# Kickstarter: As an investor, what's in it for me? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 11, 2012, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714 "2012-12-11T17:11:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/21 "2012-12-12T04:07:52Z")
By virtue of the circle(s) of friends I have on Facebook, the only kickstarters I’ve heard about are for video games. So, the reward would be in-game stuff like a special mount or signature spell or something, and the long-term reward would be getting to play a game that otherwise would have never been written. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/22 "2012-12-12T04:22:05Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > How do you folks find these websites? > > If it wasnt for the SD, i wouldn’t have a clue about so many things on the web. But without word of mouth, did anyone find this on their own? Googling “extra cash in my pocket, looking for a place to dump it”? > > I think the website should have its own pot. Does it? I think most people first encounter Kickstarter via some other site that’s running a Kickstarter campaign for its own project. For example, I imagine a lot of people first heard about Kickstarter when Rich Burlew set up his Kickstarter campaign and posted about it on the Order of the Stick website. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/23 "2012-12-12T04:28:22Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > And the great majority of kickstarter rewards are delivered late. If the business model is bad, they may not be delivered at all. I’ve never had a project not get delivered at all. As for lateness, I figure you have to expect a long wait. The basic model is you’re sending somebody the money to get started on a project - you can’t expect delivery of the final product six weeks later. I don’t think kickstarter projects are any slower than other equivalent projects, but customers notice the long development time more with kickstarter because they were aware of the project from its beginning rather than first hearing about it at a later stage of the process. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/24 "2012-12-12T05:35:41Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > K And the great majority of kickstarter rewards are delivered late. If the business model is bad, they may not be delivered at all. \*Caveat backer. since we exist in reality, obviously things can go wrong. anyone who doesn’t take this into account is delusional. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/25 "2012-12-12T05:57:27Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > How do you folks find these websites? I learned about the OOTS Kickstarter at the OOTS website, and about the Obsidian game Kickstarter on a scifi/fantasy/gaming forum I frequent. [Kickstarter](http://www.kickstarter.com/) itself is its own website though. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/26 "2012-12-12T06:30:26Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I learned about the OOTS Kickstarter at the OOTS website, and about the Obsidian game Kickstarter on a scifi/fantasy/gaming forum I frequent. [Kickstarter](http://www.kickstarter.com/) itself is its own website though. I have gone to the Kickstarter website and found it fascinating. I also have an idea that i may present to the website. Let’s say it is approved. Would i be permitted to solicit the Straight Dope members? Also, i have a question about how kickstarter makes momey theselves. Do they get a cut of approved project funding? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/27 "2012-12-12T07:48:51Z")
My little group of friends have considered going through Kickstarter, or actually an international equivalent like Indiegogo, for our short film projects. I’m part way through finishing my first short film and showcasing that will hopefully prove our skills and excite people enough to crowdfund a more elaborate sequel (or an unrelated but similar film project) allowing us to pay everyone on the cast and crew, and have fancier costumes and sets, etc. Or then again, maybe it won’t. They’re becoming so glutted with projects that it’s harder to get noticed, especially amongst so many worthy ideas. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/28 "2012-12-12T10:27:27Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Let’s say it is approved. Would i be permitted to solicit the Straight Dope members? That’s a Straight Dope policy question, not a Kickstarter one. My _guess_ is that you’d be able to do it in the Marketplace subforum for certain, but would have to ask staff permission to do so anywhere else. > [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Also, i have a question about how kickstarter makes momey theselves. Do they get a cut of approved project funding? [\](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kickstarter#Model) I see that they get 5% of the funding. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/29 "2012-12-12T12:52:53Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > That’s a Straight Dope policy question, not a Kickstarter one. My _guess_ is that you’d be able to do it in the Marketplace subforum for certain, but would have to ask staff permission to do so anywhere else. > > [\](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kickstarter#Model) I see that they get 5% of the funding. And Amazon Payments, who do the payment processing, get another 3-5%. They also estimate that up to 5% of pledged payments will be rejected (credit card problems, generally). ---
**Author:** ![tanstaafl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba8739/32.png) [@tanstaafl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanstaafl)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/30 "2012-12-12T12:53:25Z")
Kickstarter is really about the art patronage angle, as has been mentioned. The fact that it _now_ seems to be a pre-order shop is almost an accident. [Blame it on this](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/66710809/double-fine-adventure) Tim Schafer (who designed such things as _Day of the Tentacle_ and _Psychonauts_) wanted to produce a new adventure game, but since those aren’t considered marketable anymore he couldn’t find a publisher. So, he went to Kickstarter and wound up with over $3 million. This seemed to open the floodgates to a _lot_ of games and gaming related projects. The top-funded projects on Kickstarter right now are mostly along those lines, led by the [Ouya](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ouya/ouya-a-new-kind-of-video-game-console), an open-source gaming console that cleared $8 million. The highest funded Kickstarter is the non-gaming (but still hardware) [Pebble Watch](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/597507018/pebble-e-paper-watch-for-iphone-and-android). So while it started as a method for arts patronage, it’s turning into a pre-order shop. Kickstarter is trying to distance itself from that and has released several statements saying “We are not a store!” but that’s what most people seem to be treating it as these days. There have been a couple of failures so far but I think the day is coming when one of the really big Kickstarters will fail and a lot of people will be upset but there won’t be much they can do about it. ---
**Author:** ![solosam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@solosam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solosam)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/31 "2012-12-12T16:13:29Z")
I recently contributed to a Kickstarter. I was basically pre-ordering a product. Normally a business acquires start-up capital through investment loans. Then they make their product, and then they see if it will sell. In this model, I pre-order my product, and the cash gets used to fund the start-up and production costs. The downside is that if anything goes wrong my investment might be wasted. The upside is that if I didn’t “contribute” then the product would never get made at all. I put “contribute” in quotation marks because I think of it as a transaction rather than a donation. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/32 "2012-12-12T16:25:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I don’t think kickstarter projects are any slower than other equivalent projects, but customers notice the long development time more with kickstarter because they were aware of the project from its beginning rather than first hearing about it at a later stage of the process. I’ve seen a few instances where some guy has a clever idea for a widget and thinks that if he raises $15,000 he can produce a few hundred a year in his basement or whatever. Then the kickstart goes viral and he finds himself with $300k in capital and 10,000 pre-orders, with no actual plan on how to produce such a quantity. Now he’s got to stop everything and start working with manufacturing firms to simplify his design for mass production in China or something. Projected ship dates go all to hell. Law of unintended consequences and all that. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/33 "2012-12-12T17:36:42Z")
Wired magazine loves them some Kickstarter. [Here’s some articles](https://www.google.com/search?q=wired+magazine+kickstarter&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#hl=en&client=firefox-a&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&sclient=psy-ab&q=site:wired.com+kickstarter&oq=site:wired.com+kickstarter&gs_l=serp.3...224596.227695.0.227863.16.15.1.0.0.1.136.1221.10j5.15.0.les%3Bekjrth..0.0...1.1.5DxwFjTPh3I&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1354675689,d.dmQ&fp=c74c8aa8ecd19a97&bpcl=39650382&biw=1600&bih=685). FWIW I’ve gotten burned on a Kickstarter before. I pledged some money to get a Harvey Pekar statue put up in a Cleveland library and was supposed to get a record from his collection in exchange. Never happened. But the statue did happen so I did get mostly what I wanted to get. ---
**Author:** ![wheresmymind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/91b2a8/32.png) [@wheresmymind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wheresmymind)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2012, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/34 "2012-12-12T23:00:58Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Wired magazine loves them some Kickstarter. [Here’s some articles](https://www.google.com/search?q=wired+magazine+kickstarter&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#hl=en&client=firefox-a&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&sclient=psy-ab&q=site:wired.com+kickstarter&oq=site:wired.com+kickstarter&gs_l=serp.3...224596.227695.0.227863.16.15.1.0.0.1.136.1221.10j5.15.0.les%3Bekjrth..0.0...1.1.5DxwFjTPh3I&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1354675689,d.dmQ&fp=c74c8aa8ecd19a97&bpcl=39650382&biw=1600&bih=685). Yes they do! The article I mentioned in the OP was one I read on Wired. I think the ultimate Wired article would be about a Kickstarter to fund development of an autonomous drone whose design was crowdsourced and was manufactured with a 3-D printer. And you’d be able to control the drone with an iPhone or something 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![tanstaafl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba8739/32.png) [@tanstaafl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanstaafl)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/35 "2012-12-13T03:06:13Z")
Just thought I would leave this here. When Kickstarters go bad. [Code Hero Kickstarter goes bad](http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/121069-Code-Hero-Kickstarter-Goes-Bad) ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/36 "2012-12-13T08:56:48Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I’ve never had a project not get delivered at all. As for lateness, I figure you have to expect a long wait. The basic model is you’re sending somebody the money to get started on a project - you can’t expect delivery of the final product six weeks later. I don’t think kickstarter projects are any slower than other equivalent projects, but customers notice the long development time more with kickstarter because they were aware of the project from its beginning rather than first hearing about it at a later stage of the process. The backer sets their own deadline, so we’re not discussing speed but rather delay. Of course delays and over-runs happen during construction and software projects as well. > [@ed\_anger](#): > > since we exist in reality, obviously things can go wrong. anyone who doesn’t take this into account is delusional. I agree - and I’m a Kickstarter fan. But this is something which is new, so I recommend people think hard about it before sending cash. Thinking hard is good for you! If you conceive of this as an advance purchase, don’t be surprised if there’s a 3, 6, 12 or indefinite month delay. I’d be very wary of an crowd-funding as an investment -which again Kickstarter does _not_ do-, otherwise known as crowd-muppeting. I expect that a few will lose their shirts and many will invest without applying due diligence. References to SDMB threads: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15753003](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15753003) > **[Kickstarter expects to provide more arts funding than the NEA](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=643284)** > > From here: Does crowdsourced funding represent the future of the arts? If so, is that good or bad? ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/37 "2012-12-23T17:13:39Z")
Does the site make any effort to try to weed out potential scams? Does it make any effort to manage the types of projects in any way? I saw a project that was a film on a topic that would be very appealing to what I imagine are Kickstarter-types. I can imagine topics that are very un-appealing to most but would be very appealing to some people. ---
**Author:** ![Lok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e8c25b/32.png) [@Lok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lok)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2012, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714/38 "2012-12-24T03:42:53Z")
> [@wheresmymind](#): > > So why do people give money for Kickstarter projects? Out of the goodness of their heart? Charity? Do they get a free T-shirt? I have given to various projects on Kickstarter for exactly those reasons. And quite a few others. > [@wheresmymind](#): > > Ok, this makes more sense to me. The producer is essentially getting startup costs _and_ some preliminary sales. Even if he “sells” the product to the kickstarters at cost, he’s still getting a few thousand units out there for people to show to their friends, get word of mouth advertising going, hopefully get a few consumer reviews, etc. The alternative was to produce a product _first_, then _hope_ that you could find people to buy the 5,000 widgets that you just got delivered from China and are sitting in your garage. > > Actually, using it to support the arts makes sense to me, as that’s an area that has been funded by patronage of some kind for pretty much all of history, and is all about giving money to people for products with little _intrinsic_ value. > > But while I can imagine supporting an artist you admire, I had a hard time wrapping my head around supporting some dude who says, “Hey, I’m trying to get this awesome iPhone case I designed produced. If I only had $15,000, I could start production and make shit-tons of money for myself!” Now I see that what I was thinking of as “investors” are really “customers” in many instances. The [Capture Camera Clip System](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/97103764/capture-camera-clip-system) was teh first project I backed. It was almost exactly what you describe in your last paragraph. He asked for $10,000 and got over $360,000. Kickstarter didn’t have a requirement for delivery dates then, although he had set some for himself, which he missed because of the work needed to scale things up. But it was a success (And a good product for photographers, I really like it.) And he just finished his second Kickstarter, [Leash and Cuff](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/97103764/leash-by-peak-design). Which ended on the 14th, and I received mine in the mail yesterday. Knowing he was going to get the funding, he was able to start production early and get out the rewards immediately. (Another nice item BTW. Can’t wait to see what he comes up with next.) Kickstarter had 13 categories (and even more sub-categories) for projects. I have backed something in 12 of them (Haven’t found any fashion projects I really liked.) and spent way too much money of the last year. 21 of the rewards are past due, almost all for good reasons like HD crashes or illness. Several are because of the very success of the project being more than they had planned on. OTOH, I have received 42 rewards, from a simple thanks to some t-shirts, to several graphic novels. > [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > _Caveat backer._ Very important to remember. I have no doubt I will get stiffed completely eventually. Not for too much, since I am careful about who I give large amounts too. But it will happen. > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I think most people first encounter Kickstarter via some other site that’s running a Kickstarter campaign for its own project. For example, I imagine a lot of people first heard about Kickstarter when Rich Burlew set up his Kickstarter campaign and posted about it on the Order of the Stick website. I heard about the OOTS here, but most of the projects I have found have been through Twitter. I have been hearing about a lot of game projects since I started listening to a gaming news podcast, which has resulted in and increase in my backing of games on the site. 🙂 > [@What\_the](#): > > Does the site make any effort to try to weed out potential scams? > > Does it make any effort to manage the types of projects in any way? I saw a project that was a film on a topic that would be very appealing to what I imagine are Kickstarter-types. I can imagine topics that are very un-appealing to most but would be very appealing to some people. They do try to weed out scams. And they have some fairly stringent rules about what can and can’t be put on the site. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kickstarter-as-an-investor-whats-in-it-for-me/643714.md?page=1)