emphasis mine:
(I have posted this before)
I am convince that if OSHA regulated football like they do a manufacturing plant, that football would be shutdown quicker than you can Jack Robinson.
In my old manufacturing plant, if we an accident rate (Lost time accidents + Modified Work) that was 1/100th of what NFL Football has, our CEO and Brass would go ballistic.
BU does want to analyze Seau’s brain.
I caught the end of interview with a player who said he expected to “have issues down the line” from all the hits. What a scary thought.
Chris Henry was the first one for me. When I read the news of his autopsy results, that he had the equivalent brain of a senior citizen from his CTE, I was stunned. I really don’t know where the NFL goes from here. It feels like the tobacco execs must’ve, in the late 50s when the first clinical studies came back, telling them that their product was killing people.
I don’t know whether the NFL can address the issue by getting rid of special teams, mandating rugby-like tackling, or some technological method, but they’re going to have to think of something. Even if the NFL continues status quo ante, I’d think the data is going to start indicating that letting kids play tackle football is tantamount to child abuse. No more kids starting the sport, eventually you have no sport.
Those of you that are in your 50s +, wasn’t boxing part of your high school’s P.E. programs? (Maybe only for those 70 and older directly remember it?) And wasn’t boxing one of the most popular sports of the day? I don’t see any reason why tackle football can’t follow a similar arc if things don’t change.
Just terrible news. I hope Seau is at peace now.
This is affecting me in a way I didn’t expect, as I’m not a football fan. But even I recognized this guy as a commentator, and had an impression of him as a smiling, friendly guy. I think I’m haunted by the idea that these guys are possibly walking around with what amounts to a ticking time bomb in their heads, because of injuries that are still not taken seriously enough. It makes me wonder if he had even very faint brain injury that affected his impulse control. It’s frightening as hell.
It makes me angry that the self-serving angle the media has latched onto is the unsupported and possibly irrelevant concussion symptom one instead of the more likely depression one which actually needs some awareness raised.
Can’t the two issues be intertwined?
This syndrome is very real. There are high profile athletes that are still alive that are entering into the phase. Terry Bradshaw and Jim McMahon come to mind immediately. Troy Aikmen can’t be far behind.
Yet, these guys get the media attention. The same condition is occurring with returning veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan who have been the victims of roadside bombs. Many of them show little physical damage but their brain has been concussed to the point that they are experiencing early onset of dementia.
I think you need to put more study into the issue. The statistics don’t support your contention. If you want to read an exceptional account, read the series of articles in the NY Time that ran at the first of the year on Derek Boogaard.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/06/sports/hockey/derek-boogaard-a-brain-going-bad.html?pagewanted=all
This is Pulitzer Prize worthy reporting.
Yes, absolutely. I’ve seen it up close and personal. On the SLI web page that I cited earlier, http://www.sportslegacy.org/, click on the page Legacy Donars and look at brain donations. Some of them are from high school athletes. Read the stories.
Depression is absolutely a symptom of the dementia.
Missed the edit window but try this link:
http://www.sportslegacy.org/cte-concussions/cte-concussions-sli-legacy-donors/
And, that doesn’t include the athletes that are alive today, recognize they have a problem and have already willed their brain upon their death.
You’re missing the point. Seau was depressed and has attempted suicide before. This much is known. This has gotten zero publicity. Seau has never been diagnosed with post-consussion symptoms. It’s not to say that it’s not a factor but it’s wild speculation at this point, the depression however is not. Treating depression and discussion concussions should not be mutually exclusive, but for the media it seems to be.
That’s why his brain should go to the SLI. Eight players on the Chargers Super Bowl team are dead. That is a statistical anomaly. He shot himself in the chest? That’s Dave Duerson all over again. Connections like that can’t be ignored. Don’t try to disconnect them. You will get a lot farther by connecting the dots than looking for ways to disconnect them. Read the articles on Derek Boogaard that I cited.
This is hopeless.
Seau denied that his vehicle accident was a suicide attempt. (And it hasn’t exactly gotten “zero publicity” … it’s been mentioned in every article I’ve read about his death.) Seau maintained consistently that he fell asleep at the wheel, and his family and friends believed him. You are complaining about posters in this thread for speculating on brain injury being a contributing factor to Seau’s suicide, but you are doing the same thing by speculating that he was suffering from depression and had attempted suicide previously. There is no real evidence that his previous accident was a suicide attempt, and reports from his friends and family are that Seau showed no indications of being troubled or depressed prior to his suicide.
Although Seau had never been formally diagnosed with post-concussion symptoms, his former wife acknowledged he’d suffered concussions multiple times during his career. This concern with whether or not a player is concussed is fairly recent. When Seau was playing, they just walked it off. It wasn’t considered a serious injury. It’s only been recently that the seriousness of cumulative minor to moderate head injuries has been acknowledged.
Even though there was no report of a suicide note, I also wondered if Seau shot himself in the chest a’la Duerson in order to allow his brain to remain intact for analysis.
As for the NFL making changes, remember that they are currently mired in a law suit that might open up the flood gates of litigants if they are found guilty… they are unlikely to make any major changes or admissions until the litigation is off the table.
Also, as obvious and apparent as it seems to make the “link” between football, concussions, depression, and suicide, we do not know what the intervening variable is in the depression->suicide relationship (but it would appear to be CTE and cognitive deficits). Even when you factor OUT NFL players, concussions, and CTE, we do not know what makes someone with depression commit suicide as opposed to someone with depression who does not commit suicide. Mix in possible (early life) dementia, cortical atrophy, limited/declining cognitive resources, possible fear/hopelessness about the future, etc., and you have one complicated mixture.
Unfortunately, I fear there is no way to “protect” NFL players other than 1) have them play flag football, or 2) not have them play contact sports. Sadly, the damage may already have been done for the majority of those still playing… it may only be the youth athletes we can protect, but we have to ultimately protect them from themselves (and their parents), as the response to giving up contact sports is similar to asking an NRA card-holder to lay down their arms.
Apparently the Seau family has allowed his brain to be studied.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7889467/junior-seau-family-allow-concussion-study-brain
I’m not going to comment on whether it should go to SLI at BU or the Brain Injury Research Institute. At least, there will be some analysis. Hopefully, they are working in partnership and not in competition.
Watching Seau’s distraught mother at the first press conference I was afraid that she would not agree.
The 911 call after the girlfriend finds Seau is really disturbing - but after hearing it a couple of times, I have to admit: I couple of nagging questions keep coming up.
On the 911 call, you can hear the girlfriend say, “my boyfriend just shot himself”.
That seems like a really odd thing to say. Firstly - she was at the gym for about an hour, why does she think he ‘just’ shot himself?
Secondly - if I came home and found a loved one shot in the chest, my first reaction on the 911 call would be to say ‘my boyfriend has been shot’. Or maybe, ‘someone shot my boyfriend’. Why did she assume immediately that it was a suicide?
Thirdly: Men are far more likely to shoot themselves in the head, not the chest. Now, perhaps Seau wanted to ensure his brain would be available for study: there was a similar suicide case by another former NFL player who specifically left a note to that effect. But if it was that well thought-out…wouldn’t Seau have left a suicide note?
It sounds like the investigation concluded it was a suicide, and I guess other than the 911 call there’s nothing to say it wasnt. Either way, what a tragic, tragic loss for one of the greatest football players I ever saw.
As to your 1st question-An hour isn’t all that long, and to question #3: You’re thinking of Duerson, and Seau’s brain IS being donated for study.
No one really knows what they’d say in a 911-call emergency situation until they experience it. She may have said he was “just shot” because it looked like it just happened, who knows? Depending on how the gun fell out of his hands, or if it fell out of his hands at all, she’d appropriately assume suicide. If she left him alone in the house, and came back to find him still in the home with no indication of open windows or doors, why would she assume someone else had been there?
On what are you basing your assumption that men are more likely to shoot themselves in the head rather than the chest? Men are more likely to shoot themselves as a means of suicide, yes, but I’m unaware of site preference. (Frankly, the chest can be just as lethal with less chance of ending up a vegetable.)
As to not leaving a note, the majority of suicides do not.
Fifteen years of law enforcement… Duerson and Seau are first men I’ve ever heard to shoot themselves in the chest… every single suicide (male) shot themselves in the head… and you never ever get immune to seeing that…
Damn shame… Was a huge fan of both men… Duerson was honors grad from Notre Dame and running a successful sausage business (provided patties for McDonalds) and then smply lost everything… wife business… his mind…
Their’s no way I’ll encourage or really let the kid play football… They’ve been after us for a while… but… with this… no way…
BTW Heinz Ward is the one who said he knows that down the line he’ll pay the price for the hard hits he both took and gave…
When people are shocked and panicked, they often say and do things that don’t make a lot of sense to a calm observer. That’s worth keeping in mind before we go all Columbo on this. She’d just found him, and presumably his gun was right there. She probably knew he was having problems with depression.
I’ll take your word for this, but you can’t make generalizations based on a statistic like that. Men may be more likely to shoot themselves in the head than in the chest, but some men do shoot themselves in the chest and it doesn’t follow that any other kind of shooting is suspicious. And as you say, the police who are investigating this firsthand are sure it was a suicide.