# Judging state flags **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 2, 2015, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094 "2015-07-02T23:58:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/81 "2015-07-07T00:06:14Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > It’s embarrassing. But still not as bad as the city flag of [Milwaukee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Milwaukee#/media/File:Flag_of_Milwaukee,_Wisconsin.svg) I wonder how many city meetings were devoted to deciding that they needed a little genii in a flying-saucer lamp, but that his halo would need to be short one spoke on the right hand side. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/82 "2015-07-07T14:02:13Z")
> [@mbh](#): > > And the worst part of the Milwaukee flag? Buried amid all the clutter is a perfectly good flag. Why didn’t they just use that? That’s a very good question! It turns out that was the city’s Civil War battle flag, so it has history behind it. It really is a fine flag! ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/83 "2015-07-07T14:03:24Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > I wonder how many city meetings were devoted to deciding that they needed a little genii in a flying-saucer lamp, but that his halo would need to be short one spoke on the right hand side. Also, who decided that there needed to be a ship, but that it should sort of hover over and in front of the water, rather than, say, floating in the water? ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/84 "2015-07-07T15:35:55Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > I disagree with you on Arizona, though. Looks like a colourblind superhero motif. Asymetric sunburst in \*four \*different colours, each more garish than the next ?! Get out of here. Also, orange star is orange. Y’can’t have an orange star. In fact, y’can’t have orange on yer flag, period. Thems are the rules, wot I make 'em up. The star is supposed to be copper-colored, it just looks orange or (more often kinda brown) when printed. I think the star on the blue bottom field is pretty handsome but agree on the garish sunburst. During World War II there was a move to change the sunburst to something else as it was felt it was too similar to Japan’s battle banner, but it came to naught. You can blame all those state-seal-on-blue state flags on the Civil War. A state regiment would be formed up and they would discover they didn’t have a state flag to march behind. Being in a hurry, they’d slap the state seal on a field of bluse and call it done. Some of them even used the color and dimension specs for Union Army regimental flags in the legislative description. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/85 "2015-07-07T16:29:04Z")
What I don’t get about city and county flags is, why they’re needed at all. I wouldn’t be able to identify the flags of any of the cities or counties that I’ve lived in, other than the flag of the county I live in now. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/86 "2015-07-07T18:10:56Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > What I don’t get about city and county flags is, why they’re needed at all. I wouldn’t be able to identify the flags of any of the cities or counties that I’ve lived in, other than the flag of the county I live in now. Roman Mars of the “99 Percent Invisible” radio show has talked about how a well designed city flag—particularly the Chicago and D.C. flags—can serve as a popular and strong symbol of civic pride that serves important symbol functions to the local people in ways that commercial sports or college symbols are not broadbased enough to cover. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2015, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/87 "2015-07-07T22:35:22Z")
After seeing the Milwaukee flag, I got to wondering “Huh, city flags? I didn’t know those existed. What does Cleveland’s look like?”, and Googled it yesterday. Only to notice today that it’s actually flying out in front of my place of work. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/88 "2015-07-08T00:15:13Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Also, orange star is orange. Y’can’t have an orange star. In fact, y’can’t have orange on yer flag, period. Thems are the rules, wot I make 'em up. > **[K-type main-sequence star](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K-type_main-sequence_star)** > > A K-type main-sequence star, also referred to as a K-type dwarf, or orange dwarf, is a main-sequence (hydrogen-burning) star of spectral type K and luminosity class V. These stars are intermediate in size between red M-type main-sequence stars ("red dwarfs") and yellow/white G-type main-sequence stars. They have masses between 0.6 and 0.9 times the mass of the Sun and surface temperatures between 3,900 and 5,300 K. These stars are of particular interest in the search for extraterrestrial life In... [http://karlwilcox.com/parker/?page\_id=2926](http://karlwilcox.com/parker/?page_id=2926) ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/89 "2015-07-08T05:03:30Z")
Not all states are US states. There’s a whole world outside the USA and many countries are in fact federations of various types. And many of those non-US states also have flags, including some good, many bad, and more than a few WTF?s. Wikipedia’ s [Flags of country subdivisions](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_country_subdivisions) page. Navigating through the links will show you that state flag fails are not just an American thing. Here’s a few highlights: [Flag of Jujuy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jujuy_Province#/media/File:Bandera_de_la_Provincia_de_Jujuy.svg) province, Argentina. [Coquimbo Region](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coquimbo_Region#/media/File:Flag_of_Coquimbo_Region,_Chile.svg), Chile Flag of [Amazonas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Amazonas_Department#/media/File:Flag_of_Amazonas_%28Colombia%29.svg) department, Colombia [Hermanas Mirabal province](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8c/Bandera_de_la_Provincia_de_Hermanas_Mirabal.PNG), Dominican Republic [Bong county](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bong_County#/media/File:Flag_of_Bong_County.svg), Liberia [Friesland](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Friesland_%28province%29#/media/File:Frisian_flag.svg) province, Netherlands [Yilan County](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yilan_County,_Taiwan#/media/File:Flag_of_Yilan_County.svg), Taiwan …and hundreds more. The terrible ones outnumber the good ones by about 20:1. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/90 "2015-07-08T06:15:25Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > 2(a). These flags would be perfectly fine from a design perspective except for their Confederate associations: > > — Alabama: [Flag of Alabama - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Alabama#/media/File:Flag_of_Alabama.svg) To me it brings to mind the Cross of Burgundy (minus the fletching) or a St. Andrew’s Cross. While apparently it was inspired by a Confederate regimental flag, the association is pretty distant and it is officially defined as a St. Andrew’s Cross; that’s a common heraldic motif by itself. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/91 "2015-07-08T11:15:12Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > To me it brings to mind the Cross of Burgundy (minus the fletching) or a St. Andrew’s Cross. > > While apparently it was inspired by a Confederate regimental flag, the association is pretty distant and it is officially defined as a St. Andrew’s Cross; that’s a common heraldic motif by itself. See post #59. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/92 "2015-07-08T14:35:48Z")
Yuck, they are all ugly. And your top listed one is especially atrocious. I was almost blinded when I opened the link. Sorry. I agree with the original poster - scrap 'em all. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/93 "2015-07-08T14:52:43Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > California violates the cardinal vexillological rule of “No words, dammit! And especially not the name of the thing you’re representing!”, but **it is pretty badass–a bear! a big giant bear!** –and maybe gets a pass on that for historical reasons. Grizzlies are certainly badass, but the the “model” used for the flag ([Monarch](http://www.scpr.org/programs/take-two/2012/10/24/28981/monarch-the-sad-amazing-story-of-the-bear-on-calif/)) lived a miserable life and died in captivity. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/94 "2015-07-08T15:13:29Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > To me it brings to mind the Cross of Burgundy (minus the fletching) or a St. Andrew’s Cross. > > While apparently it was inspired by a Confederate regimental flag, the association is pretty distant and it is officially defined as a St. Andrew’s Cross; that’s a common heraldic motif by itself. St Andrew’s Cross is white on blue; it’s the national flag of Scotland. (Though there are other variations; see link.) What we have here is a St Patrick’s Cross, which represents Ireland. Both are featured on the UK’s Union Jack (England, Scotland, Northern Ireland). Both crosses are referred to in heraldry as saltires, BTW. > **[Saltire](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saltire)** > > A saltire, also called Saint Andrew's Cross or the crux decussata, is a heraldic symbol in the form of a diagonal cross. The word comes from the Middle French sautoir, Medieval Latin saltatoria ("stirrup"). > From its use as field sign, the saltire came to be used in a number of flags, in the 16th century for Scotland and Burgundy, in the 18th century also as the ensign of the Russian Navy, and for Ireland. Notable 19th-century usage includes some of the flags of the Confederate States of America.... ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2015, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/95 "2015-07-08T17:01:48Z")
> [@blondebear](#): > > Grizzlies are certainly badass, but the the “model” used for the flag ([Monarch](http://www.scpr.org/programs/take-two/2012/10/24/28981/monarch-the-sad-amazing-story-of-the-bear-on-calif/)) lived a miserable life and died in captivity. ☹ I dunno, he lived pretty long for a bear. Captured 1889 died 1911. Average in the wild is 22 years. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2015, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/96 "2015-07-09T14:27:06Z")
I’ve discovered that my current County does not have a flag. I should remedy this. ---
**Author:** ![syncrolecyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@syncrolecyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/syncrolecyne)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2015, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/97 "2015-07-10T06:58:13Z")
I am partial to the New Mexico flag, even though it is so yellow. I loved the New Mexico centennial license plate. If the flag were like this, it would be great.[https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/af/Nm\_centennial\_100\_plate.png](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/af/Nm_centennial_100_plate.png) While not a state, I also like the Puerto Rican flag, as it is so recognizable and alludes to both the U.S. can Cuban flags. The Tennessee flag to me looks like a simplified, more abstract U.S. flag. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2015, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/98 "2015-07-10T14:05:21Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Hoo boy, the Wisconsin flag. > > When I was a kid, it was just the state seal on a field of blue. So in 1981 they said “Man, we have to do something, there are all these other state flags that are _also_ state shields on fields of blue!” > > And in a moment of inspiration, someone said “I know! We can add the word “WISCONSIN” on there! And the year ‘1848’!” > > It’s embarrassing. But still not as bad as the city flag of [Milwaukee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Milwaukee#/media/File:Flag_of_Milwaukee,_Wisconsin.svg) That Milwaukee flag looks like the illustration of the proverb “Too many cooks spoil the broth”. I can just imagine the committee meeting (oh, come on, you _know_ that flag was designed by a committee): “We’ve got to have water, for the lake and the river, of course.” “And a ship.” “Yeah, but what about a church?” “_I_ think it needs a big gear, for industry.” “And a ship.” “Wait, we have agriculture, too!” “Okay, a gear, a church, a stalk of wheat…” “_And_ a ship.” “Oh, what the hell, throw in a ship, too. Any other business? No? Good, we’re adjourned.” I’m surprised they didn’t include a beer can. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2015, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/99 "2015-07-10T14:43:49Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > [Yep. The circle is an “O”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Ohio#Design). > > Also, it’s apparently a “burgee”, rather than a pennant. Yes, I’m a pedant. But the circle also represents the buckeye, the state tree, which I think makes it acceptable for “writing.” I’m from Ohio and our flag is my favorite, if only for the burgee shape. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2015, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judging-state-flags/724094/100 "2015-07-10T16:53:50Z")
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