# Kerry's Botched Joke **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 31, 2006, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631 "2006-10-31T19:47:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/502 "2006-11-04T13:55:17Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] … **Luci,** one thing you’ve not commented on: in order to believe that he was, in fact, referring to Bush, you have to believe that Kerry intentionally wanted to draw attention to the President’s mediocre performance at Yale, which was slightly better than his own. Why the hell would he do that? Do you really think he would? Please answer that… [/QUOTE] Thanks for the lob. Pie easy. If GeeDubya had “done his homework”, been “smart”, applied anything resembling due diligence, he wouldn’t be “stuck in Iraq”. And, of course, neither would we. Thank you for listening, this has been another edition of “Easy Answers to Easy Questions.” ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/503 "2006-11-04T14:13:58Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] [QUOTE=justwannano] To the best of my knowledge, there aren’t any rutabagas “stuck in Iraq”. [/QUOTE] In your worldview, is there anything stuck in Iraq? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/504 "2006-11-04T14:44:33Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] …To claim your interpretation is one thing, to claim that the interpretation which says that he was referring to the truth is conjured out of thin air with no support whatsoever portraysnothing by sheer, blinding partisanship… [/quote] What a remarkable sentence. I would, indeed, remark upon it, but it is too many for me, I fold. I know, for instance, that the “sheer, blinding partisanship” must refer to me. So its probably a succinct and pithy rebuttal, it just happens to be more convoluted and twisted about than a balloon giraffe, it suffers from clause dependency. Probably “potrays nothing by” should be read as “potrays nothing _but_…” but, under present circumstances, I don’t feel at liberty to alter your text. Wouldn’t know where to begin if I did. > [@](#): > > …for your interpretation disappears. Poof!.. I am not, sir, a “poof”! I am, in fact, a ruggedly masculine needlepoint enthusiast with exquisite taste in interior design. I trust you will rush to offer heartfelt and blubbering apologies to poofs, girly boys, and raving queens who are, presumably, insulted to be identified with me. (What? What? Its what he said! The word is right there, no other interpretation makes any sense! I mean, I’m not saying its intentional, only that he’s guilty anyway!) ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/505 "2006-11-04T15:36:48Z")
For those of you tired of this distraction, please check out this outstanding video. It does not refer to the Kerry Bush-bashing joke, but it sets it quite properly in context. [Freedom](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gr5tx0lcyQc). Be advised that some pictures in the video are rough and not fully appropriate for work. Sometimes the truth hurts. ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/506 "2006-11-04T16:16:07Z")
[QUOTE=Stratocaster] This strenuous denial that his comments could not possibly be referring to the troops in Iraq is amusing, from someone who has followed this thread (with only a quick contribution, pages and pages ago). He was addressing college students, telling them that hard work and being smart in school will keep you from getting stuck in Iraq. _In context_, it is still completely reasonable to hear that and infer it referred to the troops in Iraq. The insistence in this thread that it can only, only, only be reasonably interpreted to mean what Kerry intended (and I believe he did intend nothing insulting to the troops) is laughable. I know people who were and are offended by this–people who will be voting Democrat, BTW–who simply are not inclined to cut Kerry any slack given his prior comments about U.S. troops. Not when a straightforward reading of his comments, without the benefit if his later explanation, can easily lead one to conclude he was dissing the troops. Do you think they are interpreting it correctly? Perhaps not (I don’t, for example). Are they being dishonest? Puh-leez! The SDMB is often such a prototypical echo chamber of liberal thought that it’s easy for something to pass as factual, as gospel, as beyond reasonable dispute, just by virtue of rapid and passionate repetition. My advice? Take a deep breath and step out of this thread into the real world. Not everyone thinks exactly like you do, and that doesn’t make them dishonest or partisan toadies. [/quote] Don’t know what this means exactly. **magellan01** ’s paraphrase is the “textbook” interpretation of one who did take offense to Kerry’s comment. What are the nonsensical interpretations you seem to perceive?What’s strange? I can picture college students getting a chuckle out of either interpretation. ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/507 "2006-11-04T16:31:53Z")
[QUOTE=Stratocaster] [QUOTE=justwannano] This strenuous denial that his comments could not possibly be referring to the troops in Iraq is amusing, from someone who has followed this thread (with only a quick contribution, pages and pages ago). He was addressing college students, telling them that hard work and being smart in school will keep you from getting stuck in Iraq. _In context_, it is still completely reasonable to hear that and infer it referred to the troops in Iraq. The insistence in this thread that it can only, only, only be reasonably interpreted to mean what Kerry intended (and I believe he did intend nothing insulting to the troops) is laughable. I know people who were and are offended by this–people who will be voting Democrat, BTW–who simply are not inclined to cut Kerry any slack given his prior comments about U.S. troops. Not when a straightforward reading of his comments, without the benefit if his later explanation, can easily lead one to conclude he was dissingSmart good grades the troops. Do you think they are interpreting it correctly? Perhaps not (I don’t, for example). Are they being dishonest? Puh-leez! The SDMB is often such a prototypical echo chamber of liberal thought that it’s easy for something to pass as factual, as gospel, as beyond reasonable dispute, just by virtue of rapid and passionate repetition. My advice? Take a deep breath and step out of this thread into the real world. Not everyone thinks exactly like you do, and that doesn’t make them dishonest or partisan toadies. Don’t know what this means exactly. **magellan01** ’s paraphrase is the “textbook” interpretation of one who did take offense to Kerry’s comment. What are the nonsensical interpretations you seem to perceive?What’s strange? I can picture college students getting a chuckle out of either interpretation. [/QUOTE] This strenuous denial that his comments could not possibly be referring to the troops in Iraq is amusing, You found my comment to be a strenuous denile? Ha Ha Ha I laugh. You are just like those who you say you know that took offence to Kerrys joke. He was addressing college students, telling them that hard work and being smart in school will keep you from getting stuck in Iraq. As I infered in my first post I am from the 60s. I lived in the Vietnam era. I know that if the draft is initiated again there will be many that will not be able to keep from going to war. good grades or not. Not at all funny. Keep in mind Kerrys shot was at President George Bush. The idiot that got us into this war. So Sir , as I take a deep breath and slowly back out of this thread I certainly hope you and others who would bash a man who is reminding college students that they may indeed get to see Iraq first hand would shut your mouths for a while and think over your comments before jumping to conclusions. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/508 "2006-11-04T16:36:43Z")
Fortunately, all the fake indignation over this doesn’t seem to be affecting the [polls](http://www.electoral-vote.com/). The Dems have actually taken slight leads in Virginia and Missouri since the incident. I think the righties should take some acting lessons. Nobody bought their performances. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/509 "2006-11-04T18:46:27Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Thanks for the lob. Pie easy. If GeeDubya had “done his homework”, been “smart”, applied anything resembling due diligence, he wouldn’t be “stuck in Iraq”. And, of course, neither would we. Thank you for listening, this has been another edition of “Easy Answers to Easy Questions.” [/QUOTE] Uh, cute and all, but you didn’t answer the questions. You offered an interpretation, that is all. Here they are again. I’ll bold them this time: [QUOTE=magellan01] Luci, one thing you’ve not commented on: in order to believe that he was, in fact, referring to Bush, you have to believe that Kerry intentionally wanted to draw attention to the President’s mediocre performance at Yale, which was slightly better than his own. **Why the hell would he do that? Do you really think he would?** [/QUOTE] And it seems you prefer to ignore/avoid my request that you comment on this, as well. If it was just an oversight, please try to be specific and address what is written. [QUOTE=magellan01] Also, please explain the logic of this supposed botch joke. Bush is stuck in Iraq because he didn’t do well? “Take that to heart kids, God forbid you graduate Yale and then get an MBA from Harvard. If those horrorible failings should befall you (just like they did BUsh), you might just wind up the most powerful person in the world. So buckle down and don’t let that happen to you!!!” Nope. Assuming that whatever he intended to say was going to make sense, that certainly ain’t it. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/510 "2006-11-04T18:48:12Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Fortunately, all the fake indignation over this doesn’t seem to be affecting the [polls](http://www.electoral-vote.com/). The Dems have actually taken slight leads in Virginia and Missouri since the incident. I think the righties should take some acting lessons. Nobody bought their performances. [/QUOTE] Why would Kerry’s remarks have affected the polls? He isn’t running for anything. But I guess if people need acting lessons in expressing fake indignation they can take them from the Democrats who are running-- like HRC and Harold Ford. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/511 "2006-11-04T18:51:12Z")
Bush is “stuck” in Iraq because he didn’t study or do his “homework” when it came to devising any kind of strategy for the occupation, the ineviable insurgency, the inevitable civil war or an exit plan. He went in without having a clue what he was doing. It was like trying to perform brain surgery bursting with confidence from having watched a couple of episodes of ER. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/512 "2006-11-04T18:54:05Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Why would Kerry’s remarks have affected the polls? [/quote] You’ll have to ask the conservatives that. Fox News was pounding that theme for days. So was the White House. > [@](#): > > But I guess if people need acting lessons in expressing fake indignation they can take them from the Democrats who are running-- like HRC and Harold Ford. I’ve already said in this thread that both HRC and Harold Ford are completely full of shit on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/513 "2006-11-04T18:57:13Z")
How much “homework” did Kerry do when he voted to authorize the use of force in Iraq? I suspect he did precisely the same homework he did when he voted against the use of force under Bush Sr-- ie, stuck his figder into the political wind to see which way it was blowing. Bush may be a complete idiot, and he bears full responsibility for what’s happening in Iraq, but frankly I have little if any respect for Kerry on this subject. He should shut his trap, as his fellow Democracts have told him to do, and quit jockying for position in '08. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/514 "2006-11-04T18:58:46Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] What a remarkable sentence. I would, indeed, remark upon it, but it is too many for me, I fold. I know, for instance, that the “sheer, blinding partisanship” must refer to me. So its probably a succinct and pithy rebuttal, it just happens to be more convoluted and twisted about than a balloon giraffe, it suffers from clause dependency. Probably “potrays nothing by” should be read as “potrays nothing _but_…” but, under present circumstances, I don’t feel at liberty to alter your text. Wouldn’t know where to begin if I did. [/QUOTE] My error. It was late/early. Substitute “troops” for “truth” for: “…To claim your interpretation is one thing, to claim that the interpretation which says that he was referring to the **troops** is conjured out of thin air with no support whatsoever portrays nothing by sheer, blinding partisanship…” [QUOTE=elucidator] I am not, sir, a “poof”! I am, in fact, a ruggedly masculine needlepoint enthusiast with exquisite taste in interior design. I trust you will rush to offer heartfelt and blubbering apologies to poofs, girly boys, and raving queens who are, presumably, insulted to be identified with me. [/QUOTE] Your “offense” would make sense if the “Poof” was preceded by a comma. It wasn’t. But I’m glad your having fun being silly. I think I understand you a little better now. [QUOTE=elucidator] (What? What? Its what he said! The word is right there, no other interpretation makes any sense! I mean, I’m not saying its intentional, only that he’s guilty anyway!) [/QUOTE] :rolleyes: I guess that’s why words the words “I’m sorry, I didn’t intend to \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_.” have never been strung together in that order. Note to Webster: strike the word “inadvertent” from all future editions. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/515 "2006-11-04T19:01:49Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] How much “homework” did Kerry do when he voted to authorize the use of force in Iraq? I suspect he did precisely the same homework he did when he voted against the use of force under Bush Sr-- ie, stuck his figder into the political wind to see which way it was blowing. Bush may be a complete idiot, and he bears full responsibility for what’s happening in Iraq, but frankly I have little if any respect for Kerry on this subject. He should shut his trap, as his fellow Democracts have told him to do, and quit jockying for position in '08. [/QUOTE] Kerry never voted to authorize force in Iraq. That’s a myth. The vote was to give Bush the authority to invade IF NECESSARY. It was still a stupid thing to do and the Dems. pussies that they are, let themselves get stampeded into it in an election year, but strictly speaking, it was NOT an up or down vote on the invasion. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/516 "2006-11-04T19:03:08Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] You’ll have to ask the conservatives that. Fox News was pounding that theme for days. [/QUOTE] All the cable news channels were milking this story as much they could. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/517 "2006-11-04T19:07:10Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Fortunately, all the fake indignation over this doesn’t seem to be affecting the [polls](http://www.electoral-vote.com/). The Dems have actually taken slight leads in Virginia and Missouri since the incident. I think the righties should take some acting lessons. Nobody bought their performances. [/QUOTE] Which is not surprising, since Kerry is not running. The one good thing that came out of this, though, is that the small chance that it might have been Kerry in '08 jsut went up in smoke. I do think HRC, Ford and a few others have actually helped themselves on this. Your ability to mind read their true feelings aside. By the way, can you tell me HRC’s thoughts on pie: does she prefer apple, bluebarry or pecan?. Could you squint your eyes real tight or spin around real fast or whatever you do and tap into her brain on this? Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/518 "2006-11-04T22:58:57Z")
[QUOTE=justwannano] So Sir , as I take a deep breath and slowly back out of this thread I certainly hope you and others who would bash a man who is reminding college students that they may indeed get to see Iraq first hand would shut your mouths for a while and think over your comments before jumping to conclusions. [/QUOTE] Um, okee-dokee. I promise to stop bashing the man I have yet to start bashing. Or something. BTW, do you understand that this corker of a sentence that you provided supports the interpretation that Kerry’s comments were offensive? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/519 "2006-11-04T23:16:39Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Kerry never voted to authorize force in Iraq. That’s a myth. [/QUOTE] Only according to your theology, which is the best way to describe that viewpoint since it is completely disconnected from any facts. The damn thing was called the [AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF MILITARY FORCE AGAINST IRAQ RESOLUTION OF 2002](http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=107_cong_public_laws&docid=f:publ243.107) for God’s sake. It gave Bush the sole authority to determine when and if force would be used. You know that, I know that, and Kerry knew that. You wouldn’t have voted for it, I wouldn’t have voted for it and Kerry shouldn’t have voted for it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/520 "2006-11-04T23:37:34Z")
Not so fast, **John**. If memory serves, there was some resistance to a _carte blanche_, which resistance resulted in fulsome reassurances from the Lying Sacks to the effect that the resolution was intended to strengthen the President’s hand as it relates to diplomacy, etc. Remember, Lying Sack Numero Uno was swearing up and down that he intended to exhaust all diplomatic avenues. Lies, all lies, we now know. Further, promises were made about “accountability”, about referring back to Congress for approval. So how do you vote against that, without saying “He’s lying through his teeth!”? That’s what I believed, and said so repeatedly, and, if you will recall, mine was a scorned minority position. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631/521 "2006-11-04T23:50:21Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So how do you vote against that, without saying “He’s lying through his teeth!”? That’s what I believed, and said so repeatedly, and, if you will recall, mine was a scorned minority position. Easy. 23 Senators (21 Ds, 1 I, and 1 R) had no trouble doing it. Perhaps we can look at Senator Byrd who said: > [@](#): > > [Byrd](http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/10/11/iraq.us/) had argued the resolution amounted to a “blank check” for the White House. > > “This is the Tonkin Gulf resolution all over again,” Byrd said. “Let us stop, look and listen. Let us not give this president or any president unchecked power. Remember the Constitution.” Or, listen to what [Russ Fiengold said](http://www.antiwar.com/orig/feingold1.html). Sorry if I have no patience with Kerry, but I have little doubt that his vote was mostly political in nature. If someone like Fiengold wants to lecture about doing homework and not being intellectually lazy, I’m all ears. Kerry can go jump in a lake, as far as I’m concerned. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kerrys-botched-joke/378631.md?page=27)