# Justified Season 4 Finale **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 3, 2013, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697 "2013-04-03T03:32:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/1 "2013-04-03T03:32:45Z")
Didn’t see a thread for this already. A little surprising. My thoughts: I’ve spent a lot of time complaining here and on different forums about Boyd’s uncanny ability to avoid his comeuppance, but boy did his chickens come home to roost this episode. He spent this entire season running just ahead of the hounds at his heels, wheeling and dealing with all the necessary parties, and conniving to keep his entire operation running even while everything was threatening to unravel around him. We’d see him take one step forward, then two backwards. I came into this finale expecting him to wriggle off the hook once more, and it was an incredible surprise when things fell apart at the very end. He’d run himself ragged this season and made every play he had, but it just wasn’t enough. Poor Boyd – and wow, poor Ava. Almost as heartbreaking was watching Raylan come to terms with the fact that he’s so much like his father. The only thing separating him from being an outright miserablist like Arlo was his decision to join the Marshals Service, which gave him a somewhat positive outlet for behaving like a total asshole. What’d everybody think? ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/2 "2013-04-03T03:36:55Z")
Everybody I cared about will be back, along with a few I was hoping to be shed of. Loved the way the Detroit faction was handled. But do we know who tipped them about where Winona was? How long do we have to wait for the next season? ---
**Author:** ![Face\_Intentionally\_Left\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/face_intentionally_left_blank/32/288_2.png) [@Face\_Intentionally\_Left\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Face_Intentionally_Left_Blank)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/3 "2013-04-03T05:39:55Z")
Watching it now. First off, looks like I misremembered about the body being dumped in a coal slurry. Maybe it was the dead guy that dumped a body in a slurry. Maybe Ellen Mae’s friend/coworker. Whatever the case, this particular body was in a mine shaft. Surprised they didn’t dump it down a water-filled shaft. 150+ feet down in a old, narrow, dangerous shaft is not an easy dive to make if they want to recover the body. Maybe they don’t have any water-filled shafts around those parts. Knew of a few back in my youth I was warned off of. Oh crap, Raylan & Wynona have guests! Hope they have enough rocking chairs. HOLY SHIT, NOW THAT’S A SHOOTOUT! (rewind) (play) HOLY SHIT, NOW THAT’S A SHOOTOUT! “It’s all very Shakespearean.” I like that character. Raylan & Boyd road-trip. Only thing better would be a LONGER Raylan & Boyd road-trip. I’m a little disappointed that the “threaten Boyd through Ava” ploy wasn’t an obvious tit-for-tat, see-how-it-feels-Boyd move. Seemed like he was unironically threatening Ava. Damn, that’s a real shame to see those Detroit guys shoot up a perfectly good limo. Oh man, only 6 minutes left. . .don’t you cliffhanger me. Don’t you DARE cliffhanger me. I knew Wynn was going to give him the local franchise when he walked in. Why else would he be there? Oh well. If they’re gonna cliffhanger me, that wasn’t a bad way to do it. Boyd’s not left twisting - he gets in with Detroit via Wynn, thus giving him money and connections/power. Should help come next season when he has to get Ava out of trouble and extract a little retribution. Good ending, with Boyd breaking into Ava’s dream-house to reflect on what he’s lost, and Raylan patching up Ario’s wall. I feel like I’m missing some symbolism there. Maybe it’s simply closure - fixing the hole in the wall that started all the fuss this season. That’s probably it. I noticed a hummingbird feed at the flowers under the window Boyd was looking out off. Doubt they scripted that, nor CGI-ed it. Maybe it’s just me, but I think hummingbirds are novel. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/4 "2013-04-03T07:47:12Z")
I’m a fan of [The Friends of Eddie Coyle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Friends_of_Eddie_Coyle), one of Mitchum’s better roles. Really appreciated that little bit. All in all a fairly satisfying conclusion, though in a way I was sad to see Nicky go. A better drawn badass than over-the-top Quarles and a fine acting job. I might have to rate this season a hair below 3 ( though like I said I prefer Nicky Augustine to Quarles ), which was a hair below 2 in my mind ( Mags Bennett is still the best villain ). But it’s all good. Still a solid show, any drop-off is easily overlooked and it doesn’t yet feel like a slippery slope. I hope they are planning out an ending though. I’d rather see this one wrap up in 1-2 seasons before it has a chance to start limping. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/5 "2013-04-03T11:42:48Z")
Where have I seen the actor who played Sam before? Quite a bit I think but always as geeky/goofy types. His wardrobe suggested a little of that still. Had he been mentioned before in earlier seasons/episodes? ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/6 "2013-04-03T13:18:09Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > How long do we have to wait for the next season? > [@What\_the](#): > > Where have I seen the actor who played Sam before? Quite a bit I think but always as geeky/goofy types. His wardrobe suggested a little of that still. Had he been mentioned before in earlier seasons/episodes? According to [Justified wiki](http://justified.wikia.com/wiki/Justified_Wiki): > [@](#): > > One of the best crime dramas on TV just got renewed for a fifth season. > > FX’s Justified will return next January for another year. > [@](#): > > [Max Perlich](http://justified.wikia.com/wiki/Max_Perlich) as Sammy Tonin ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/7 "2013-04-03T14:09:01Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > Where have I seen the actor who played Sam before? Quite a bit I think but always as geeky/goofy types. His wardrobe suggested a little of that still. Had he been mentioned before in earlier seasons/episodes? He’s been on the show before, i believe Quarles slapped him around. Do we know what happened to uncle Johny? his betrayal was one of the big plots of the season and it was completely left up in the air. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/8 "2013-04-03T15:40:47Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > He’s been on the show before, i believe Quarles slapped him around. Do we know what happened to uncle Johny? his betrayal was one of the big plots of the season and it was completely left up in the air. Yost said in an interview with Alan Sepinwall that they just didn’t have time to deal with Johnny in this episode. He said Johnny will be back. He also said that he wants two more seasons to finish the story, for a total of six. ---
**Author:** ![Enright3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/enright3/32/2897_2.png) [@Enright3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enright3)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/9 "2013-04-03T15:56:53Z")
> [@Tarwater](#): > > Almost as heartbreaking was watching Raylan come to terms with the fact that he’s so much like his father. The only thing separating him from being an outright miserablist like Arlo was his decision to join the Marshals Service, which gave him a somewhat positive outlet for behaving like a total asshole. > > What’d everybody think? I get that Raylon is a misanthrope; but I missed him coming to terms with the fact that he’s so much like his father. Are you talking about that last scene where he’s sitting outside his house? ---
**Author:** ![Enright3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/enright3/32/2897_2.png) [@Enright3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enright3)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/10 "2013-04-03T16:00:53Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > Where have I seen the actor who played Sam before? Quite a bit I think but always as geeky/goofy types. His wardrobe suggested a little of that still. Had he been mentioned before in earlier seasons/episodes? The only thing I remember him from is playing John Wesley Hardin in the Mel Gibson movie Maverick. Holy Crap, that was 19 years ago! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/11 "2013-04-03T19:49:56Z")
> [@Enright3](#): > > I get that Raylon is a misanthrope; but I missed him coming to terms with the fact that he’s so much like his father. Are you talking about that last scene where he’s sitting outside his house? Wasn’t it during the exchange with Boyd where he asks Raylan how he knows he’s the good guy? Raylan definitely chewed on that for a while, and it has been discussed that he is like his dad but puts it to use in law enforcement - kinda like that show Dexter, where he’s a serial killer but uses it to kill other bad guys. Yeah, like that. 😉 As an overall arc, it was a good season - not as good as 2 with Mags, but very satisfying. Now, in terms of Elmore Leonard-quality sidebar character dialogue, this season was fabulous. Great exchanges between bad guys and bad guys, good guys and good guys, and of course good guys and bad guys. Rachel and Limehouse? Tim and Colton? And Art? Could there be a better Haggard-but-Cool Boss With the Best Lines than Art? From a dialogue standpoint, they knocked it out of the park, IMHO. I just wish it ended with What’s-her-Name Nevada showing up at the end to check in on Raylan now that he’s good with Winona but she is still leaving. Rowr. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/12 "2013-04-04T06:20:18Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > But do we know who tipped them about where Winona was? When Boyd, Augustine and Picker are at Nicky Cush’s hideout, Augustine asks Boyd what’s the name of the marshal in the hat, and Boyd tells him. It comes off as a throwaway line, but considering Theo’s reach, if they knew Raylan’s name, that could explain how they find Winona. So, when Boyd tells Raylan on their drive that whatever Augustine knows about Winona did not come from him, he might not realize that it did indeed come from him (or maybe he does realize it). (If it did, anyway. Maybe I’m wrong.) ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/13 "2013-04-04T06:33:53Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > When Boyd, Augustine and Picker are at Nicky Cush’s hideout, Augustine asks Boyd what’s the name of the marshal in the hat, and Boyd tells him. It comes off as a throwaway line, but considering Theo’s reach, if they knew Raylan’s name, that could explain how they find Winona. > > So, when Boyd tells Raylan on their drive that whatever Augustine knows about Winona did not come from him, he might not realize that it did indeed come from him (or maybe he does realize it). (If it did, anyway. Maybe I’m wrong.) Good enough explanation for me. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![jonesj2205](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecc23a/32.png) [@jonesj2205](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jonesj2205)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/14 "2013-04-04T11:56:23Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > So, when Boyd tells Raylan on their drive that whatever Augustine knows about Winona did not come from him, he might not realize that it did indeed come from him (or maybe he does realize it). (If it did, anyway. Maybe I’m wrong.) Wouldn’t be breaking the code to tell Nicky Raylan’s name. It would have if he’d said he’d told Nicky about Winona too. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/15 "2013-04-04T14:07:59Z")
Why did Mooney and that other guy (Paxton?) change their minds about helping Boyd and Ava switch the bodies? What did they gain, except making Boyd an enemy? And speaking of switches, when we first see someone at the bottom of the shaft, I thought it was gonna be Boyd and Ava down there, and then we see the law got there first. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/16 "2013-04-04T14:58:31Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > Why did Mooney and that other guy (Paxton?) change their minds about helping Boyd and Ava switch the bodies? What did they gain, except making Boyd an enemy? > > And speaking of switches, when we first see someone at the bottom of the shaft, I thought it was gonna be Boyd and Ava down there, and then we see the law got there first. Mooney said to Boyd on entering the bar - “I don’t work for you any longer” and Paxton definitely did not like being used by Boyd or being indebt to him. They saw it as an opportunity to teach Boyd a lesson - but were unaware that he was about to have the Detroit team on his side. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/17 "2013-04-04T15:13:38Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Mooney said to Boyd on entering the bar - “I don’t work for you any longer” and Paxton definitely did not like being used by Boyd or being indebt to him. > > They saw it as an opportunity to teach Boyd a lesson - but were unaware that he was about to have the Detroit team on his side. That’s all it was? How dumb of them. Unless they thought maybe Boyd would fall too, for Delroy’s murder. I don’t understand the switch in the first place. Why not just dispose of Delroy’s body? Nobody’s gonna believe the switched body is Delroy. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/18 "2013-04-04T15:24:07Z")
“At least no one died.” Winona I think this season was the weakest, but considering the quality of the show, that still makes it one of the best shows on TV. The whole “Drew Thompson” story just seemed like a huge McGuffin…didn’t really understand the importance of finding him, nor did I care. Thus, getting there lost a bit of the luster of the story for me. Looking forward to next season - wish they could find a way to bring back Mags…she was truly the highlight of all the season series. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/19 "2013-04-04T15:50:36Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > That’s all it was? How dumb of them. Unless they thought maybe Boyd would fall too, for Delroy’s murder. > > I don’t understand the switch in the first place. Why not just dispose of Delroy’s body? Nobody’s gonna believe the switched body is Delroy. They did not plan on Eva being there - they planned on catching Boyd. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697/20 "2013-04-04T15:52:07Z")
> [@DMark](#): > > “At least no one died.” Winona > > I think this season was the weakest, but considering the quality of the show, that still makes it one of the best shows on TV. > > The whole “Drew Thompson” story just seemed like a huge McGuffin…didn’t really understand the importance of finding him, nor did I care. Thus, getting there lost a bit of the luster of the story for me. > > Looking forward to next season - wish they could find a way to bring back Mags…she was truly the highlight of all the season series. As stated in the earlier thread - the Drew Thompson story was to tie in an actual Ky case/conspiracy - [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/justified-season-4-finale/654697.md?page=2)