bricker** just wants a cite for the assertion that the parent Duggars hold the girls in some way responsible for their brother’s molestation of them. For this _ **specific** _ claim, I have seen no direct evidence either. > > I _spit_ on the parent Duggars. Spuh! Spuh! **lugee launching** But that’s an argument from incredulity. It’s what what Gothard, who is effectively their cult leader, believes. It’s what someone who escaped actually says they believe. Lasciel says that women in the Quiverfull movement are taught that sexual things are their fault. There’s article upon article stating this as their beliefs, yet the Duggars have not felt the need to contradict them. He’s demanding direct evidence when direct evidence is not needed. Despite everyone proving it to the satisfaction of everyone else here, he refuses to believe it. It still boils down to him thinking that there’s no way the Duggars believe this specific teaching of Gothard, despite us showing that they adhere to the others. It’s like he’s the defense lawyer trying desperately to introduce something implies reasonable doubt, when no one else thinks it is reasonable. What’s interesting is trying to figure out why Bricker switched to defense attorney mode on this particular issue. I’ll actually put it that way. If this belief was a crime, and was put forth to a jury, I believe they would (unanimously) convict them of this belief with the evidence that has been offered. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/464 "2015-06-06T07:02:08Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > But that’s an argument from incredulity. It’s what what Gothard, who is effectively their cult leader, believes. It’s what someone who escaped actually says they believe. Lasciel says that women in the Quiverfull movement are taught that sexual things are their fault. There’s article upon article stating this as their beliefs, yet the Duggars have not felt the need to contradict them. > > He’s demanding direct evidence when direct evidence is not needed. Despite everyone proving it to the satisfaction of everyone else here, he refuses to believe it. > > **It still boils down to him thinking** that there’s no way the Duggars believe this specific teaching of Gothard, despite us showing that they adhere to the others. It’s like he’s the defense lawyer trying desperately to introduce something implies reasonable doubt, when no one else thinks it is reasonable. What’s interesting is trying to figure out why Bricker switched to defense attorney mode on this particular issue. > > I’ll actually put it that way. If this belief was a crime, and was put forth to a jury, I believe they would (unanimously) convict them of this belief with the evidence that has been offered. You **may** be overstating what can be **unqualifiedly** asserted about what he thinks. Why don’t you ask him? ---
**Author:** ![WolfpackJeep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpackjeep/32/2921_2.png) [@WolfpackJeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WolfpackJeep)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/465 "2015-06-06T07:55:56Z")
“…most of it while [the] girls were sleeping…” _Why_ do they keep bringing this up as justification for their pervert son’s actions??? Do they not have lawyers or PR folks who could spin it a little better? And what about the other incidents that definitely weren’t while the victims were sleeping, or over clothes? ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/466 "2015-06-06T11:02:10Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > You **may** be overstating what can be **unqualifiedly** asserted about what he thinks. Why don’t you ask him? Because this is not a thread about Bricker. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/467 "2015-06-06T11:21:42Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > “…most of it while [the] girls were sleeping…” > > _Why_ do they keep bringing this up as justification for their pervert son’s actions??? Do they not have lawyers or PR folks who could spin it a little better? And what about the other incidents that definitely weren’t while the victims were sleeping, or over clothes? I think they’re trying to argue that the girls weren’t actually hurt by any of it. Which I, personally, do not believe. It’s all part of arguing why it wasn’t really a crime (even if it was) and there was no need to involve secular authorities. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/468 "2015-06-06T11:25:21Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Because this is not a thread about Bricker. Fair enough. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/469 "2015-06-06T11:46:29Z")
Does anyone truly believe: It was only these few times… It was while they were asleep… It was only over their clothes… I see no reason to believe a single one of these things. None of them pass the sniff test. None! ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/470 "2015-06-06T12:23:02Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I think they’re trying to argue that the girls weren’t actually hurt by any of it. Which I, personally, do not believe. It’s all part of arguing why it wasn’t really a crime (even if it was) and there was no need to involve secular authorities. In my opinion, it’s actually a bit different - they’re trying to protect the girls’ modesty and purity by broadcasting that they had no idea anything was going on (except for those times they did…) so that they can continue to think of them as pure and innocent (and less charitably, to continue to marry the remaining girls off to godly sons of prominent men in the movement). Sins of lust are all twisted up, so if they admitted that the girls were aware of the molestation, the girls would be considered by a lot of people (probably not their parents, but maybe them also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole they are) to be complicit in the molestation. At the very least, if they were awake, that brings in the spectre of impure behavior by the girls. The ‘logic’ here is: If they were awake, they are responsible for their presentation and their actions; to not be ‘stumbling blocks’ to their brothers (brothers here referring to any boy in their social circle - we were all brothers/sisters, which I don’t think helps at all) by carefully monitoring their speech and clothing and behavior to prevent men from noticing them and being incited to lust. Since Josh felt moved to molest them, his inappropriate sexual urges has been constantly attributed to women dressing or behaving ‘immodestly’ - and the only ‘women’ in this situation are the sisters. So, simple fix - they weren’t awake! Now, what we don’t know is if it is actually true that they were asleep, or if they pretended to be asleep (to their parents, to each other?) to keep from having to deal with the issue at all, or if the parents are taking the ‘sleeping’ instances and referring exclusively to them unless pinned down directly. But that (in my opinion) is why they’re hitting that so hard. ---
**Author:** ![Honey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honey/32/5074_2.png) [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/471 "2015-06-06T12:47:01Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > According to the latest released report, the Duggars sent Josh to a treatment facility run by Harold Walker. That would be the [Little Rock Training Center](http://ati.iblp.org/ati/students/locations/littlerock/), founded by Bill Gothard. So how can anyone believe that the counseling the family members received was NOT in line with the ATI teachings? I mean, we have seen the victim blaming documents that ATI distributed. That the center that’s located in a building, donated to Gothard by Hobby Lobby. ---
**Author:** ![Honey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honey/32/5074_2.png) [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/472 "2015-06-06T12:58:38Z")
For _most_ parents, finding out something like this would be the worst thing imaginable. For the Duggars, Josh being _gay_ would be the worst thing imaginable. Diddling his sisters is one thing, but if he were gay? :gasp: He would have been shipped right off to ALERT camp, to get the gay prayed out of him. ---
**Author:** ![Honey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honey/32/5074_2.png) [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/473 "2015-06-06T13:07:53Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/474 "2015-06-06T13:32:49Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Dude, it’s the internet. People bash all kinds of things. For example, I’ve seen a few cheap shots at President Obama over the years. > > As for the Duggars, I can’t recall if I bashed them in this thread or not. I have never seen their show, and never cared how many children they had. “What’s it to you” was pretty much my attitude about this family. I was aware they existed, but really had no opinion of them. Now I do. They are not the type of people I respect, for many reasons. If I’m wrong, and they are truly lovely people, my contempt for them won’t matter any more than your admiration. It’s the internet, nothing matters… Very good response. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/475 "2015-06-06T13:41:45Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Why should we care about any domestic abuse? > > Because we live in a society. Children who grow up in fucked-up homes grow into fucked-up adults who end up fucking things up for everyone. If Josh has been molesting his own children, they could very well grow up molesting _their_ children. Children who will then grow up with emotional and behavior problems, who need public assistance. > > Whenever I’m at the grocery store and I see a parent cussing out their kid in public, I grieve a little. Not just for them, but for my community. I know that that kid probably isn’t going to grow up to be a normal, happy, highly productive person. They will be damaged somehow. And it will be the community who will shoulder the costs of that damage. > > That’s why we should care, **Urbanredneck**. How do you know these kids will grow up “fucked up” like you say? As for me I try to help out by working with parenting organizations and providing support for families. Look I’ve seen kids raised great who turned out rotten and I’ve seen kids come from crappy backgrounds who turned out great. You dont really know. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/476 "2015-06-06T13:54:34Z")
The molested girls were just on tv, shedding tears over how cruel the press is being over his ‘bad choices’. He isn’t defending himself, he’s letting his sister/victims do so. How is that not fucked up? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/477 "2015-06-06T14:15:34Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Look I’ve seen kids raised great who turned out rotten and I’ve seen kids come from crappy backgrounds who turned out great. You dont really know. I agree. But if you look at the numbers, you are talking about extreme outliers. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/478 "2015-06-06T14:42:48Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > How do you know these kids will grow up “fucked up” like you say? As for me I try to help out by working with parenting organizations and providing support for families. > > Look I’ve seen kids raised great who turned out rotten and I’ve seen kids come from crappy backgrounds who turned out great. You dont really know. We know they’re fucked up because they’re on tv lying about the extent of their brother’s criminal activities and trying to shield him from suffering any consequences for it - even the consequence of calling a spade, a spade. People who make excuses for rapists are no better than the rapists themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/479 "2015-06-06T15:27:13Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > How do you know these kids will grow up “fucked up” like you say? As for me I try to help out by working with parenting organizations and providing support for families. > > Look I’ve seen kids raised great who turned out rotten and I’ve seen kids come from crappy backgrounds who turned out great. You dont really know. You can be great \*and \*thoroughly fucked in the head. The two are not mutually exclusive. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2015, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369/480 "2015-06-06T16:56:39Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Does anyone truly believe: > > It was only these few times… > > It was while they were asleep… > > It was only over their clothes… > > I see no reason to believe a single one of these things. None of them pass the sniff test. None! I agree with you. Molestation is like roaches. For every incident you know about, there are probably a slew you don’t know about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/josh-duggar-duggar-kid-1-19-to-be-executive-director-of-family-research-council/661369.md?page=25)