# Keurig K40 coffemaker, good, but not a French Press... **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 25, 2007, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239 "2007-12-25T23:34:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/21 "2007-12-27T18:34:51Z")
I have a great pain between my ears. Think I’ll just stick with cold-brewed. No pressure, no filters, no whoelectrocardioflux. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/22 "2007-12-27T19:22:31Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Yes, there is pressure, even if you had a frictionless seal on the sides of the piston, you would still be putting pressure on the water. The amount of pressure applied varies with the amount of force you push down on the piston (and the number and size of the holes in the piston). And please note that I have said **nothing** about how french press coffee _tastes!_ **NOTHING!** don’t make me repeat this again, or I’ll whip out the **Bosda** sized fonts. [/QUOTE] I don’t understand. Not only do you have the weight of the strainer, but also the weight of the rod assembly and other miscellaneous things (knob at the top, any extra doodads) to push it down. I think that if you had a plunger without the gasket on it, it would sink to the bottom (it might need a push at the beginning to get it below the top of the water and negate the buoyancy). Go to your kitchen, fill a sink with water, and place a sieve in it. Does the sieve float or sink on its own? IANAPhysicist, but that’s how I imagine it working (but you’ll never get me to ruin my press by testing the theory. :p) ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/23 "2007-12-27T19:37:53Z")
[QUOTE=chaoticbear] I don’t understand. Not only do you have the weight of the strainer, but also the weight of the rod assembly and other miscellaneous things (knob at the top, any extra doodads) to push it down. [/quote] And all of those things _will_ exert pressure on the water, thus forcing in through the holes. [/quote] > [@](#): > > I think that if you had a plunger without the gasket on it, it would sink to the bottom (it might need a push at the beginning to get it below the top of the water and negate the buoyancy). Go to your kitchen, fill a sink with water, and place a sieve in it. Does the sieve float or sink on its own? that all depends upon a number of factors. For example, if the sieve is made out of something less dense than water (say plastic) then it would tend to _float_. If it was made of metal, it would _sink_. As it sank, it would _push_ the water out of it’s way. The amount of force exerted depends upon things like the weight of the plunger, the size of the piston, and the size and number of holes in it. [This thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=448007) has a discussion of what happens to things sinking through water. > [@](#): > > IANAPhysicist, but that’s how I imagine it working (but you’ll never get me to ruin my press by testing the theory. :p) I’m not asking you to. Ruining a coffee maker is a sin on par with spilling alcohol, IMHO, unless it’s owned by Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/24 "2007-12-27T20:02:07Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] And all of those things _will_ exert pressure on the water, thus forcing in through the holes. [/quote] that all depends upon a number of factors. For example, if the sieve is made out of something less dense than water (say plastic) then it would tend to _float_. If it was made of metal, it would _sink_. As it sank, it would _push_ the water out of it’s way. The amount of force exerted depends upon things like the weight of the plunger, the size of the piston, and the size and number of holes in it. [This thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=448007) has a discussion of what happens to things sinking through water. I’m not asking you to. Ruining a coffee maker is a sin on par with spilling alcohol, IMHO, unless it’s owned by Starbucks. [/QUOTE] I think we’re saying the same thing. Someone upthread said that there were nasty things that were pressed out because of the pressure that you imposed upon the system when you pushed the plunger down. My argument is that it shouldn’t be more pressure exerted on the grounds from either the force of the gravity acting upon the water in a drip machine vs. the force of gravity acting upon the sieve in a french press. ---
**Author:** ![brewha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@brewha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brewha)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/25 "2007-12-27T20:09:57Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] > [@brewha](#): > > I just wanted to tell you that next time you find out that my favorite way of doing something is harmful - keep it to yourself! First hotdogs - now my French Press! I suppose next your going to tell me that my scotch is harmful to my liver! Not if you mix it [with coffee!](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=375664)😉 [/QUOTE] You sir, have redeemed yourself! Now, if you can tell me that the scotch neutralizes the coffee-oil’s diterpenes (whatever the hell that is) you will be my hero. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/26 "2007-12-27T20:27:26Z")
[QUOTE=chaoticbear] think we’re saying the same thing. Someone upthread said that there were nasty things that were pressed out because of the pressure that you imposed upon the system when you pushed the plunger down. My argument is that it shouldn’t be more pressure exerted on the grounds from either the force of the gravity acting upon the water in a drip machine vs. the force of gravity acting upon the sieve in a french press. [/QUOTE] Uh, no. We’re _not_ saying the same thing at _all_. First and foremost, no matter _how_ the press moves through the water, it _will_ exert pressure on the water (if it _didn’t_ the water _wouldn’t_ get out of it’s way). How _much_ pressure is exerted on the water is dependant upon a number of variables. (If you _really_ want to get technical, you can include the amount of air pressure pushing down on the water, which changes with altitude as well as the temperature of water.) The pressure in a french press _is_ greater because when you _push_ the plunger down, you _are_ applying pressure to it. Given that you’re pushing the press through _faster_ than it could be expected to sink on it’s own (ignoring the effects of friction), you are exerting _more_ force on the water as it flows through the grounds. Look, if it _doesn’t_ force more things out of the coffee, then why do people claim that the coffee _tastes_ better if it’s made in a french press? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/27 "2007-12-27T20:33:48Z")
[QUOTE=brewha] You sir, have redeemed yourself! Now, if you can tell me that the scotch neutralizes the coffee-oil’s diterpenes (whatever the hell that is) you will be my hero. [/QUOTE] I don’t know if it does or not, but I see no reason to take any chances! Better take plenty of scotch with your coffee (or should it be plenty of coffee with your scotch) while we wait for the results of testing! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/28 "2007-12-27T21:04:25Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Uh, no. We’re _not_ saying the same thing at _all_. First and foremost, no matter _how_ the press moves through the water, it _will_ exert pressure on the water (if it _didn’t_ the water _wouldn’t_ get out of it’s way). How _much_ pressure is exerted on the water is dependant upon a number of variables. (If you _really_ want to get technical, you can include the amount of air pressure pushing down on the water, which changes with altitude as well as the temperature of water.) The pressure in a french press _is_ greater because when you _push_ the plunger down, you _are_ applying pressure to it. Given that you’re pushing the press through _faster_ than it could be expected to sink on it’s own (ignoring the effects of friction), you are exerting _more_ force on the water as it flows through the grounds. Look, if it _doesn’t_ force more things out of the coffee, then why do people claim that the coffee _tastes_ better if it’s made in a french press? [/QUOTE] But, arguably, you could just let the press sink to the bottom of the press, with no ill effects. And you’re not pressing anything at all out of the coffee. The extra flavor and body is attributed to the correct brewing of the coffee, that is, that the coffee grounds are spending an identical and ideal amount of time in contact with the water, as compared to the problems with drip machines described above. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/29 "2007-12-27T21:31:55Z")
[QUOTE=chaoticbear] But, arguably, you could just let the press sink to the bottom of the press, with no ill effects. And you’re not pressing anything at all out of the coffee. [/quote] No, there _will_ pressure on the grounds, even if the press just sinks. The natural inclination of grounds (at least intially) is to _float_, so they will be forced to move through the water at a faster rate than they normally would. > [@](#): > > The extra flavor and body is attributed to the correct brewing of the coffee, that is, that the coffee grounds are spending an identical and ideal amount of time in contact with the water, as compared to the problems with drip machines described above. And unless you can come up with some kind of study which proves that, it’s mere speculation. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/30 "2007-12-27T22:33:25Z")
So as I understand it: bashing the beans violently with a coffee grinder = okay. Straining them through a fine mesh sieve (which sounds suspiciously like a coffee filter, but I’m not a PhD) = irreparable harm. Got it. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/31 "2007-12-27T22:50:07Z")
[QUOTE=Chefguy] So as I understand it: bashing the beans violently with a coffee grinder = okay. Straining them through a fine mesh sieve (which sounds suspiciously like a coffee filter, but I’m not a PhD) = irreparable harm. Got it. [/QUOTE] Thank you so much for putting words in my mouth. If you’d actually bothered to read anything that I’ve posted you’ll see that **nowhere** did I say _any_ of that. I did _not_ say that using a french press caused “irreparable harm” I said, and provided a cite which backed this up, that > [@](#): > > ``` > I once read somewhere that French Presses are actually the *worst* way to make coffee, not because it made bad tasting coffee, but because the French Press pushed out harmful oils and compounds naturally occuring in the beans, while other types of coffee makers didn't. IIRC, the additional oils and compounds were so bad for you that they completely negated all of coffee's beneficial effects (save the caffiene of course). > > ``` No where did I say, “ **Don’t** use a french press.” Nor does it take a Phd to understand any of what I’ve posted. It _does_, however, take an open mind and a willingness to actually read. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2007, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/32 "2007-12-27T22:59:05Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Thank you so much for putting words in my mouth. If you’d actually bothered to read anything that I’ve posted you’ll see that **nowhere** did I say _any_ of that. I did _not_ say that using a french press caused “irreparable harm” I said, and provided a cite which backed this up, that No where did I say, “ **Don’t** use a french press.” Nor does it take a Phd to understand any of what I’ve posted. It _does_, however, take an open mind and a willingness to actually read. [/QUOTE] Easy, big fellah. Just because I didn’t use smilies doesn’t mean I wasn’t pulling your chain. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2007, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/33 "2007-12-28T02:52:02Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] No, there _will_ pressure on the grounds, even if the press just sinks. The natural inclination of grounds (at least intially) is to _float_, so they will be forced to move through the water at a faster rate than they normally would. [/quote] As opposed to the weight of the water in the drip basket “forcing” things out of the coffee? And unless you can come up with some kind of study which proves that, it’s mere speculation. [/QUOTE] That’s how extraction of anything works. The longer it is in contact with the solvent, the more solute will be extracted. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/34 "2007-12-28T02:59:26Z")
[QUOTE=chaoticbear] That’s how extraction of anything works. The longer it is in contact with the solvent, the more solute will be extracted. [/QUOTE] But that doesn’t prove that that is the _sole_ source of the compounds in the coffee. And you can soak aluminum in water for as long as you want, but a significant amount of the aluminum is _not_ going to mix with the water. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239/35 "2007-12-31T13:00:46Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] .. Let’s see, I try and give easy to understand answers and you respond with? [/QUOTE] I panicked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/keurig-k40-coffemaker-good-but-not-a-french-press/431239.md?page=1)