# Judging state flags **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 2, 2015, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094 "2015-07-02T23:58:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/61 "2015-07-06T03:02:21Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > I, too, didn’t catch [the Arksansas-Confederate flag association] until explicitly pointed out. Which is all the more reason it’s disingenuous to characterize trying to remove it as being pro-Confederacy. We’d already be acquiescing to the idea that the use of the stars in blue diagonals inherently is connected to the Confederacy–despite the fact that this was not the reason that design was used. Nothing about the design of the flag is Confederacy based, other than that fourth star. If it were, there would have been no reason to add that star. It just looks similar, and that’s the only reason to change it–to avoid unintentional associations. In fact, we’d be losing a key part of the symbolism of the flag–Arkansas’s pride at being the 25th state. But, since we need to remove that fourth star and, for design reasons, shouldn’t have our name on the flag, we already need a redesign. If you’re going to cite history, then the stars can stay. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/62 "2015-07-06T04:20:15Z")
> [@Icerigger](#): > > I am afraid my PA flag sucks, just the state seal on a blue field. Considering the discussions of some of the other flags, maybe we should change the state motto to “Lots to see but nothing really worth talking about”? 🙂 Artistically I don’t think ours is very bad. As flags or state seals go we may not have the best in the universe but its fairly easy to spot and remember. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/63 "2015-07-06T04:55:26Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > Just to show their total lack of class, New Jersey stole Idaho’s flag? 😃 > > Well, [theirs](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_New_Jersey.svg) isn’t all that inspiring, so do you blame them? Given the state’s Mafia associations, they should just have the horses head. In a bed. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/64 "2015-07-06T13:01:37Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Given the state’s Mafia associations, they should just have the horses head. > > In a bed. Well, since I can’t figure out how you render a horse’s head in a bed so that it will read at flag distances, I went looking for other alternatives. [This](http://marmocet.deviantart.com/art/A-Proposal-for-a-New-Flag-of-New-Jersey-345386938) alternative seems to be nice and graphical, and it represents the state. I’d go with it. That guy has ideas for a few alternative flags, I personally like his [Louisiana](http://marmocet.deviantart.com/art/Proposal-for-a-New-Flag-of-Louisiana-345525423). ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/65 "2015-07-06T13:22:45Z")
Let’s not get too down on state seal flags. [Michigan](http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/us-mi.html), of course, are the leaders and best of this crowd. The seal is a classic masterpiece with the elk and moose posing to hold up the shield and the Latin motto under it, on it, and above it. A thing of beauty, it is. I’m not too crazy about the musket-bearing frontiersman but other than that a very classic design, much better than our backward southern neighbor who can’t even get the shape of the flag right. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/66 "2015-07-06T14:39:38Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Which is all the more reason it’s disingenuous to characterize trying to remove it as being pro-Confederacy. We’d already be acquiescing to the idea that the use of the stars in blue diagonals inherently is connected to the Confederacy–despite the fact that this was not the reason that design was used. > > Nothing about the design of the flag is Confederacy based, other than that fourth star. If it were, there would have been no reason to add that star. It just looks similar, and that’s the only reason to change it–to avoid unintentional associations. > > In fact, we’d be losing a key part of the symbolism of the flag–Arkansas’s pride at being the 25th state. But, since we need to remove that fourth star and, for design reasons, shouldn’t have our name on the flag, we already need a redesign. > > If you’re going to cite history, then the stars can stay. I agree with this. When you start down the path of removing history, where does it stop? For instance, 6 flags is named for the 6 flags that have flown over Texas in its history. One of those flags was the confederate flag. Do they need to rename the company/theme park 5 flags? Because that is the same thing as removing that one star on the Arkansas flag. (And count me in as someone who didn’t know that the Arkansas flag even had that significance added to the one star on their current flag.) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/67 "2015-07-06T15:24:27Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Maryland’s is the best in my opinion, I realize Lord Baltimore’s coat of arms isn’t ‘American’, but still, there is way too many blue flags with two coonskinned capped dudes standing next to a circle. > [@even\_sven](#): > > I hate, hate, hate Maryland’s flag. I used to eat at this Italian chain restaurant decked out in Italian horse racing flags, and the Maryland flag would have fit right in. I’ve spent nearly 20 years of my life in Maryland, including 2 years way back in childhood, and I’ve _always_ hated Maryland’s flag. You know how some people wear stuff where nothing they’re wearing goes with anything else they’re wearing? That’s the Maryland flag. The colors in two quadrants totally clash with the colors in the other two quadrants, and that goes double for the shapes. I’m surprised that epileptics don’t have seizures just from looking at our flag. It’s one of the few state flags that IMHO actually looks _worse_ than all the state-seal-on-blue-field flags. > [@psychobunny](#): > > Come on. Virginia has violence _and_ bare nipples! Virginia FTW! I’ve spent close to 30 years of my life in Virginia, but this is the first time I’ve looked at the seal up close. The person on top doesn’t look like a woman at all, despite the visible boob. He looks like a guy with a very weird man-boob. Of the other states where I’ve spent a decent amount of time, South Carolina’s is easily the best, even if it does have that Islamic crescent moon. 😉 (The other states in question being California, Kansas, Tennessee, Florida, Connecticut, and D.C.) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/68 "2015-07-06T17:44:25Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > When you start down the path of removing history, where does it stop? When you ignore or minimize 395 years of history to concentrate only on the 5 really bad racist years. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/69 "2015-07-06T17:56:12Z")
Nm ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/70 "2015-07-06T17:58:53Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > I’ve spent nearly 20 years of my life in Maryland, including 2 years way back in childhood, and I’ve _always_ hated Maryland’s flag. > > You know how some people wear stuff where nothing they’re wearing goes with anything else they’re wearing? That’s the Maryland flag. The colors in two quadrants totally clash with the colors in the other two quadrants, and that goes double for the shapes. I’m surprised that epileptics don’t have seizures just from looking at our flag. > > It’s one of the few state flags that IMHO actually looks _worse_ than all the state-seal-on-blue-field flags. Hear, hear. Exactly what I’ve always disliked about Maryland’s flag. It’s even more jangling when used on a football helmet, _a la_ the current Maryland Terrapins. Just yuck. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/71 "2015-07-06T18:08:56Z")
Born and raised in MD. I love our flag. Bold and striking, with great heraldic connections to our past. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/72 "2015-07-06T18:09:33Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > Hear, hear. Exactly what I’ve always disliked about Maryland’s flag. It’s even more jangling when used on a football helmet, _a la_ the current Maryland Terrapins. Just yuck. To be fair, Maryland wears completely different uniforms every game so perhaps the helmet won’t always feature the flag so prominently. And you have to give them some credit, nobody but nobody loves their state flag more than Marylanders. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/73 "2015-07-06T18:26:43Z")
Going back to the Colorado flag, I rather like it. The C is a letter, yes, but it’s simple enough not to be distracting or hard to distinguish. The end result comes out looking like a roundel like what you might see on a fighter plane. For the North Carolina flag, I can assure you as a Texan, if they remove the text and just leave it with the white star in a blue field, it will never be mixed up with a Texas flag because the colors of the bars are reversed. When displaying the Texas flag remember: Bandage over Blood. Evidently the NCers are just a lot more hardcore than we are. Texas Flag: It’s fine, but it needs to be larger than the other state flags. It is a bit derivative of the Stars and Stripes though, making it risk getting lost in the sea of similar flags (NC, PR, Chile, etc.) I like the California flag. Lose the text and it won’t suffer for it. As an alternative, just fashion a flag based on a Hollwood Walk of Fame star. For the Mississippi Flag… boy, where to start. First, they change their flag every six weeks it seems, and they just can’t walk away from the whole unpleasantness with the slaveholder insurrection. I propose a tricolor flag, red, white, and blue, with the blue field representing the Misissippi River. Not sure entirely how to arrange the colors. ---
**Author:** ![Gordon\_Urquhart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/db5fbb/32.png) [@Gordon\_Urquhart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gordon_Urquhart)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/74 "2015-07-06T18:55:56Z")
> [@Raguleader](#): > > Going back to the Colorado flag, I rather like it. The C is a letter, yes, but it’s simple enough not to be distracting or hard to distinguish. The end result comes out looking like a roundel like what you might see on a fighter plane. I’m biased, of course, but I love the Colorado flag. It’s simple but powerful, and the design makes its way onto all kinds of marketing materials here in the state, many of which have little or nothing to do with marijuana. The red “C” and gold circle inset can be seen on countless t-shirts, bumper stickers, and business signs – it’s an immediately and easily identifiable symbol, which isn’t something that can be said for the designs of many other state flags. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/75 "2015-07-06T19:07:10Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > Born and raised in MD. I love our flag. Bold and striking, with great heraldic connections to our past. It’s awesome. Our Official State Sport is _jousting_! Fuck. Yeah. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/76 "2015-07-06T21:06:17Z")
Hoo boy, the Wisconsin flag. When I was a kid, it was just the state seal on a field of blue. So in 1981 they said “Man, we have to do something, there are all these other state flags that are _also_ state shields on fields of blue!” And in a moment of inspiration, someone said “I know! We can add the word “WISCONSIN” on there! And the year ‘1848’!” It’s embarrassing. But still not as bad as the city flag of [Milwaukee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Milwaukee#/media/File:Flag_of_Milwaukee,_Wisconsin.svg) ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/77 "2015-07-06T21:32:41Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > It’s embarrassing. But still not as bad as the city flag of [Milwaukee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Milwaukee#/media/File:Flag_of_Milwaukee,_Wisconsin.svg) And the worst part of the Milwaukee flag? Buried amid all the clutter is a perfectly good flag. Why didn’t they just use that? ---
**Author:** ![ThisSpaceForRent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thisspaceforrent/32/345_2.png) [@ThisSpaceForRent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisSpaceForRent)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/78 "2015-07-06T21:43:15Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Hoo boy, the Wisconsin flag. > > When I was a kid, it was just the state seal on a field of blue. So in 1981 they said “Man, we have to do something, there are all these other state flags that are _also_ state shields on fields of blue!” > > And in a moment of inspiration, someone said “I know! We can add the word “WISCONSIN” on there! And the year ‘1848’!” > > It’s embarrassing. But still not as bad as the city flag of [Milwaukee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Milwaukee#/media/File:Flag_of_Milwaukee,_Wisconsin.svg) My adopted home town, St.Louis MO has a pretty cool city flag… > **[Flag of St. Louis](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_St._Louis)** > > The flag of St. Louis, Missouri consists of a solid red background and three thick, wavy lines colored blue and white extending from the top left corner, bottom left corner, and center right edge. At the intersection of these lines there is a yellow disk containing a blue fleur-de-lis.\[a\] > The flag was designed by Yale University professor Theodore Sizer and officially adopted in 1964. > In a 2004 poll on the North American Vexillological Association website, St. Louis’ flag was voted the fifth... ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/79 "2015-07-06T21:58:10Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Given the state’s Mafia associations, they should just have the horses head. > > In a bed. You will note, however, that the golden helmet underneath the horse’s head looks to be drenched in red. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/80 "2015-07-06T23:27:28Z")
Hey, I give Jersey some credit for putting their design on a buff field, rather than the omnipresent navy blue. Shows a bit of originality. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094.md?page=5)