# Kelly McGillis is gay? No wonder she was in Top Gun. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 30, 2009, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836 "2009-04-30T14:06:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/61 "2009-05-02T15:20:43Z")
> [@5-4-Fighting](#): > > Speaking from experience, small children can be obviously gay. Just because I wasn’t having sex doesn’t mean my brothers, cousins and schoolmates weren’t able to pick up on something that was different about me, and my mother in her supportive way, and call me on it doesn’t mean that they couldn’t be, and apparently did turn out to be, right. > > Are you saying that it is only by having had sex one can be said to conclusively be gay, regardless of any inherent desires, etc. that simply haven’t been acted upon? Given that, it would follow that one can’t conclusively be called straight without evidence of sexual contact, either - unless you _don’t_ believe small children can be obviously heterosexual. If you don’t believe that, you’d be stuck maintaining that pre-pubescents can only be either “gay” or “asexual.” ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/62 "2009-05-02T15:36:46Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > Given that, it would follow that one can’t conclusively be called straight without evidence of sexual contact, either - unless you _don’t_ believe small children can be obviously heterosexual. If you don’t believe that, you’d be stuck maintaining that pre-pubescents can only be either “gay” or “asexual.” No, I just took it for granted that, because of the heteronormative framework and assumptions that usually abound in these types of discussions, the hetero corollarative misconception went without saying. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/63 "2009-05-02T15:43:35Z")
> [@5-4-Fighting](#): > > No, I just took it for granted that, because of the heteronormative framework and assumptions that usually abound in these types of discussions, the hetero corollarative misconception went without saying. I’ll give you a dollar if you promise to refrain from using the words "normative’ and “corollative” till June. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/64 "2009-05-02T15:44:50Z")
OK, I get you. But there are (at least in academic kook-land, where I currently reside) some theorists who wish to counter the heteronormative attitude with ideas that give gayness a sort of privileged status. Often they subtly, perhaps even unwittingly, presume that _all_ differences from traditional gender roles are simply degrees of homosexuality, which actually _reinforces_ traditional gender roles. “Corollarative?” What’s that? Pertaining to small Japanese cars? ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/65 "2009-05-02T15:49:29Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > … > > As for the list in this thread, the only one that I missed was Porshe Del Rossi. Damn, that’s a lipstick lesbian. Anyone else wish she would be with another hottie instead of the pantsuit queen, Ellen, who just looks so sloppy? > > … Ellen is not unattractive and she’s not sloppy. She’s always well-dressed even when very casually dressed, she just doesn’t dress feminine. There’s lots of straight women that aren’t comfortable with very feminine clothes. She’s also funny and that can sometimes be more important than looks even in hetero relationships. As for the gay kids discussion. I have to agree that thinking of a seven year old as orienting either way sexually seems wrong. Also, kids play and experiment, just because they may play house with their same sex friend and take a role opposite their gender doesn’t mean they’re gay. ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/66 "2009-05-02T15:56:46Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > OK, I get you. But there are (at least in academic kook-land, where I currently reside) some theorists who wish to counter the heteronormative attitude with ideas that give gayness a sort of privileged status. > > Often they subtly, perhaps even unwittingly, presume that _all_ differences from traditional gender roles are simply degrees of homosexuality, which actually _reinforces_ traditional gender roles. I get you now. > [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > “Corollarative?” What’s that? Pertaining to small Japanese cars? Good one! [Correlative - definition of correlative by The Free Dictionary](http://www.thefreedictionary.com/correlative) ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/67 "2009-05-02T16:00:20Z")
> [@5-4-Fighting](#): > > I get you now. > > [Correlative - definition of correlative by The Free Dictionary](http://www.thefreedictionary.com/correlative) Ah, of course. Pertaining to a correlation. There _is_ a word _corollarative,_ infrequently used, which means pertaining to a [corollary](http://dictionary.reference.com/dic?q=corollary&search=search). ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/68 "2009-05-02T16:03:06Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > Ah, of course. Pertaining to a correlation. > > There _is_ a word _corollarative,_ infrequently used, which means pertaining to a [corollary](http://dictionary.reference.com/dic?q=corollary&search=search). :smack: Oh, it’s the single “r” and the double “l.” And I’m usually such a gud speler. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/69 "2009-05-02T16:03:33Z")
> [@5-4-Fighting](#): > > Are you saying that it is only by having had sex one can be said to conclusively be gay, regardless of any inherent desires, etc. that simply haven’t been acted upon? No, what I’m saying is that I do not believe Stoid’s claim that observers can see that small children are “obviously gay,” to use her exact words (or, for that matter, obviously straight; I don’t buy that either can be accurately predicted by Stoid, or most anyone else, in a young child.) Assuming we’re talking about small children - not babies, say 5-6 years old - I’m skeptical that Stoid or anyone else can, with any accuracy, predict which kids will turn out to be gay and which ones won’t. Of course I don’t doubt that a gay person might say “Well, I always felt different, and people sensed that about me” but that’s (a) the observation of the gay person, not of anyone else, and it’s the observations of other people that I’m skeptical about, (b) an anecdote, and (c) post-hoc rationalization. EVERY kid thinks they’re different and unusual, and everyone has a tendency to look back and say “Oh, sure, sure, I knew Jim was gonna be gay. I remember that one time…” I just don’t buy that someone can look at a first grade class and tell which ones will be gay. Don’t buy it for an instant. If someone provides objective evidence to the contrary I’ll be happy to change my mind. Nitpick: “Portia de Rossi.” ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/70 "2009-05-02T16:10:53Z")
[Just one last hijackative comment] By being called “sissy,” “faggot,” and female forms of my given name from the age you mention, I’m pretty sure that is what my persecutors meant, and not just that they thought I was effeminate (which I don’t think I was/am). Even if they were referring to my perceived effeminacy, I (and everybody else) was pretty sure what they were referring to. And I know, my anecdote is not data, just my experience.[/hijackative comment] > [@RickJay](#): > > Nitpick: “Portia de Rossi.” Thanks, that was bothering me too. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/71 "2009-05-02T19:21:21Z")
Does anybody know why Bill O’Reilly labelled McGillis his daily “pinhead” this week? I don’t watch the show and the clip has been removed from the websites I’ve been to. I can’t imagine it’s just for being a lesbian since that’s been done to death in tennis alone and even for Billo it would seem a bit bigoted. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/72 "2009-05-02T19:29:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Okay I understand you can’t tell us his name. > > But just nod once if it’s Chuck Norris. No, if it was, I’d tell in a heartbeat because it would be too juicy. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/73 "2009-05-02T19:34:28Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > David Odgen Stiers is someone I didn’t know was _in_ the closet. My gaydar apparently works pretty well. Ah. I thought of more… pretty much the entire male cast AND crew of “Frasier”, except for Kelsey Grammer, and including John Mahoney, although again, I don’t think he’s copped yet… David Hyde Pierce has, right? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/74 "2009-05-02T19:36:32Z")
Yes, Mahoney came out recently, but I haven’t found a link. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/75 "2009-05-02T19:41:50Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > As for the gay kids discussion. I have to agree that thinking of a seven year old as orienting either way sexually seems wrong. Also, kids play and experiment, just because they may play house with their same sex friend and take a role opposite their gender doesn’t mean they’re gay. Of course. Which is why parents and other adults should just flow with whatever the kid him or herself is doing at any given time, because there is no way to know. Don’t assume they are straight and try to talk them out of it, because if they are gay you are instilling a belief that they are somehow wrong. Don’t assume they are gay and make an extra effort to talk them INTO it. Just leave the kid alone and let them simply be, and accept whatever it is “be” looks like. If they seem to be heading for being the next RuPaul, just roll with it. Your job as a parent, aside from the obvious feeding, clothing stuff, is to be the one (or two) persons on earth who _ **always** _ love, support, and believe in your child, no matter what, and, in a wonderful world, you never, ever, ever make your child feel like something about them that they have no control over, like their sexuality or gender identification or intelligence or passionate interest in flower arranging, is wrong, bad, or otherwise unacceptable. Which is pretty much what the people I know do. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/76 "2009-05-02T19:47:51Z")
Before someone comes along to pick a nit… there are exceptions, of course - if your child likes torturing animals, that needs to be addressed. And other things which are irrefutably harmful to the child or others. And before someone ELSE comes along to argue that being gay IS harmful, I reply: 1. No it isn’t and 2. #1 proves that the assertion that it is harmful IS “refutable”, which means it doesn’t fall under the exception. And before someone else else comes along to argue that all things are refutable, I am letting you know that I will not be engaging in that argument. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/77 "2009-05-02T20:15:48Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Yes, Mahoney came out recently, but I haven’t found a link. Recently? I guess I’ll be the one to say it. I remember hearing that Mahoney was gay since around the time Frasier began its run, a good 15 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2009, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/78 "2009-05-02T20:46:47Z")
I don’t think John Mahoney has come out so much as he isn’t in the closet. He’s seen out and about with his longtime boyfriend and doesn’t deny being gay or speak to the issue. Of course I can’t imagine he’s interviewed that much, though perhaps that’ll change if his villain character on _Burn Notice_ becomes a regular. Speaking of _Burn Notice_, I have no way of knowing as I’ve only seen him on film and in character, but Jeffrey Donovan gives me the gay vibes, especially his voice and his mannerisms. The fact that he’s an actor, 40, thin, never been married, and studied ballet in college is nice circumstantial evidence, though in and of itself proves nothing. Either way “I’d drank that boy’s bathwater”. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2009, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836/79 "2009-05-03T14:18:22Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > And I need to walk junk-first into a power saw. If being intelligent, funny, female and independent of gender stereotypes is incompatible with being heterosexual, I am not getting laid in this _lifetime._ I’ve always heard of her paired with men. It’s just recently I heard a rumor she was gay. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kelly-mcgillis-is-gay-no-wonder-she-was-in-top-gun/494836.md?page=3)