# Kennedy Retiring from SCOTUS **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 27, 2018, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858 "2018-06-27T18:11:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/41 "2018-06-27T19:14:59Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > On the bright side (politically speaking), Democrats could hardly hope for a better motivator than the end of Roe v Wade. Terrible for women’s rights, but potentially amazing for future Democratic turnout. That’s the one silver lining to what is otherwise an unmitigated disaster for the left. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/42 "2018-06-27T19:17:00Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > At some point, liberals will have a run and get an unbalanced court on their side. They’ve really ramped up the efforts towards gerrymandering and voter suppression. If the court solidifies rather than fights against those actions (and that has been the case in the recent gerrymandering rulings), then that may not actually happen. We very well may have SC-approved rules which prevent democrats winning enough to ever have the power to put a more liberal justice on the court, at least in a timespan of decades - further out is too hard to predict. The more conservative the court becomes, the more likely rules will be implemented that lead to keeping it that way, or driving it even further. Barring sudden medical problems or something that forces this timeframe, Kennedy is kind of an asshole for this timing. His role on the court, at least by reputation, has been the voice of reason willing to take either side of an argument. He knows that retiring during a time like now will get him replaced by a hard right ideologue, not another voice of reason to bring balance. Given the obstruction the GOP is willing to be apart of, there won’t be a liberal judge on the court for a long time - so the best the democrats could hope for is to install a moderate… not too unlike Kennedy. So if Kennedy wanted to replace his own role in the court, he should’ve retired under a democratic president. Or at least waited a few months so the election and potential need for bipartisan support could’ve produced a less hard right conservative nominee. Right now is the worst time to retire if he cares about the makeup of the court and his legacy. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/43 "2018-06-27T19:18:29Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > They’ve really ramped up the efforts towards gerrymandering and voter suppression. If the court solidifies rather than fights against those actions (and that has been the case in the recent gerrymandering rulings), then that may not actually happen. We very well may have SC-approved rules which prevent democrats winning enough to ever have the power to put a more liberal justice on the court, at least in a timespan of decades - further out is too hard to predict. The Senate can’t be gerrymandered, at least not beyond the point that the states are sort of gerrymandered in the first place. Voter suppression could have an impact, but it’s not insurmountable. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/44 "2018-06-27T19:18:55Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Rush? There’s no need to rush. According to [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nominations_to_the_Supreme_Court_of_the_United_States): > > Kennedy was confirmed 65 days after his nomination. Thomas was confirmed 99 days after his. For Ginsburg it was a mere 50 days. Breyer was 73. Roberts (a bit odd because it shifted from Associate to Chief Justice partway through) was 23 or 39 days. Hell, let’s add them together and call it 62 days. Alito was 82. Sotomayor was 66, Kagan was 87 and Gorsuch was 65. How long did it take Obama’s nominee – whatsis name, oh yeah, Merrick Garland – to get confirmed? By my count, nearly two and a half years and still waiting. I kind of have a feeling it ain’t gonna happen at all. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/45 "2018-06-27T19:19:14Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > They won’t hold hearings - because there won’t be time; they’ll rush straight through to the vote, and invoke the Nuclear Option like they did with Gorsuch. … I know it’s a bit weird to quote myself, but I did just address this in another thread: > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > … Kennedy was confirmed 65 days after his nomination. Thomas was confirmed 99 days after his. For Ginsburg it was a mere 50 days. Breyer was 73. Roberts (a bit odd because it shifted from Associate to Chief Justice partway through) was 23 or 39 days. Hell, let’s add them together and call it 62 days. Alito was 82. Sotomayor was 66, Kagan was 87 and Gorsuch was 65. > > The midterms are in 132 days. President Trump could spend an entire month contemplating who from his list he’d like to select and the Senate could give that person a longer nominating process than any of the currently-serving justices, and it could still all be wrapped up before the midterms. And they don’t need to “invoke the nuclear option” again. It’s already done now, at least that my understanding. The rules were changed then and that change remains in effect today. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/46 "2018-06-27T19:20:16Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > here is the official white house list for SC nominees as of last Nov. > > [https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trumps-supreme-court-list/](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trumps-supreme-court-list/) I’m rooting for my boy Mike Lee (but I’ll probably be satisfied with anyone on the list). ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/47 "2018-06-27T19:20:28Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > But I don’t think SCOTUS will overturn Roe or Obergefell; they take stare decisis seriously, or at least likely 5 of them do or will. I think that is the crux. Another “faint-hearted originalist” in the Scalia mold (who freely abandoned doctrinaire originalism dependent on the merits of the case), or even a hypocritical originalist like Gorsuch (who claims originalism but contorts himself into knots when faced with a conflict), would essentially maintain the _status quo_. Another Thomas, though? That feels like a genuine risk to me. . ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/48 "2018-06-27T19:24:07Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Pardon me while I do some somersaults. “The American people are perfectly capable of having their say on this issue, so let’s give them a voice. Let’s let the American people decide. The Senate will appropriately revisit the matter when it considers the qualifications of the nominee the next president nominates, whoever that might be.” ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/49 "2018-06-27T19:24:16Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > How long did it take Obama’s nominee – whatsis name, oh yeah, Merrick Garland – to get confirmed? By my count, nearly two and a half years and still waiting. I kind of have a feeling it ain’t gonna happen at all. 😉 [His nomination expired early last year](https://www.wsj.com/articles/president-obamas-supreme-court-nomination-of-merrick-garland-expires-1483463952). If you (or he) are still waiting, it’s because you don’t understand how the process works. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/50 "2018-06-27T19:24:43Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Barring sudden medical problems or something that forces this timeframe, Kennedy is kind of an asshole for this timing. His role on the court, at least by reputation, has been the voice of reason willing to take either side of an argument. He knows that retiring during a time like now will get him replaced by a hard right ideologue, not another voice of reason to bring balance. Given the obstruction the GOP is willing to be apart of, there won’t be a liberal judge on the court for a long time - so the best the democrats could hope for is to install a moderate… not too unlike Kennedy. So if Kennedy wanted to replace his own role in the court, he should’ve retired under a democratic president. He’s 80 years old, he’s been on the court for 30 years, it’s entirely reasonable for him to say, “I’m tired, I have little time left in life, I can’t wait another 3 years and who knows, maybe Trump could even get reelected.” ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/51 "2018-06-27T19:25:49Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > That’s the one silver lining to what is otherwise an unmitigated disaster for the left. No…an unmitigated disaster would be RBG retiring or dying while Trump is POTUS. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/52 "2018-06-27T19:26:32Z")
He could’ve held out another few months to at least allow the election to potentially moderate the candidates put before the senate. If he knew he was this close to retirement he could’ve retired under Obama, who was far likely to replace him with someone who was ideologically near him than Trump will. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/53 "2018-06-27T19:29:10Z")
Here’s hoping for another Justice as good as Gorsuch. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/54 "2018-06-27T19:29:12Z")
Merged Elections and Great Debates thread into Great Debates Keep it civil, people. This thread is, right now, going on enhanced oversight (as my compliance department would call it) so I don’t want to see any getting out of hand, here. There’s another thread already in the BBQ Pit for such. If you must lose your temper, do it there. ---
**Author:** ![Corry\_El](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecae2f/32.png) [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/55 "2018-06-27T19:31:22Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Crazy people. Thankfully, neither Giffords nor Scalise were killed. So why would it have to be a crazy person who didn’t like gun rulings of a fictitious future liberal court? Why couldn’t it be crazy people who don’t like labor union social issue etc decisions of the court as it will likely be by its next session? Warped people enough in touch with reality to have a conscious political agenda like the Scalise shooter could appear on the right, as opposed to apolitical complete lunatics like the Giffords shooter, but I don’t know why the concern would be limited to people shooting members of a hypothetical future liberal court except pure political blindspot on your part. ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/56 "2018-06-27T19:31:54Z")
After this you have to wonder about Ruth Bader Ginsburg. I feel like she will probably stay on the Supreme Court until she literally dies or is completely incapacitated. But the reality is she is an 85 year old woman, that could drop dead at any moment, but I could also see her make it to the end of Trump’s term. If he were to get a chance to replace her as well, the court would become very slanted indeed. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/57 "2018-06-27T19:33:50Z")
> [@pool](#): > > After this you have to wonder about Ruth Bader Ginsburg. I feel like she will probably stay on the Supreme Court until she literally dies or is completely incapacitated. But the reality is she is an 85 year old woman, that could drop dead at any moment, but I could also see her make it to the end of Trump’s term. If he were to get a chance to replace her as well, the court would become very slanted indeed. I think she’s earned a nice, peaceful retirement. I hope she takes it. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/58 "2018-06-27T19:35:29Z")
> [@Corry\_El](#): > > So why would it have to be a crazy person who didn’t like gun rulings of a fictitious future liberal court? Why couldn’t it be crazy people who don’t like labor union social issue etc decisions of the court as it will likely be by its next session? > > Warped people enough in touch with reality to have a conscious political agenda like the Scalise shooter could appear on the right, as opposed to apolitical complete lunatics like the Giffords shooter, but I don’t know why the concern would be limited to people shooting members of a hypothetical future liberal court except pure political blindspot on your part. I haven’t asserted anything to the contrary. Nuts can be nutty on any side and on any issue. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/59 "2018-06-27T19:36:17Z")
I suppose that Chief Justice Roberts will be the swing vote now. I wonder how willing he will be to not just stop progress, but turn back the clock. Will gay marriage once again return to the states, or possibly be made illegal for the entire country again? What about abortion? What about voting rights? Could we possibly be headed back to a return of things like poll taxes or literacy tests? Are there any other areas that SCOTUS is now likely to make rulings on that could affect what was previously thought to be settled case law? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858/60 "2018-06-27T19:37:24Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Here’s hoping for another Justice as good as Gorsuch. “As good as” in the sense of “ **Shodan** agrees with his decisions?” Or “as good as” in the sense of **Shodan** agrees with his decision-making process? Because if it’s the latter, I would like to Discuss, and possibly Have Some Words. . [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kennedy-retiring-from-scotus/816858.md?page=4)