# July 4th note in Family Bible **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 3, 2022, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346 "2022-07-03T14:15:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/1 "2022-07-03T14:15:30Z")
A tattered, old Bible was in my youngest son’s library when he passed away. The Bible was purchased by Moses Smith in Pittsburgh PA in 1733. It contains extensive Smith family history and several notes on events: [![](https://i.imgur.com/XdjaPqo.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/XdjaPqo.jpg) There are Smiths in our lineage but unfortunately not these Smiths. I doubt the bible has monetary value, but it should be preserved. Perhaps a genealogy library or museum. Any thoughts? ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/2 "2022-07-03T15:41:21Z")
I’m not sure why you don’t think it has any monetary value. It’s old and contains someone’s family history, You can have it authenticated if you’re not 100% sure it’s real. This would be a great item to have appraised on the Antiques Roadshow if they are ever in your neck of the woods. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/3 "2022-07-03T15:52:33Z")
The book probably isn’t that valuable. Could you scan the images with the family history and upload them to ancestry.ca? That’s what I did with my grandfather’s school records. I didn’t see the point of keeping deteriorating paper with not much information, but the list of names might be valuable to someone. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/4 "2022-07-03T16:43:41Z")
The Bible was given to my first wife about fifty years ago. She was active in genealogy and uploaded the records to [Ancestory.com](http://Ancestory.com) when that became available. I assume it is authentic. The covers are gone and the acid in the ink on the first page has dissolved the paper. It is an interesting artifact. It needs a good home. I can give it care but not curate it. Also hazards like hurricanes are a concern. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/5 "2022-07-03T16:50:09Z")
There are genealogy facebook groups that reunite genealogically interesting items (photos often) with family members who will enjoy them. Not super easy to find though, let me get back to you with that. ETA: Found at least one. This is a non-profit that attempts to rescue family bibles: [Bible Rescue](https://www.facebook.com/BibleRescue) ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/6 "2022-07-03T17:00:00Z")
Thanks - I’ll look into that. Also, I’ll follow up on the information that was posted on [Ancestory.com](http://Ancestory.com). I understand there is communication with other users. I have my wife’s computer and the account is still active. Will have to learn the process. ---
**Author:** ![Lancia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lancia/32/17174_2.png) [@Lancia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lancia)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/7 "2022-07-03T17:26:23Z")
As a genealogical tool it may have value only to whatever Smith family that book pertains to. However as a primary source documenting the Declaration of Independence it’s likely valuable to a museum, university research library, or collector of Americana. I’d offer to purchase it for [my collection](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-at-this-stuff-isnt-it-neat-show-us-your-collections-of-things/958550/22) – I have two antique bibles in my collection as well as the Gryphius NT copy – but I’ve paused my acquisitions at the moment for financial reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/8 "2022-07-03T17:37:15Z")
Were the notes before and after that written around the same time? Because my understanding is that no one at the time recognized July 4 as the big significant date. According to the Wikipedia article, the Second Continental Congress voted to approve the resolution of independence on July 2, and many signed the Declaration of Independence on August 2. Sure the document we’re all familiar with says July 4, but when did people in far-off Pittsburgh hear about it? In short, my guess is that someone sometime later added that note. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/9 "2022-07-03T18:57:31Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > I’m not sure why you don’t think it has any monetary value. Because most bibles don’t. > **[Is My Old Bible Worth Money? | How to Find the Value of Antique Bibles](https://www.regencyantiquebooks.com/books/is-my-old-bible-worth-money/)** > > What an old Bible is worth depends on what shape it’s in, its age and rarity. Learn a few points that make a difference in the value of your antique Bible. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/10 "2022-07-03T21:44:36Z")
Sure, but this Bible is over 200 years old and it’s inscribed. Some people collect antique Bibles so I’m pretty sure someone would pay good money to get their hands on it, assuming it’s in reasonably good condition for its age. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2022, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/11 "2022-07-03T22:19:47Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > This would be a great item to have appraised on the Antiques Roadshow if they are ever in your neck of the woods. Antiques Roadshow evaluators have said more than once that the most common item brought to roadshows is old bibles. 99.99% are essentially worthless. This one would probably only have value if it could be linked to someone important in history. Otherwise, they’re literally a dime a dozen. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/12 "2022-07-04T02:20:31Z")
If the 1776 inscription is real it’s worth something. Hell, I’d pay $100 for it. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/13 "2022-07-04T02:30:49Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > Hell, I’d pay $100 for it. And you’re a dolphin! Imagine what a human would offer! ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/14 "2022-07-04T05:38:43Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > In short, my guess is that someone sometime later added that note. Could be. There was a James Smith of New Jersey who was a signatory of the Declaration, but of course there may be no connection. If the entry was added later, it probably wasn’t a whole lot later, as the medial ‘S’ had disappeared from use in the US by 1820. OP, I’d check with a Pennsylvania university or possibly the Library of Congress. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/15 "2022-07-04T12:19:45Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > In short, my guess is that someone sometime later added that note. I assume it is contemporary but not necessarily on the July 4 date. I was wrong about the place of purchase. So far, I haven’t found any reference to a place. None of the birth or death dates give a location. Inscription on detached first page: [![](https://i.imgur.com/pTzTN93.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/pTzTN93.jpg) List of deaths beginning with Moses Smith: [![](https://i.imgur.com/wGBbUOk.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/wGBbUOk.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/16 "2022-07-04T13:39:06Z")
Perhaps because it’s on an interior page, but the July 4 inscription is much clearer than those. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/17 "2022-07-04T17:48:31Z")
What is on the left of the 4th of July entry? I see the word “war”. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/18 "2022-07-04T18:27:38Z")
What is on the left of the 4th of July entry? I see the word “war”. Here: [![](https://i.imgur.com/2jjbp2E.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/2jjbp2E.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/19 "2022-07-04T19:21:43Z")
OP, I took the liberty of looking up Moses Smith on Ancestry and other genealogy sites. That death date really narrowed it down, and I’m certain that I’ve found your man. Your Bible lists the deaths of Chester, Levi, and Sara, and the Moses Smith I found had sons named Chester and Levi, and a wife named Sara. While Smith was and is an extremely common name, and Moses was fairly popular in the 18th century, the exact death date and the family member names are convincing. The odds of having the same death date, wife, and two sons with those names (“Chester” was never THAT popular.) are pretty remote. “Your” Moses Smith was actually Moses Smith, Jr.. He was born in Hadley, MA, on December 10, 1733 to Moses and Hannah Smith and died in Shelburne, MA, on the date in your Bible. Moses, Sr. was [one of the founders of Amherst, MA](https://books.google.com/books?id=VswTAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA109&lpg=PA109&dq=%22Moses+Smith%22+%22Hannah+Childs%22&source=bl&ots=t4cGr8YPeN&sig=JW8amsDWhQTqIDLci1A-m7WK2oE&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjFzPCPsI7VAhXBhFQKHVDQCfM4ChDoAQgpMAI#v=onepage&q=%22Moses%20Smith%22%20%22Hannah%20Childs%22&f=false) (where I worked for two years). I’m pretty sure for that reason the [Amherst Historical Society](https://amhersthistory.org/) would be eager to have the Bible. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2022, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346/20 "2022-07-04T19:23:38Z")
Profuse thanks - I will contact them and let you know the result. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/july-4th-note-in-family-bible/967346.md?page=2)