Just When I Began to Breath Easy Concerning the Future of Politics in America . .

Politics & Elections
21

The problem here is, it’s easy for some of the leaders to do the math on embracing minorities vs. rejecting them, and give pretty speeches with all the right words. It’s somewhat harder to actually follow through on those words, and much harder to get the rank and file to do so. Even those who decide to give you a chance are likely to notice if the discrimination they face never seems to go away, no matter how often they hear the pretty speeches.

And this is the result - to actually be able to win enough of these voters, the GOP will ultimately have to become, in reality, a party that actually delivers on the promises they make to woo those voters. At this moment, I can’t imagine any of the current crop of GOP leaders honestly embracing the massive changes needed to pull this off, but were it ever to happen, I’d cheer it on. Democracy is not well served when one party is just so colossally insane as the GOP is these days.

22

And the congregation (including this atheist) say- Amen

23

And the right wing is very well aware of that. They know that they’re a minority, politically. That’s what makes them vulnerable. That’s also what makes them dangerous because it makes them ever more committed to the idea of imposing a new order over the objections of the rest of us.

24

@divemaster, nobody that I’ve ever encountered says that any group believes or votes in just one way. There is no doubt that some religious minorities are conservative. Or some of any other group. As I wrote above, 8% of blacks voted for Trump. Yet it’s equally true that getting 60% of a rapidly enlarging group is better than getting 60% of a rapidly thinning group over the long term. We’re talking about the collective behavior of tens of millions of people, not what you or your friends or your co-religionists or your online acquaintances do.

@Temporary_Name, as your comment “if the right promoted a reasonable and sane candidate who was not racist, sexist, and opposed evil truly – I might consider supporting him or her” suggests, the problem with the right is their whiteness. During the Trump years, thousands of photos appeared of right-wing groupings, from politicians to attendees at rallies, that contained overwhelmingly white faces, often all males. The signal that sends out is clear. There may be reasons why some women and some people of color support the right but they are being told every single day that they aren’t welcome and the majority of women and people of color recognize that and vote accordingly. A propaganda show embracing them is not going to change that.

25

The dominionists know that this is their dwindling window of opportunity. At this point, they’re still a minority, yet still strong enough that if they maximize themselves and have enough luck, they might still be able to win presidential elections (the way Trump did in 2016,) so they still have a decent, albeit, long shot at achieving their dominionist dreams. It only works if all domioninist hands are on deck and work together towards the common goal, though.

In another decade or two, the dominionists will be so few in number that even if they maximized their potential 100%, they couldn’t win the presidency, period. So it’s now or never.

26

Exactly my fear!
Nothing is more dangerous than the desperate having one last chance. (And reportedly a trapped animal, but I repeat myself.) [Upon edit: added as a joke and to emphasis the point, no insult intended to sincere believers]

27

There is plenty of anti-black racism to be found among Asian-Americans and some Asian communities are very anti-communist and anti-Chinese (Vietnamese, Filipino). And very anti “illegal” immigrant. Some of them seem to think that they have common cause with the racist and xenophobic whites in the Republican Party. Heck when I asked my brother if he would still support the Republicans if we (Asians) were interned in camps en made, his response was “It would depend on why you are being interned”. Note that he said “you” not “we”. As far as he is concerned his wife is white, his kids pass as white, so the roundup would exclude him!

I do know two very Trumpist Black Americans. But one is from Jamaica and the other from Nigeria. Both very religious (Christian) and also very homophobic and misogynistic. Literally believe that it is ordained that the husband be the dominant partner in a marriage. That a modicum of domestic violence and corporal punishment is necessary. That sodomites should be killed. Crap like that. And also that if Black Americans would stop whinging and start living right, their problems would be solved in a couple of decades.

28

“The leopards will never notice that I also have a face!”

29

I’ve always doubted the orthodoxy that said that immigrants, especially black and Hispanic immigrants, were reliably aligned with the Democratic Party. I worked with lots of immigrants during my career, some worked in the contracting trades and others worked in the homes of my wealthy clients.

Most were from countries of origin that were way more socially conservative than the US, and most were very religious, holding very conservative positions on gay/trans issues and abortion. It’s hard for someone who came from a country whose political landscape featured actual death squads to work up outrage against systemic racism and microaggressions.

I’ve also found that people who jumped through the hoops to navigate the US immigration process, or who made the difficult and dangerous journey to immigrate illegally are big fans of bootstrapping. I know the Republicans like to pretend that immigrants just come here for the sweet welfare dollars, but that’s just not true. The ones I met came here because they wanted to work their asses off to build a better life for themselves and their families and they aren’t sympathetic to people, especially people with the advantages that come with being born a US citizen, who can’t make a living. Frankly, I’ve always felt immigrants were a constituency tailor-made for Republicans - and that they’d get them if they’d drop the racism and gaslighting. Fortunately, that’s not happening anytime soon.

The rise of Christian 7M dominionism is scary, at least on paper There are a disproportionate number of politicians that believe that God’s law takes precedent over man’s law and believe that it’s OK to lie about putting God’s law above the laws of man, like they all do when they take their oath of office.

There are groups that seem secular on the surface but are deeply committed to theocracy. One is the Council for National Policy, which had a hand in matchmaking KellyAnne Conway and Steve Bannon with the Trump campaign. Not to be confused with the Center for National Policy ( the confusion is probably deliberate, IMHO), the Council for National Policy was founded by Left Behind author and Moral Majority founder Tim LaHaye.

Then there is the Fellowship Foundation aka The Family aka the National Prayer Breakfast people, who have members throughout the political arena. They claim to be completely non-denominational, having the belief that people of all faiths can achieve reconciliation and come together to worship Jesus. Really.

And I could fill a book with these connections ( and some writers have). Bob Mercer. The Prince and DeVos families. Ted Cruz. It’s not hard to find a dominionist hiding behind pretty much everything in conservative politics.

But here’s the rub. Here’s what confounds me about these groups and their mission. Despite the floods of dark money backing dozens, if not hundreds, of politicians, preachers, think tanks and political action groups, they just aren’t very successful. This is not a new movement. The Moral Majority and similar groups spent decades and millions battling immorality on television, but have you watched TV lately? Not CNN or news programs, but TV dramas and sitcoms and reality shows. I didn’t much before the pandemic, but I’ve watched quite a bit since. And if I had a nickel for every time I thought “Man, if I were a religious Christian mourning the loss of the white patriarchy, that would’ve made my head explode”, I’d become very rich very fast. This effect is so profound that I enjoy a low level schandenfreude buzz every time I watch TV.

And it’s not just TV. I play an interior design game on my iPad, and the “clients” are frequently interracial couples, unmarried couples, gay couples and trans people. Megan Thee Stallion is on the cover of Sports Illustrated.

I will admit that the theocracy faction had the big success that was Donald Trump, and they made some inroads….but Trump governed mostly via executive order and many of their accomplishments were rolled back after they lost.

So now the theocrats are in Flight 93 mode, making a desperate last stand, thinking if they take Mt. Government by force or deception they can use that as a perch from which to conquer the other 6 mountains*. It’s scary, it’s concerning, desperate people always are. But I don’t think they’ll prevail. I might be wrong, I might be very wrong. I’m not complacent. But when I think about where we are today vs where, 18 months ago, I thought we would be right now…I’m cautiously, very cautiously, optimistic.

*A reference to the religious theory of Dominionism known as the 7 Mountain mandate…

30

I agree, that is the way things normally worked in the past, but with gerrymandering, the only election that matters for most Republican law makers is the primary, and the voters in the Republican primaries are increasingly demanding far right orthodoxy, to the point of rejection of reality. This is making it very difficult for the GOP to evolve to parity, and is why they are having to resort so heavily on voter suppression and rejection of democracy.

As to the OP, the article basically boils down to three observations:

  1. Right wing Christians are becoming more ethnically diverse
  2. Right wing Christians are becoming more radical in their rhetoric
  3. Millionaire right wing Christians have formed a group.

But all of these are looking at trends within the religious right, and say nothing about what proportion of the general population are part of this group. As bad as the Trends on racial demographics are for the GOP, the trends on religious affiliation are even worse, and much of what is driving people away is the connection between politics and religion. So based observation #2 in the article this trend is, if anything, likely to accelerate. Religiousity among both whites and blacks is declining, its just declining somewhat less for blacks than it is for whites.

That millionaires on the religious right are forming a group is not particularly surprising. All of the people in this group were already on the Trump supporter list, they just decided to organize themselves around religion. Their focusing on outreach to religions minorities is already baked into the results of the 2020 election,. While they may have been responsible for the increased share of the Black/Hispanic vote that Trump received 2020 vs 2016, it wasn’t a radical change, and Trump still lost the Black vote by an overwhelming margin.

31

Government may be the easiest of the 7 mountains to seize, and it would serve as a “band-aid” stopgap measure for them to stem their bleeding while they get to work on the other 6 mountains. If they could gain control of the presidency, judiciary and legislature, then they could pass all sorts of theocratic legislation and have it withstand the courts - which, while it wouldn’t actually win hearts and minds, would buy them time for them to conquer education, media, etc. which then might genuinely have the effect of indoctrinating a good chunk of people.

Often, historically, it’s the legislation that needs to come first before people’s hearts and minds are changed, not the other way around as popularly believed. Once something is legally mandated, then people follow. It requires a fait accompli.

32

I don’t see the religious right winning hearts and minds over reasonable progressive thought. Not unless the world as a whole gets a government that can control all forms of mass media.

Reasonable progressive thought is far more appealing than religious orthodoxy.

33

True - progressivism almost always has the appeal advantage, which is why it tends to prevail, after all.

But - if 7Mers are serious about capturing the seven mountains, it would make the most sense for them to seize government first. It has the most power to affect the other 6 mountains.

34

Yep, I know plenty of immigrants who are running hard to climb their way onto the Trump train for all of the reasons you alluded to.

35

Lots of very good comments, thank you for the replies. I will not address any individual comments for another twenty hours or so, my pedantic questions often sidetrack the discussion.

That being said, I do have a question on this topic:
During the 50’s when IKE was president there was a surge of religious fervor and that was when “One Nation Under God” was added to the Pledge of Allegiance. During that same time, the paper currency went from the motto E Pluribus Unum to “In God We Trust”.

Was that religious period genuine and sincere- did it lead to a better society?
Are we in another genuine and sincere period of religious being? Or is this something else, in either case where will lead if it is successful? What might happen if it is completely unsuccessful?

36

And this primary problem is part of why I’m not terribly worried about the current crop of GOP fanatics actually succeeding at their theocratic wet dreams.

Let’s say they pull it off: The gerrymander the hell out of everything and disenfranchise enough voters that the GOP has a lock on more than enough elections to rule the US in perpetuity.

Okay, so are they also going to make it illegal to become a Republican? Because at some point, a lot of Democrats are going to realize that the only way they’ll ever have any influence on government is by becoming Republicans, and voting in the primaries for candidates that aren’t batshit insane. And since Democrats outnumber Republicans by quite a wide margin, they will eventually own the Republican party.

The only way to avoid this would be to eliminate democracy entirely, at which point, I’m pretty sure it’s civil war time.

37

My understanding was that it was primarily a backlash against communism. The idea being that unlike the godless communists claiming religion is the opiate of the masses, America was all about god. So nothing really to do with religion at all.

38

I don’t think this would be the case because even in real life today, in deep-blue and deep-red states, you still don’t see people doing this. In California or Hawaii, for instance, you don’t see Republicans flocking en masse to sign up as “Democrats” even though those states lean heavily blue and Republicans are essentially marginalized as a force within the state. You don’t see Democrats signing up en masse to become “Republicans” in Oklahoma or Wyoming.

39

Yes, but what you’ve described is a catastrophe. You’re talking about one-party rule of the country, where the “left” capitulates to McCain-style politics and is happy with it because at least Q isn’t president.

I don’t disagree that it’s a possibility. I definitely disagree that it’s a process that makes me less worried about the GOP succeeding in its aims. I mean, read your post again, but imagine you’re Mitch McConnell when you do it.

40

Except that’s happening in states where Dems or Republicans heavily outweigh the other party. There’s not much point in the party that polls 30% trying to take over the primaries of the party that polls 70%.

What I’m talking about is a state that votes predominantly Democrat, but because of GOP abuses of the system, most elections end up with Republican winners. If that becomes a significant factor, then the Democrat Majority could, at least in principle, take over the Republican party from the Republican minority. It’s at least worth trying that before declaring war.