# Keith Olbermann should kill himself **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 17, 2009, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756 "2009-05-17T16:36:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/201 "2009-05-19T21:31:14Z")
It’s amazing how many people became concerned about gummint intrusion into their lives towards the end of 2008. Must have been when the torture info came out. Or maybe the wiretapping issue. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/202 "2009-05-19T21:33:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Everyone has the ability to get ahead if they’re willing to work hard enough to make it happen. You can’t be serious. Do you live in a vacuum? While there are many, many examples of people from little means achieving great success, these are merely exceptions. They will also prove to be an easier cite in an argument, as their tales of triumph over life’s hardships can be truly inspirational, and thus therefore recounted more often (in print or in cyberspace or in mass media) than the vast majority of people who struggle (while working much harder than you or me) and remain in the underclass. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/203 "2009-05-19T21:34:53Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Except for the wiretaps, you mean…and arbitrary searches, and indefinite arrest and imprisonment without charges or trials, and restrictions on what you can smoke, who you can marry and what decisions you can make about your own reproduction system…oh, and whether your kids have a right to learn science in science classes…aside from all that, you guys don’t want the government anywhere near you. It’s OK if the Gov does that to the other guys, the bad guys (who they are keeps changing I think), but just don’t let it happen to me. That’s it in a nutshell. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/204 "2009-05-19T21:38:04Z")
Okay, this has all been fun and everything, but now I have to go do a little producing of my own. I called the government to ask if they’d send me a check so I wouldn’t have to work today, it doesn’t work like that…yet. So I’m off to do a little work. Then I’ll come home and take a shower, and then…well, you know the drill. And if you don’t, just ask **Red**. 😉 There is tons of stuff to rebut, but so little time. I’ll try to get back later to explain such things as why extremely wealthy people do little physical labor. (Oh, hell, I’ll explain it now: a) Mental work is more taxing than physical work and the work they do is mental; and b) Their money is doing to work of production and creates much more in the way of factories and jobs (and taxes) than any finger-lifting manul labor on their part ever would.) Anyway, now I’m out. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/205 "2009-05-19T21:38:22Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > It’s amazing how many people became concerned about gummint intrusion into their lives towards the end of 2008. Must have been when the torture info came out. Or maybe the wiretapping issue. > > -Joe SOME of us were against it all along. Then there are others who only cared if it was that “damn dirty librul commie” that recently became president. Before that, it was “protecting us against the freedom haters” nonsense. We all knew about the torture and wiretapping and rendition, but that apparently was OK before. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/206 "2009-05-19T21:50:54Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > **RedFury** Income inequality is measured against the highest heights of wealth though. The problem with that is that the rich have been becoming astronomically richer. The question is whether or not that even matters. Are basic goods becoming out of reach? I tend to think not because even poor families have TVs and Computers in many cases. Yes the wealth disparity is increasing in insane ways, but at the same time goods are affordable. Who cares if someone else can buy 1 billion DVD players? I only want one. Not the gist of my argument, although I’d certainly agree that wealth disparity is through the roof. Simply saying that **SA** ’s simplistic recipe for nirvanistic success is, at best, ill-founded as countered by the cites given. As for your own “who cares,” well, I think everyone should and it has nothing to do with “envy” as many are wont to preempt with, but rather with the very fundamentals of democracy. An ever increasing schism between the ruling classes and the populace is only bound to end the very principles it purports to uphold. I also think we’re currently seeing the results of sheer, unmitigated capitalism, put into effect. Not pretty as far as I can surmise. On a personal note, I’ve never been able to fully understand the desire for more and more that, in a nutshell, captures the very essence of most of the individuals that ran your nation for the past eight years and most of those that greatly benefited from its policies. IOW, how much is enough? Or should that question be off the table? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/207 "2009-05-19T21:55:13Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > BWAHAHAHAHA! > > You? Calling _me_ a whiny baby? > > It is to laugh! I notice you omitted the rest of my post. I wonder if that’s because you have no response to it? And yes, you are a whiny baby and I am not. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/208 "2009-05-19T22:03:01Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > So it’s finally come to this, has it? The very idea that people should work to get ahead is antiquated nonsense on a par with the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus! > > No wonder Rush Limbaugh is so cranked up about you people. I always knew you were really really really really stupid, but this is a new low. I implied that hard work is no guarantee of success not that people should not work hard. Moron. “You people” indeed. And I knew Rush was an Oxycontin freak but I did not know he was a Meth Head as well, thanks for the info… ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/209 "2009-05-19T22:08:27Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Okay, this has all been fun and everything, but now I have to go do a little producing of my own. I called the government to ask if they’d send me a check so I wouldn’t have to work today, it doesn’t work like that…yet. Why people continue to engage you when stuff like this shows you’ll never respond honestly is beyond me. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/210 "2009-05-19T22:11:41Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](#): > > You can’t be serious. Do you live in a vacuum? > While there are many, many examples of people from little means achieving great success, these are merely exceptions. They will also prove to be an easier cite in an argument, as their tales of triumph over life’s hardships can be truly inspirational, and thus therefore recounted more often (in print or in cyberspace or in mass media) than the vast majority of people who struggle (while working much harder than you or me) and remain in the underclass. What underclass? The largest proportion of this country by far is the middle class and for the most part it lives just fine. Yeah, people struggle to pay for things that they have in abundance, any one of which would be considered a luxury in most parts of the world, and I don’t mean to say otherwise. But if you read my remarks, you saw that I didn’t attribute wealth creation to hard work only. It takes sacrifice, study, the ability to recognize and assess opportunities, etc. But the fact remains that anyone employing these tactics has just as much chance to succeed as anyone else, barring differences in their innate personal abilities. In other words, no one at the top of the money chain is holding them down and keeping them from earning as much money as their ability allows. The problem is that most people don’t want to put in the work involved (or they lack the requisite confidence or self-discipline). They just want to go do their menial, unchallenging jobs and then come home at night and be couch potatoes, watching TV and drinking beer. And there’s nothing wrong with that. Where the wrongfulness comes in is when liberal politicians and rabble-rousers try to convince them that they aren’t getting an equal share of the economic pie, when the truth is that their slice is pretty much an exact representation of their contribution to the creation of that pie. In other words, if I look up the recipe, go to the store and buy all the ingredients, mix them all together in the proper fashion and provide the house and oven that it’s being baked in, why should someone else be entitled to an equal share of the pie because they put it in the oven and took it out when it was done? Any yet, that is what liberalism calls ‘fair’, and assails me for being selfish and greedy if I think it’s only right that I should get more of the pie than the guy whose contribution was merely putting it in the oven and taking it back out again. How liberal thought ever gets taken seriously - much less gains an actual foothold - is an utter mystery to me. Okay…I mean it this time. I’m out. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/211 "2009-05-19T22:14:29Z")
**Starving Artist** , can we see some cites for your claims? Hmmm? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/212 "2009-05-19T22:21:34Z")
You want cites for what I believe? Oh boy! Oh boy! Oh boy! I finally get to say… _My posts are my cite!_ 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/213 "2009-05-19T22:43:05Z")
> [@askeptic](#): > > I implied that hard work is no guarantee of success not that people should not work hard. I said: _The fact remains that no one of wealth is keeping anyone down. Everyone has the ability to get ahead if they’re willing to work hard enough to make it happen._ In response you said: _Hey, the Tooth Fairy called and says that Santa Claus wants to know if you would be interested in buying a bridge from Ward Cleaver?_ So as is obvious, you did not imply that hard work is no guarantee of success (which is not my position anyway, as explained above), you implied that the notion of working hard to get ahead was little more than antiquated nonsense. Now it’s perfectly possible, even probable, that you intended to imply that hard work alone no guarantee of success, but that isn’t what you said. Thus you reveal either a stupidity sufficient to prevent you from realizing what you’ve actually said, or you’re dishonest enough to try to cover your error by pretending that you said something that you had not, and then trying to pin the discrepancy on me. I’m going with dishonest myself, with a dash of stupidity thrown in for good measure since what you did say is right there in black and white for anyone to read. > [@askeptic](#): > > Moron. Right backatcha! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/214 "2009-05-19T22:49:32Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I said: > > _The fact remains that no one of wealth is keeping anyone down. Everyone has the ability to get ahead if they’re willing to work hard enough to make it happen._ > > In response you said: > > _Hey, the Tooth Fairy called and says that Santa Claus wants to know if you would be interested in buying a bridge from Ward Cleaver?_ > > So as is obvious, you did not imply that hard work is no guarantee of success (which is not my position anyway, as explained above), you implied that the notion of working hard to get ahead was little more than antiquated nonsense. > > Now it’s perfectly possible, even probable, that you intended to imply that hard work alone no guarantee of success, but that isn’t what you said. Thus you reveal either a stupidity sufficient to prevent you from realizing what you’ve actually said, or you’re dishonest enough to try to cover your error by pretending that you said something that you had not, and then trying to pin the discrepancy on me. > > I’m going with dishonest myself, with a dash of stupidity thrown in for good measure since what you did say is right there in black and white for anyone to read. > > Right backatcha! 😃 You really think that the more words you type will confuse some people into thinking you’re not stupid don’t you? My meaning was clear and I stand by it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_jeffrey_lebowski/32/215_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Jeffrey\_Lebowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Jeffrey_Lebowski)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/215 "2009-05-19T22:53:41Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > What underclass? The largest proportion of this country by far is the middle class and for the most part it lives just fine. What sort of vacuum are you living in? Real incomes for middle class families, what folks can actually buy with their earnings, have remained flat for the last 30 years or so. [Cite here.](http://www.insideout.org/documentaries/middleclass/ptI.asp) ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/216 "2009-05-19T23:29:21Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > **Starving Artist** , can we see some cites for your claims? Hmmm? Please. The only cites delusion sufferers can offer, are, by definition, of their own making. As you can see, **SA** himself confirms this assessment. You might also notice how delusion makes individuals ignore proffered cites and the facts contained therein as they counter the world they’ve worked so hard to make up. It wouldn’t _be_ delusion if they were able to accept reality beyond the one they create for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2009, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/217 "2009-05-19T23:43:30Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > You want cites for what I believe? > > Oh boy! Oh boy! Oh boy! I finally get to say… > > _My posts are my cite!_ > > 😃 Except that’s the same thing you said when you claimed that society is worse off since the 1950s, and that gangster rap is a menace to society and causes kids to kill one another. :rolleyes: God, you’re a fucking moron. > [@RedFury](#): > > Please. The only cites delusion sufferers can offer, are, by definition, of their own making. As you can see, **SA** himself confirms this assessment. You might also notice how delusion makes individuals ignore proffered cites and the facts contained therein as they counter the world they’ve worked so hard to make up. > > It wouldn’t _be_ delusion if they were able to accept reality beyond the one they create for themselves. Of course. As I noted above. It’s still incredibly annoying. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2009, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/218 "2009-05-20T00:19:10Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Bullshit. There is absolutely nothing unfair about passing one’s estate to one’s heirs. It is only people who are of a confiscatory and redistributive turn of mind who think there is. [QUOTE=Starving Artist] From each according to his ability to each according to his ability is how I view it. [/QUOTE] So… having wealthy forebears is an ability? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2009, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/219 "2009-05-20T00:20:33Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > So… having wealthy forebears is an ability? I asked that earlier. No answer yet. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2009, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756/220 "2009-05-20T00:22:59Z")
Well, it does show discernment and prudence, and an inclination to hang out with a better class of people. Don’t know who you picked, but I picked a bunch of raggedy-ass peckerwoods. Not the best move. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keith-olbermann-should-kill-himself/496756.md?page=12)