# Kel Varnsen - Latex Division - Fuck You **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 21, 2005, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139 "2005-02-21T06:59:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dancing\_Dead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8baadc/32.png) [@Dancing\_Dead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dancing_Dead)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/21 "2005-02-21T09:34:39Z")
HST was a political and cultural writer who transcended boundaries. He amused and entertained us. He frightened us. In the end he was one of us. To “drive-by” and say something as this little prick did is beyond boorish. Obviously he has no respect for either the living or the dead, no sense of decency and has never known anyone who decided to step into death on their own terms. To call it cowardly is beyond belief. I have seen the coward, and the coward is **Kel** ---
**Author:** ![unclviny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e274bd/32.png) [@unclviny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unclviny)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/22 "2005-02-21T10:06:26Z")
**HST** lived the way he wanted to and (apparently) died the way he wanted to, I want me some of that “cowardice”. **KVLT FUCK OFF!!!** Unclviny ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/23 "2005-02-21T10:25:41Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > But grieving? I truly don’t understand grieving over someone i never even met. Sure, i can appreciate his contributions, and i think the world is, in a small way, a lesser place for his departure. But i can’t bring myself to grieve for dead celebrities, i’m afraid. I’ve been flamed for saying it before on these Boards, but i think that people who say they grieve for celebrities are often just playing a game of “I’m a bigger fan than you are” one-upmanship. We’ve been through this before. Celebrities. Sports. TV shows, movies, comic books. If you don’t take something as seriously as others do, then you just don’t. But when people scratch their heads and ask, “Why do you people care so much?” all they’re doing is derailing a thread. If you really **want** to know why a recently deceased celebrity was popular, read the mini-eulogies and following the links might shed some light. If you have further questions, or want to understand the popularity of a sport/book/movie/TV show/genre, start an IMHO or CS thread to ask. Otherwise, save the bandwidth. ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/24 "2005-02-21T10:26:49Z")
**mhendo** , Hunter S. wasn’t a celebrity. J.Lo is a celebrity. Hunter was a rebel, and a holy fool, and a beautiful loser, and a one-of-a-kind crazy stare-at-the-sun seer who looked at the world unflinchingly and called all its corruption and venality and stupidity as he saw it, but most of all he was a _writer_ and the world is a smaller place for his having left it: _that’s_ we’re mourning him. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/25 "2005-02-21T11:02:16Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > .Ferchrissakes, read his name, will ya? It’s **Kel**. Out of the east come the thundering hoofbeats of the great steed Whoosh!!! And as for grieving, **Case Sensitive** , that was dead on and absolutely perfect. The world is a poorer place without Hunter S. The man was a legend in his own time. A free spirit, a free thinker. Intelligent, honorable, and an outlaw to his core. His writing changed American culture and especially the American literary tradition. He was a damn fine human being, and a damn fine writer. And I mourn his passing. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/26 "2005-02-21T11:05:52Z")
> [@Rooves](#): > > Are you guys really that put off by what KVLD says? That just seems twitchy. What the fuck ever happened to decorum? Then there’s the stupidity of the observation itself. ---
**Author:** ![furlibusea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@furlibusea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furlibusea)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/27 "2005-02-21T11:59:40Z")
As much as I love the speed of the internet and the quick connection to all sorts of different people, I sometimes wonder if it isn’t taking away what is left of our civility. People say things behind the anonymity of the keyboard they would never say to the face of their intended audience. The generation that grew up with this medium doesn’t understand that its not how you treat other people, so they take this behavior out in public. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/28 "2005-02-21T12:24:53Z")
> [@furlibusea](#): > > The generation that grew up with this medium doesn’t understand that its not how you treat other people, so they take this behavior out in public. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![InvidiousCourgette](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@InvidiousCourgette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InvidiousCourgette)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/29 "2005-02-21T12:48:00Z")
> [@furlibusea](#): > > People say things behind the anonymity of the keyboard they would never say to the face of their intended audience. True, and these boards benefit overall, IMHO. We get to hear what people really think, without the filtration provided by conventional decorum. Of course there are times and there are places. **Kel** chose the wrong time and the wrong place. His view that suicide is cowardice is a tenable position to hold. There are better places to debate that position than in a thread devoted to a specific individual. Trivia item: In The Proud Highway the editor Douglas Brinkley notes that Fear and Loathing alludes to Kierkegaard’s Fear and Trembling. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/30 "2005-02-21T12:59:49Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Well. there are a couple schools of thought here. > > 1. He’s a coward for not fighting whatever demon, disease, etc., and that he took the “easy” way out. Suicide is in no way easy, but that’s not particularly relevant to the charge of cowardice. > > 2. He ended his life on his own terms. There’s no arguing with that, but it’s a stretch to call something like that “bravery”, either. > > 3. What a waste. This is my own personal thinking on the matter. > > Regardless, it’s better to remember the man for the way he lived than for the way he died. Lots of famous people have committed suicide, and their deaths do not diminish their works. > > So, was he wrong? It’s a matter of opinion. But nevertheless, it’s just not something that your average person would have felt it necessary to say. As we all know, though, the poster in question is anything but average. Those aren’t schools of thought, they are schools of ignorance. They indicate no knowledge of mental illness, and are superficial summations of a complex issue. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Side\_of\_the\_Floyd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bb73d2/32.png) [@Dark\_Side\_of\_the\_Floyd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dark_Side_of_the_Floyd)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/31 "2005-02-21T13:00:46Z")
**Karl** , get in here, you spineless fuck. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/32 "2005-02-21T13:09:55Z")
When **Kel** has done as much as Hunter did with his life, then he can criticize how he died. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/33 "2005-02-21T13:13:05Z")
Re-read your post and you’ll see why that worthles piece of shit won’t show up to get flamed. Who’s the real coward, _ **Karl** _? ---
**Author:** ![Turek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/turek/32/18782_2.png) [@Turek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turek)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/34 "2005-02-21T13:37:10Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Why post in the thread just to insult the guy? Because he’s an attention whore and he loves seeing his name on the screen, even if it is just to tell him what a prick he is. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/35 "2005-02-21T13:43:09Z")
Oh please. Since when are suicides hailed as fantastic? Isn’t it the epitome of selfishness for someone to end their life? > [@FinnAgain](#): > > Hunter S fucking Thompson is dead. > Dead, dead, dead. > He’s not coming back. > I’ll never get to read a fresh column of his. > I’ll never get to hear his wit, his style, his sense of honor. > The world has lost a living legend. That’s enough anguish for me to condemn the suicide, and I’d never even heard of the guy. I’m sure he had his reasons. Maybe he had a terminal, painful disease, or maybe it was the drug use, or the paranoia, or the increasing dissatisfaction with the state of the world, staring in the 1960s and going through the collapse of the Clinton dynasty. I suspect it was inevitable. That doesn’t make him a fucking hero for going through with it, or some sort of noble artist. He was just a poor, suffering guy. **Kel** , it doesn’t take away from the greatness of his life. Don’t shit in people’s grief, and don’t smear your ignorance all over the boards. ---
**Author:** ![look\_ninjas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b2d939/32.png) [@look\_ninjas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/look_ninjas)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/36 "2005-02-21T13:45:39Z")
The interesting thing is that this isn’t the first time he’s done this. Remember the [Reggie White thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5650929&postcount=18)? Look, if I don’t like someone, I don’t like them. If they die, and there’s a thread for people to express their regret and/or sorrow, I’m not going to come in and shit all over it. Learn some fucking manners, **Kel**. And I’m glad to know that **Walloon** is neither surprised nor sad at HST’s passing. Wait, actually, I’m not. Was there any point to that post at all? ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/37 "2005-02-21T13:46:53Z")
Well, as this isn’t a grieving thread, I’ll chime in with my opinion that Hunter was a fucking coward for killing himself. So was Papa Hemingway, and so was Kurt Cobain, and so was my fucktard aquaintance Chris who offed himself back in '93. And if I’d killed myself any of the several times I seriously contemplated it, I’d be a fucking coward too. It’s a shame that **Kel** felt the need to say it in a grieving thread, but the people calling for his drawing-and-quartering for his statement, rather than merely a strong scolding for where he put it, are being reactionary schmucks. “How dare you criticize a man who was known and admired for being willing to state his often fucked-up opinion of anything anywhere! You should be…uh…a very ashamed of himself award-winning journalist!” ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/38 "2005-02-21T13:50:00Z")
**Latex** is an award-winning journalist? ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/39 "2005-02-21T14:06:03Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > **Latex** is an award-winning journalist? It’s okay if you deliberately misunderstand in your indignation. Misguided grief is a strange thing. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2005, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139/40 "2005-02-21T14:27:09Z")
> [@Hamadryad](#): > > Well, as this isn’t a grieving thread, I’ll chime in with my opinion that Hunter was a fucking coward for killing himself. So was Papa Hemingway, and so was Kurt Cobain, and so was my fucktard aquaintance Chris who offed himself back in '93. And if I’d killed myself any of the several times I seriously contemplated it, I’d be a fucking coward too. Seriously, I’m sorry for your friend and your own bouts with depression. That being said, the whole “coward” opinion is ignorant and useless in terms of understanding depression or suicide. It’s about as useful to understand depression as telling depressives to “snap out of it.” It’s a medical goddamned condition. They need TREATMENT, not name-calling or blame. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kel-varnsen-latex-division-fuck-you/291139.md?page=3)