# Karoline Leavitt (and her successors) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [May 9, 2025, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138 "2025-05-09T06:40:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/281 "2026-10-15T12:39:23Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > General counsel is a generally recognized job title In fact, based on some brief googling, a statutorily/regulatory protected title that requires licensure. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/282 "2026-10-15T17:01:27Z")
Here’s another case, involving a young female physician who took on COVID and antivax disinformation, only to be attacked over a narrow, legalistic definition of that title by cranks. > **[Hack conspiracy journalism: Paul Thacker vs. the definition of "physician"](https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2024/04/04/hack-conspiracy-journalism-paul-thacker-vs-the-definition-of-physician/)** > > I normally don't publish email exchanges, but when someone like Paul Thacker misleadingly characterizes one with me, I make an exception. > **[A female physician responds to hack journalist Paul Thacker](https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2024/04/13/a-female-physician-responds-to-hack-journalist-paul-thacker/)** > > After being forced through legal threats to "apologize" by a bunch of quacks and attacked by a hack journalist, Dr. Allison Neitzel speaks. If that story disgusts you, along with attacks on Abdul El-Sayed for “not really being a doctor”, then maybe you should think twice about piling on Zacharia for “not really being a lawyer”. There’s legit ammo available against her already, and far more to come, if she behaves like Leavitt did. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/283 "2026-10-15T17:04:56Z")
Where the line is drawn notwithstanding … the Wall Street Journal is reporting that Zacharia took the California bar exam but did not pass. It’s paywalled, but the gist is free: [**White House Press Secretary Katie Zacharia Didn’t Pass Bar Exam - WSJ**](https://www.wsj.com/business/media/white-house-press-secretary-katie-zacharia-didnt-pass-bar-exam-714a484e) > [@](#): > > When President Trump announced that Katie Zacharia would serve as the next White House press secretary, he referred to her as an attorney. But she hasn’t passed the bar exam in the U.S. > > Zacharia sat for the California bar exam after graduating from law school at Pepperdine University in 2011, according to a person with direct knowledge of the matter, but she didn’t pass. She took the exam around the time she was planning a wedding and preparing to move to China with her future husband, the person said. WSJ’s been hitting it outta’ the park in Trump 2.0. I’d wager they have this one cold. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/284 "2026-10-15T17:26:48Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If that story disgusts you, along with attacks on Abdul El-Sayed for “not really being a doctor”, then maybe you should think twice about piling on Zacharia for “not really being a lawyer”. I’m not going to read a story about apples to make decisions about oranges. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/285 "2026-10-15T17:47:35Z")
Some people just like to continue fucking chickens, regardless ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/286 "2026-10-15T17:49:32Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > Where the line is drawn notwithstanding … the Wall Street Journal is reporting that Zacharia took the California bar exam but did not pass. But ChatGPT did! Or at least, passed a similar exam. So, new WH press secretary who claims to be a lawyer, is actually a lying dumbass who never met the qualifications. Also, judging from her recent performance, totally unqualified to be a WH spokesperson. Sounds like a perfect addition to Team Trump! 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/287 "2026-10-15T17:51:40Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Sounds like a perfect addition to Team Trump! I suppose it’s a good thing when their fuck ups don’t really have any effect on the world ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/288 "2026-10-15T19:35:57Z")
Same rotten fruit. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/289 "2026-10-15T19:46:33Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > And her defense, as far as it goes, is she was licensed to practice law in China. By actual communists. Although in reality she wasn’t actually licensed to practice law anywhere, not even China. > [@New York Times](#): > > Opportunities for foreign lawyers in China are extremely narrow. Foreign nationals cannot sit for China’s bar exam, hold a Chinese lawyer’s license or advise on Chinese law. Instead, she reportedly worked for a Chinese law firm as the equivalent of a paid intern. And previously, after graduating with a law degree from Pepperdine University in 2011, she failed the California bar exam. Cite (gift link): [https://www.nytimes.com/2026/10/14/us/politics/trump-press-secretary-katie-zacharia-lawyer.html?unlocked\_article\_code=1.I1E.tuNM.Xr-UN4R1MYPB&smid=url-share](https://www.nytimes.com/2026/10/14/us/politics/trump-press-secretary-katie-zacharia-lawyer.html?unlocked_article_code=1.I1E.tuNM.Xr-UN4R1MYPB&smid=url-share) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/290 "2026-10-15T19:51:53Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Same rotten fruit. That’s like saying someone should not be accused of murder because somebody else was falsely accused of murder, even if there was clear evidence in one case and none in the other. Just because someone was _inaccurately_ accused of not being a physician by anti-vaxxers in an attempt to further an agenda of dangerous misinformation, it is moronic to say that we should not _accurately_ point out that a different person isn’t a lawyer when they are falsely using that claim to try to paint themselves as competent in a role they clearly have no business trying to fill. The American Bar Association states: [ABA: When You Need a Lawyer](https://www.americanbar.org/groups/public_education/resources/law_issues_for_consumers/everyday-law/legalhelp1/) > A lawyer (also called attorney, counsel, counselor, barrister, or solicitor) is a licensed professional who advises and represents others in legal matters. In addition, she has claimed to serve as “general counsel” in California on LinkedIn, which is a term that means serving as the primary in-house attorney and chief legal advisor for an organization, which you _cannot do_ without a license. > **[The problem with Katie Zacharia calling herself a lawyer](https://www.businessinsider.com/katie-zacharia-lawyer-bar-complaint-california-white-house-press-secretary-2026-10)** > > Two watchdog groups filed complaints with the California bar, asking it to investigate whether she violated the law by calling herself a lawyer. She is now facing possible legal consequences for this misrepresentation, which is a misdemeanor in California. The woman has lied and you want us to back off from that because of some completely unrelated issue? Do you not realize how stupid that is? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/291 "2026-10-15T21:00:37Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > She is now facing possible legal consequences for this misrepresentation, which is a misdemeanor in California. I wonder how long it will take for Trump to issue her a Pardon\*. . . . \*Yes, yes. **I** know that, and **you** know that, but … [**still**](https://courthousenews.com/trump-pardons-former-colorado-elections-clerk-but-it-alone-wont-free-her-from-prison/) … And would the picket signs carried by those (lost, broken, antisocial souls) coming to her defense read … [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AP1GczMfeYLk07rAClvq7CPzlUuKmt_hWGNmngmtrsT6cZsd9hQHpNaA-x7QVh3BNzSwRv_GJaw17KYXxhhxHT4l6u27DjpJQFT33Pts8BuhJU7Rg89elJA=w600-h315-p-k "New photo · Thursday, Oct 15 📸") ](https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipO50s2Q5g_HXAg_ZkLr7ydgBqU6rqUM3EsxwOheOU3CMw4OdO9rYK6HamVmya4G3w?key=blp0dlNrOFJTMmlibkd3dEZEcS1zdUlqdFNKeHB3) And if not, why not? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/292 "2026-10-15T21:02:37Z")
My prediction is that the worst that she’ll have to endure is a “correction” at some point at the direction of actual lawyers. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/293 "2026-10-15T21:08:34Z")
I wouldn’t be surprised if Trump uses this as an excuse to ease her out after her disastrous first appearance. “She did a fantastic job, but I always insist on 100% honesty from my staff.” With midterms looming, you’d think there’d be some urgency in getting the president’s official mouthpiece in front of the cameras as soon and as often as possible. But instead…silence. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/294 "2026-10-15T21:39:45Z")
I haven’t looked up the California law, but my assumption is that the misrepresentation requires some harm or at least risk of harm. That is, it was surely designed to prevent people from calling themselves lawyers to get clients, not to police language. Stolen valor laws are similar, you can walk around calling yourself Colonel but my understanding is that you only get into legal trouble if you try to benefit in some way from your lie. In normal times this would just be a political scandal and she be gone in less than a Mooch, but now Trump can declare that HE gets to decide what a lawyer is and we all just call her Katie Zachariah, Esquire, for the next 2 years. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2026, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/295 "2026-10-15T21:46:56Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > I haven’t looked up the California law, but my assumption is that the misrepresentation requires some harm or at least risk of harm. That’s kind of what I was thinking too. I doubt, given all the circumstances, that there’s really much legal liability here. It’s a technical violation, but unless someone digs up something worse than what we know, probably a nothingburger _legally_. Claiming you have experience as a licensed attorney (which she did by claiming to have been “general counsel”) is different than actually serving in that role fraudulently. Nothing in her current role AFAIK is dependent on being a licensed attorney, even though it’s worthwhile to call out her bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2026, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/296 "2026-10-16T01:58:18Z")
Here is her explanation. She is a terrible communicator. Normally, Trump probably wouldn’t care but he needs someone to sell him ahead of the midterms. She might have to go. > **[Aaron Rupar (@atrupar.com)](https://bsky.app/profile/atrupar.com/post/3mxwsqzs5xs2f)** > > Zacharia: "A lot of the misinformation, miscommunication is around the fact that I labeled myself a lawyer. I consulted for a long time many people in the field -- 'Is it ok if I label myself a lawyer?' -- and they said, 'Absolutely. You can call... ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2026, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/297 "2026-10-16T02:22:09Z")
One of the best comments there: > “The non lawyers I consulted with told me I should pretend I was a lawyer”. 😆 ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2026, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/298 "2026-10-16T02:41:42Z")
Consulting “for a long time, with many people” tells me she knew the truth but really wanted permission to lie like a rug. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2026, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/299 "2026-10-16T03:02:57Z")
So, to paraphase: “People are saying… (I can call herself a lawyer)” Very on-message for this administration. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2026, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138/300 "2026-10-16T03:58:15Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](#): > > Consulting “for a long time, with many people” tells me she knew the truth but really wanted permission to lie like a rug. The only reason to ask a lot of people the same question over a long time is because you are trying to find someone who will give you the answer you want. How long until she reveals that person is either her hairdresser or dog walker? …and that the answer from the hairdresser was actually, “You can call yourself whatever you want, honey!” 😋 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/karoline-leavitt-and-her-successors/1018138.md?page=16)