# Killing friends' dreams **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 19, 2022, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480 "2022-10-19T10:42:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2022, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/41 "2022-10-21T04:57:37Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I just go back to the standard speech about how difficult and expensive it is to start a business and succeed… I homebrew my own beer. Had a couple people _just insist_ I go into business and sell this shit (hey, it’s strong stuff, Man!). I tried to explain about the barriers to entry and the insurmountable legal bullshit you have to do being Booze and all… But No! They kept it up, evoking the Spirit of Sam Adams and shit. Follow Your Dreams! (not my dream to brew beer for a living) Sieze The Day! (it’s night I finally said, _“I’ll look into tomorrow!”_, and cracked open another two liters. They forgot about it in the morning. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2022, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/42 "2022-10-21T05:26:21Z")
Some of us were having a discussion about this kind of thing on another board. These are people who do crafts/bake wonderful cakes/write excellent short stories/etc. and people have said things like, “Why don’t you do it for a living?” Among other things, the reason these people haven’t expanded what they do is precisely because they enjoy doing it, and want to keep it a hobby. ---
**Author:** ![Didi44](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@Didi44](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Didi44)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2022, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/43 "2022-10-21T06:40:38Z")
Tell you friend the truth and remind him that there will always be negative responses to whatever he releases to the general public, and if he can’t take your honest criticism, how does he plan to handle the criticism of others? ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2022, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/44 "2022-10-21T12:12:51Z")
Good ideas are a dime a dozen. Turning an idea into _value_ in the marketplace is extremely difficult, especially for lone inventors working out of their basement. The success rate is near zero for these types. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2022, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/45 "2022-10-21T14:57:28Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > These are people who do crafts/bake wonderful cakes/write excellent short stories/etc. and people have said things like, “Why don’t you do it for a living?” Among other things, the reason these people haven’t expanded what they do is precisely because they enjoy doing it, We’ve had threads and threads on just the points you make. The problem with small or start-up business is that it’s 90% the business of business and 10% the making of the product itself. Whereas lots of starry-eyed people who go into these sorts of hobby-becomes-business ventures are much more enamored of the making of the product and are woefully clueless or disinterested in their actual job as an entrepreneur: selling, building an organization, accounting, and regulatory compliance. A home e.g. baker can hire somebody to make & cook dough. They can’t hire somebody to be their Owner / General Manager. Actually, in a way they can. By getting a job as a baker in an established bakery. That’s often a better course of action if they really want to break out of simple hobbying. It’s vastly less likely to cause them to drain their life savings down a rat-hole. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/46 "2022-10-24T13:04:26Z")
**Update** I got the feeling that some here were starting to become “invested” in my friend’s idea, so thought I’d post an update. 1. I told him that his “pay to play” business model was going to be…extremely challenging to turn a profit. He basically shrugged it off, and I decided not to shoot the whole thing down, yet, so left it there. 2. He has showed his idea to a development company. They gave feedback for the sake of feedback (e.g. investors would prefer if the game was not football-themed…think of a different theme) and quoted him $120,000. I told him that’s nuts: at absolute maximum this project would take 2 developers and 1 artist 3 weeks to implement, and that’s being generous…I could probably do the whole shebang myself in a couple weeks. I _was_ quite forceful that he should not spend anywhere near that amount of money. 3. He is considering learning coding himself to do an android / ios prototype. I suggested he focus on delivering that prior to borrowing money… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/47 "2022-10-24T13:10:11Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > quoted him $120,000 I’m guessing that’s basically a “we don’t want the job” quote. > [@Mijin](#): > > He is considering learning coding himself This is good, at worst he should find that interesting in itself, at best he teaches himself a new and marketable skill. ---
**Author:** ![tullsterx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tullsterx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tullsterx)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/48 "2022-10-24T13:15:19Z")
There are many things that I think suck, that are extremely popular. I think that’s true of most folks. That said, I think you should tell him your concerns and criticism in a casual way. If you can’t tell him what you think then you’re not much help. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/49 "2022-10-24T13:18:52Z")
I have told him what I think. It’s just that I’ve been polite so far. It’s on him if he’s not listening to my feedback because I am not grabbing him by the ears and shouting in his face that it’s a bad idea. But yeah, while we aren’t super close friends, I am not going to let him spend $120k…I will get to the rudeness stage before that happens. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/50 "2022-10-24T13:26:58Z")
The story of your troubles in talking to your friend about the hopeless of his game ever becoming financially viable sounds like the plot of a great movie. You should write it up as a screenplay and sell it to some movie company. I should get a cut of the profits of the film for making this suggestion. In fact, I should get a few million dollars right now for this suggestion. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/51 "2022-10-24T13:30:04Z")
I think it would make for a better musical. I think that’s a substantively different idea that I don’t owe you royalties 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/52 "2022-10-24T13:38:13Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > I agree, it sounds like a pretty boring game. > > A few ideas to improve it: > > Maybe add a few more men. Make it 5-a-side. > > Make players roll dice to determine the outcome of passes, tackles, etc. > > Give each man individual stats that give a bonus to dice rolls. One may have a good bonus to pass, but weak on tackle, while another man is the reverse. > > When rolling for tackle, if both players roll a six, it’s a foul. Award a penalty kick to the defender. Maybe you can make the pieces based on fantasy creatures and give them all special abilities that they can use to fight over the ball. Call it “Gutsball”. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/53 "2022-10-24T13:50:35Z")
So that Babale doesn’t have to explain his (excellent) joke to the uninitiated, this is a reference to the existing board and video game called “Blood Bowl”, which is indeed quite similar to the game posited by Peter Morris. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/54 "2022-10-24T13:58:30Z")
Ah. Glad you wrote that. I was about to say that that was taking the idea and making perhaps something somewhat interesting out of it. Here’s a 3-minute summary of the game and its rules: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/z4sAVZ3EZ4U/maxresdefault.jpg "Blood Bowl in about 3 minutes") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4sAVZ3EZ4U) Way more fleshed out. Way more interesting. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2022, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/55 "2022-10-24T16:18:33Z")
> [@Dead\_Cat](#): > > I’m guessing that’s basically a “we don’t want the job” quote. AKA fuck-off pricing. ---
**Author:** ![Schnitte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/schnitte/32/9033_2.png) [@Schnitte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schnitte)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2022, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/56 "2022-10-26T07:31:41Z")
If I may pitch in a few thoughts from the perspective of tabletop game development. I used to be a little into such games myself; Germany is one of the world’s leading markets for this. Every year, publishing houses release dozens of new titles that compete for attention, there are prizes awarded to the best new games, etc. It’s a highly competitive industry, somewhat comparable to novels; somes games sell well but still don’t make the designer rich - most of them do it alongside a normal job. Only very, very rarely will there be a blockbuster hit such as _Settlers of Catan_ that established an entire franchise and made its designer, Klaus Teuber, a veritable fortune. The game described by the OP sounds quite simplistic; it will be hard for it to get even a modest amount of attention on the market. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2022, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/57 "2022-10-26T13:37:12Z")
> [@Schnitte](#): > > It’s a highly competitive industry, somewhat comparable to novels; somes games sell well but still don’t make the designer rich - most of them do it alongside a normal job. I had a friend that was really into making board games. He really put a lot of work into them, writing rules, making the boards, even making pieces out of clay. Some of them were actually quite fun to play. But he spent more time trying to sell them to a distribution company than he actually spent making and designing them. Only one did they ever express any interest in, and what they were offering was pretty pathetic, like a couple hundred dollars, not as an advance, but to buy the IP for the game entirely. So, even if it _is_ a good idea, and the OP’s friend puts in the work to develop it, it’s still very unlikely to be a “million dollar idea”. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2023, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/58 "2023-02-16T15:23:17Z")
**Update 2** I’m only updating this thread to point out a potential scam. So, my friend is paying an app developer $6000 for a prototype. I’ve given up trying to tell him his idea sucks, so I think he’s going to just have to take his licks, and hopefully this will be the end of it. Anyway, the scam is, apparently one company he pitched to, told him he had a fantastic idea, and they wanted to become business partners. However, they also said that to launch their joint business, would take at least $400,000, and he’d have to stump up half. Fortunately he wasn’t _that_ stupid to take it up (it helps that he doesn’t have that kind of money anyway). But it’s a kind of scam that I haven’t heard of before. Or were they just making fun of him? Anyway, it’s something I’ll bear in mind if there’s a day where I try to publish an app idea. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2023, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/59 "2023-02-16T21:02:46Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Anyway, the scam is, apparently one company he pitched to, told him he had a fantastic idea, and they wanted to become business partners. However, they also said that to launch their joint business, would take at least $400,000, and he’d have to stump up half. Stupid ideas aren’t always scams. Your friend has an idea, if the other guy has 200 grand to invest then who is scamming who? OTOH, 6 grand for an app is quite reasonable if the lion’s share is not due until the product is finished, and not an exorbitant amount to learn a lesson. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2023, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480/60 "2023-02-16T21:18:15Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > if the other guy has 200 grand to invest then who is scamming who Clearly, there is no other 200 grand. They just take the money from the idea guy and run. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/killing-friends-dreams/973480.md?page=4)