# (Ken Burns) Country Music Documentary **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 16, 2019, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317 "2019-09-16T15:26:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2019, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/41 "2019-09-22T22:59:42Z")
Hahahaha! I had never heard that story about Faron and Willie. I’d imagine I’d kiss you pretty well if you had shown me how to make $14K in the 1950’s too. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/42 "2019-09-23T03:01:47Z")
Damn, another great episode tonight. Merle made me cry a lot (and I always thought that was a stage name), Buck made me smile a lot and proud to be a musician, Loretta made me smile about being a human being. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/43 "2019-09-23T03:54:45Z")
Great episode. Merle Haggard just floors me. IMO one of the best vocalist in his genre. His songs pull my heart strings. For some reason at this time in my life he seems to be singing right to me. Love him. ---
**Author:** ![Periwinkle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Periwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Periwinkle)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/44 "2019-09-23T05:11:59Z")
My husband and I watched the last segment tonight, we are sorry it’s over. Very interesting and entertaining. One thing that surprised me was the short shrift that Glen Campbell got. From what I recall they showed a photo of him presenting an award to Loretta Lynn and mentioned his “pop” hits such as Gentle On My Mind and By the Time I Get to Phoenix. Gentle On My Mind is a beautiful country song, imo. (And both of these songs charted higher in country than in pop). I looked Glen up to see if maybe I had the wrong idea about his success in country, but nope. He won many country awards including CMA Entertainer of the year in 1968. Many hits on the country chart. I looked especially for the gorgeous “Wichita Lineman” and “Galveston” and they both hit #1 in country. Maybe because he was a SoCal guy rather than. Nashville (I don’t know where he recorded his albums), but I just thought it was strange. But all that being said I thought it was excellent and I wish it went on for a few more episodes. ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/45 "2019-09-23T06:58:28Z")
I’m enjoying it. I did spot one whopper: the series mentions Milton Brown as someone whom Bob Wills played with in the Light Crust Doughboys before Wills invented western swing. Music historians consider Brown to be the father of western swing, not Wills. Brown died in a car accident at the age of 32, which may be why he isn’t as well-known as Wills today. I prefer listening to Brown’s recordings because he didn’t rely on hokum the way Wills did. I wish that Burns had let the audience listen to at least one uninterrupted song per episode. This is a documentary about a type of music, so it should feature the music. The Jazz documentary had a similar problem: only two recordings were heard uninterrupted in the whole series (_West End Blues_ by Louis Armstrong and _Body and Soul_ by Coleman Hawkins). I’m grateful that, for once, Burns doesn’t hammer the audience over the head about race. He talks about it in appropriate places (e.g. the origins of the music, De Ford Bailey, Charley Pride). I am learning a lot about the history of the music and the performers. It does make me want to listen to some of those old recordings. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/46 "2019-09-23T12:12:51Z")
> [@Periwinkle](#): > > But all that being said I thought it was excellent and I wish it went on for a few more episodes. There’s still three more episodes left to air. We’re only at 1968. ---
**Author:** ![peedin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peedin/32/14095_2.png) [@peedin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peedin)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/47 "2019-09-23T13:56:34Z")
Wish there was more about Buck Owens. Sadly, the only song played almost in its entirety was Ode to Billy Joe, which I loathe. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/48 "2019-09-23T14:43:07Z")
Good episode last night. Loved the stories of Charley Pride and Merle Haggard; the “redemption” of Johnny Cash; Loretta Lynn taking little Connie Smith under wing and of course Marty Stuart’s story of meeting Connie for the first time as a kid and then finally marrying her 25 years later (she’s 18 years his senior). As a Nashvillian I appreciated learning more about the Bakersfield sound and Buck Owens. It left me wanting a lot more Dolly Parton but I assume there will be more coming, since they just covered her rise and not her reign. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/49 "2019-09-23T15:09:51Z")
I’ve generally enjoyed the series thus far, but why on earth is \*Wynton Marsalis \*a go-to interviewee on a documentary about country music? In fact, why is he spending any time on screen, apart from perhaps making a brief remark in episode one comparing jazz and country as musical forms? ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/50 "2019-09-23T16:01:26Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > I’ve generally enjoyed the series thus far, but why on earth is \*Wynton Marsalis \*a go-to interviewee on a documentary about country music? That’s Ken Burns. If Shelby Foote were still alive he might have used him. ---
**Author:** ![Periwinkle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Periwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Periwinkle)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/51 "2019-09-23T16:20:30Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > There’s still three more episodes left to air. We’re only at 1968. All of the episodes are available online, we have watched all eight. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/52 "2019-09-23T16:24:28Z")
Is there any Steve Earle? ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/53 "2019-09-23T16:30:16Z")
Yeah I couldn’t done without Jack White going on and on. Sure you like Loretta and all, but really your contribution to Country Music was a foot note, at best. And his hair was extremely stoopid! ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/54 "2019-09-23T16:44:34Z")
> [@Baal\_Houtham](#): > > I noticed banners for flour companies, and thought, "ohh yeah, that’s the source of Prairie Home’s “Powdermilk Biscuits” ads, and for _O Brother_’s radio sponsor, Pappy O’Daniel. > > And if anyone else is unacquainted with the real Pappy O’Daniel, [this summary](https://www.historynet.com/american-schemers-w-lee-pappy-odaniel.htm) is worth your time. It spells out the path from Pappy to Reagan to Donnie T. And I would say, the whole “flour” thing is based more than anything on the fact that Flatt and Scruggs for many years were sponsored by the Martha White flour company. Who I’m happy to say are still in business. Hell, F & S even had a theme song. Check out how the New York crowd wanted to hear it so much when the band appeared at [Carnegie Hall](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o88jGaMduVA) in the early sixties. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Periwinkle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Periwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Periwinkle)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/55 "2019-09-23T16:46:47Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Is there any Steve Earle? Yes, I think it was the last episode where they talked about him and played some of his music. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/56 "2019-09-23T16:54:43Z")
Cool, thanks. I planned to check it out anyway, but I’d hate to think they’d leave him out. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/57 "2019-09-23T16:58:24Z")
> [@Periwinkle](#): > > One thing that surprised me was the short shrift that Glen Campbell got. From what I recall they showed a photo of him presenting an award to Loretta Lynn and mentioned his “pop” hits such as Gentle On My Mind and By the Time I Get to Phoenix. > [@scabpicker](#): > > There’s still three more episodes left to air. We’re only at 1968. To be exact, we’re at mid-1968. Glen Campbell will host his variety show for the first time in the summer of 1968. Tammy Wynette comes out with “Stand By Your Man.” \* Hee-Haw\* comes along a year later, along with Johnny Cash’s TV variety show and Merle Haggard’s “Okie from Muskogee.” Country music is about to get its 15 minutes of fame. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/58 "2019-09-23T17:14:04Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > I did spot one whopper: the series mentions Milton Brown as someone whom Bob Wills played with in the Light Crust Doughboys before Wills invented western swing. Music historians consider Brown to be the father of western swing, not Wills. Brown died in a car accident at the age of 32, which may be why he isn’t as well-known as Wills today. I prefer listening to Brown’s recordings because he didn’t rely on hokum the way Wills did. This alludes to what I said earlier, and I agree. I know everyone cannot be included, but Burns could have trimmed literally two minutes out of the relatively large amount of time for Wills, not have lost anything vital, and mentioned someone so important to the development of the music. Last night, I again think Johnny Cash was given a bit too much time. The first 15 minutes were about his drug trials, in addition to great stuff about Folsom Prison, etc. And while I’ve heard it all before, I’m sure others have not, so that’s fine in and of itself, but being addicted to drugs does not say anything particularly unique about the _music_. Deal with it surely, but briefly and succinctly. I suspect the same thing will happen with George Jones and his much discussed problems with the bottle. But again, with all the Cash coverage, Jones wasn’t even mentioned last night, and the proper time to deal with his early successful career is gone. Hopefully, I’m jumping the gun, and we will get more about Jones’ early stuff. > [@](#): > > I wish that Burns had let the audience listen to at least one uninterrupted song per episode. This is a documentary about a type of music, so it should feature the music. The Jazz documentary had a similar problem: only two recordings were heard uninterrupted in the whole series (_West End Blues_ by Louis Armstrong and _Body and Soul_ by Coleman Hawkins). I’d like this too, but often wonder if royalties might be involved. Would they be prohibitively expensive? I have no idea. Each episode ends with a full song, but that ain’t enough! ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/59 "2019-09-23T17:38:04Z")
> [@peedin](#): > > Wish there was more about Buck Owens. > [@Skammer](#): > > As a Nashvillian I appreciated learning more about the Bakersfield sound and Buck Owens. Speaking of Buck, while hopefully not harping on my idea of excessive coverage of others, it would have been cool if more mention was made of [Don Rich’s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Rich) contribution and importance to the Bakersfield sound. I learned about him recently, and immediately recognized him as that guy I used to see on Hee Haw all the time back in the early 70s. I had no idea who he was back then. But you can see from my link everything he did. It’s not in that link, but I remember someone saying, perhaps a bit hyperbolically, that Rich was as important to Buck’s sound as Buck himself. Rich died in a motorcycle accident in 1974. In a 1990s interview, Owens said of him, “[h]e was like a brother, a son, and a best friend. Something I never said before, maybe I couldn’t, but I think my music life ended when he died. Oh yeah, I carried on and I existed, but the real joy and love, the real lightning and thunder is gone forever.” Seems a personal story like this, about someone who was also directly involved in the creating of a whole genre would have been right up the Ken Burns alley. Again, I know everyone can’t be included, but still. This is a prime example of what I’m saying. Sure, get personal, because that makes the whole story of country music come alive. But in doing so, making it about the music is the most important thing. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2019, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317/60 "2019-09-23T17:48:11Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > I’ve generally enjoyed the series thus far, but why on earth is \*Wynton Marsalis \*a go-to interviewee on a documentary about country music? In fact, why is he spending any time on screen, apart from perhaps making a brief remark in episode one comparing jazz and country as musical forms? Jazz was _very_ influential on CW music. In particular swing music led to western swing. If you hear a peppy, upbeat, danceable CW song (vs. the old gospel dirges), that’s likely a jazz influence. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ken-burns-country-music-documentary/840317.md?page=4)