# Judges "of color" to only be replaced by judges "of color" (proposed RI law) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 10, 2017, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484 "2017-02-10T17:36:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2017, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/41 "2017-02-11T17:17:51Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I’m not missing your point. I’m saying it’s nonsense. Never heard of #OscarsSoWhite? > > Two seconds on Google: [Trump’s cabinet is mostly white and male. What will that mean for policy?](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/cabinet-diversity-impact-policy-making/) Cabinet officials and Supreme Court Justices (and Oscar nominees) are news. Federal court appointments usually aren’t. Look at Bush and his appointment of Clarence Thomas. It obviously got a lot of attention. It was one of the two appointments he made to the Supreme Court. But he also appointed 185 other judges and those appointments didn’t any significant press coverage. And only ten of those appointments were black. By appointing a black judge to the Supreme Court, Bush managed to avoid public notice of the disproportionately low percentage of black judicial appointments he was making overall. And that’s not a fluke; you often find cases where institutions that generally underrepresent black people will designate a handful of black people in prominent positions. It’s a way of giving the illusion of diversity while avoiding the reality of it. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2017, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/42 "2017-02-11T17:20:36Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Your reply has nothing to do with my post. I didn’t say they had to be qualified by statute. Name the last federal judge approved by the Senate who wasn’t rated at least qualified by the Bar. The hell it has nothing to do with your post-it is a direct response to this: “Federal judges absolutely must be qualified.” You didn’t mention past history in that statement. I’m sorry I didn’t address what you claim you _meant_ to say. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2017, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/43 "2017-02-11T17:32:40Z")
What I did say, and you misread. An unqualified candidate will never get approved by the Senate. A judge needs to have a specific skill set to do the job. A political appointment usually not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2017, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/44 "2017-02-11T21:05:24Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > A President could appoint three hundred white judges and ten black judges and some people would be asking _“Why did he appoint so many black judges?”_ But nobody would be asking _“Why did he appoint so many white judges?”_ Actually I think it’s perfectly likely that someone would be asking that. People asked that same question about Oscar nominees. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/45 "2017-02-16T12:43:04Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > “white” doesn’t have a legal meaning, but that didn’t stop them from putting it in laws starting in 1681. No legal meaning? I’d disagree. No biological meaning is more like it. Race is merely a social construct. Clearly a silly idea. I hope the concept was brought up tongue in cheek. That said, I would not mind serving on a jury or going to trial with a “person of color” as the judge. Nor would it bother me about either of the opposing attorneys. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/46 "2017-02-16T12:56:23Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why isn’t this posted in the “Stupid Liberal of the Day” BBQ Pit thread? It more than qualifies. Agreed. I’m unfamiliar with the other works of Ms. Williams and I understand the good intent behind the proposal but this is a \*really, really bad way \*to achieve greater diversity on the bench. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/47 "2017-02-16T18:25:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Cabinet officials and Supreme Court Justices (and Oscar nominees) are news. Federal court appointments usually aren’t. > > Look at Bush and his appointment of Clarence Thomas. It obviously got a lot of attention. It was one of the two appointments he made to the Supreme Court. But he also appointed 185 other judges and those appointments didn’t any significant press coverage. And only ten of those appointments were black. > > By appointing a black judge to the Supreme Court, Bush managed to avoid public notice of the disproportionately low percentage of black judicial appointments he was making overall. And that’s not a fluke; you often find cases where institutions that generally underrepresent black people will designate a handful of black people in prominent positions. It’s a way of giving the illusion of diversity while avoiding the reality of it. How many black judges should he have appointed? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/48 "2017-02-16T18:35:14Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > How many black judges should he have appointed? 24.18. I grant you, it would be hard on the judge who was only 18% black, but principles is principles. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/49 "2017-02-16T18:50:19Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > How many black judges should he have appointed? How many white judges should he have appointed? ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/50 "2017-02-16T18:57:12Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > How many white judges should he have appointed? I don’t know, I don’t care, and I don’t care to know. If they are good judges they could all be Samoan or Eskimo. ---
**Author:** ![DerekMichaels00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DerekMichaels00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DerekMichaels00)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/51 "2017-02-16T19:27:44Z")
that this kind of law got proposed, and isn’t either a joke or fake news (like from Gateway Pundit, MintNews, etc) is why I’m no longer a liberal. There’s racial equality, and then there’s racial Marxism. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/52 "2017-02-16T19:29:27Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > that this kind of law got proposed, and isn’t either a joke or fake news (like from Gateway Pundit, MintNews, etc) is why I’m no longer a liberal. There’s racial equality, and then there’s racial Marxism. And yet there are plenty of liberals in this thread who also think it’s a stupid idea. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/53 "2017-02-16T19:50:46Z")
Besides for that this idea doesn’t seem popular even with liberals, I wouldn’t think your positions on issues should be influenced by what other people with the same official ideology believe, one way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/54 "2017-02-16T21:17:32Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > This is a dumb idea and it should not become a law. > > But it’s making an interesting point. If all the judges being appointed were white, would there be a public outcry? But make a suggestion that _some_ judges not be white and suddenly there’s outrage. If all the judges were white _and were appointed because they are white_, then there should be outrage. There is a difference between ending up with all white judges and mandating all judges need to be white\*. It also ignores the qualified pool. How many people are qualified to be a judge (note, I know there is no official qualification needed, but most of the time the people nominated have at least some experience in the field) that fit the requirements? I did some checking and found [this](https://apps.americanbar.org/abanet/jd/display/national.cfm)site. It lists the percentage of judges that are minorities by state and nationwide. Interestingly, South Carolina (9%), Mississippi(16%), Georgia(11%), Alabama(6%) and Arkansas (10%) , the deep south states, have pretty high percentages. Nationwide the breakdown is: Circuit 14% (202) County 38% (539) District 23% (329) Statewide 6% (80) Subcircuits/Subdistricts 8% (108) Interestingly, according to that link, Rhode Island has 0 out of 27. The demographics for lawyers is: White 88% Black 5% Asian Pacific American 2% American Indian \<1% Hawaiian/Pacific Islander \<1% Total minority= ~ 8% [Link](http://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/aba/administrative/market_research/lawyer-demographics-tables-2016.authcheckdam.pdf). So, it appears out of the lawyer pool which is 9% minority, minorities in judgeships are over represented. Slee \*Is it racism or is it numbers? Not always clear which is which ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/55 "2017-02-16T21:44:10Z")
One thing I’ve always found somewhat odd is that on average people (both white and black) tend to wildly overestimate the percentage of the population that they assume to be black. (The same is true of gay.) I can’t imagine this doesn’t color people’s perceptions of whether or not there is discrimination of this sort. ---
**Author:** ![greenmario](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/97f17d/32.png) [@greenmario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greenmario)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/56 "2017-02-16T21:57:49Z")
Like many others have pointed out, “person of color” isnt a strong legal term. It rankles me when people seem to assume that any person of color will feel represented by another person of color. Let’s say this law passes and we see a surge of Latino judges. There would be many judges of color, but Asians, Indians, and Blacks would still be underrepresented. Would we then see a follow up law that switches “person of color” with “person of color that isn’t brown”? ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484/57 "2017-02-16T22:24:59Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > There’s racial equality, and then there’s racial Marxism. What do you mean by racial Marxism? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judges-of-color-to-only-be-replaced-by-judges-of-color-proposed-ri-law/779484.md?page=2)