# Kings of Leon respond to Glee Creator with "Homophobic Rant"... Really? Really? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 28, 2011, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269 "2011-01-28T03:28:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/41 "2011-01-29T17:22:31Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > This is all assuming that Kings of Leon a) know who Ryan Murphy even is and b) know he’s gay. Followill was addressing Ryan Murphy by name in response to Murphy’s specific comments, so he obviously knows that such a person exists. Whether Followill knew Murphy was gay isn’t really the point, as it’s certainly possible to use a sexist or homophobic insult against a man who _isn’t_ gay. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/42 "2011-01-29T17:28:45Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > Followill was addressing Ryan Murphy by name in response to Murphy’s specific comments, so he obviously knows that such a person exists. Whether Followill knew Murphy was gay isn’t really the point, as it’s certainly possible to use a sexist or homophobic insult against a man who _isn’t_ gay. He knows that Murphy exists and made the comments, but does he know who Murphy is? Does he know Murphy is the creator of Glee? Does he know Murphy is gay? Does he know Murphy has a history of this whiny behavior? All of these things matter to determine where the comment came from. It’s very easy to fit this comment into a context of “guy busting on another guy that he thinks is an asshole” instead of “homophobic rant.” ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/43 "2011-01-29T17:55:38Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > He knows that Murphy exists and made the comments, but does he know who Murphy is? Does he know Murphy is the creator of Glee? I don’t see how he could possibly know about the specific comments Murphy made without realizing that Murphy is somehow involved in the production of the show. > [@](#): > > Does he know Murphy is gay? Does he know Murphy has a history of this whiny behavior? All of these things matter to determine where the comment came from. > > It’s very easy to fit this comment into a context of “guy busting on another guy that he thinks is an asshole” instead of “homophobic rant.” Gosh, you think? > [@Lamia](#): > > That said, while **I think it’s an exaggeration to call Nathan Followill’s comments a “homophobic rant”** , the bra reference is an attempt to insult Murphy by suggesting he’s effeminate. This may indicate a certain lack of respect for women or gay men. To be fair though, **it’s a pretty mild response to “fuck you…self-centered assholes”. Unless Followill has a history of making sexist/homophobic remarks then I’d give him the benefit of the doubt here.** (Emphasis added.) ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/44 "2011-01-29T19:05:45Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > But is it a rant? Is it possible for a tweet to be a rant? Aren’t they too short for that? Maybe a snit fit would fit. ---
**Author:** ![turner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@turner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/turner)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/45 "2011-01-29T19:11:01Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > :rolleyes: Take your issues to the Pit, kumquat. > > 😛 I think he just called you a fruit. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2011, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/46 "2011-01-29T22:31:02Z")
> [@beartato](#): > > One of the only genres right now that attempts to distance itself from pop is rock; What a silly thing to attempt. > [@beartato](#): > > it’s still commercial, it’s still mainstream, of course it’s still all those things. But it tries to make itself the alternative choice, and that would not seem to involve appearing on Glee. The artists you mentioned in your first response to my post either don’t need to care what the average Glee watcher thinks, Neither should the Kings of Leon. If they need to cultivate an image that keeps them off of Glee, well, that’s pretty lame. But this… > [@beartato](#): > > But the reason mentioned, that it was the end of a record promoting cycle and the overexposure wasn’t desirable, seems pretty spot-on. …isn’t. This is a valid reason. Still, regardless of the reason, lame or not, they do have the right to say “no”. > [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > This is all assuming that Kings of Leon a) know who Ryan Murphy even is and b) know he’s gay. I’m sure they know. Not that Ryan Murphy wasn’t acting like a complete tool here. Nathan’s response was kind of tool-ish, Caleb’s was entirely reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![beartato](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9d8465/32.png) [@beartato](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beartato)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2011, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/47 "2011-01-30T11:38:21Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > What a silly thing to attempt. You may find it silly, but for a certain type of artist, it’s necessary to the image. The motorcycle-jacket wearing, cigarette smoking older brother to pop’s pigtails and knee socks. As a style of pop makes its way to the mainstream, a rock alternative will emerge, whether it’s punk or grunge or any of the recent bad-high-school-poetry-with-loud-guitars styles of late. A band that the loners, the outcasts, and the kids that don’t fit in can identify with and call their own, a band that appears to stick it to The Man (while cashing paycheques from Him). These rock bands may be signed to the same labels as the pop tarts, may play at the same venues, may even share a stylist. But playing the role of the “alternative” is crucial to their ticket and song sales. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2011, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/48 "2011-01-30T13:45:05Z")
Does using gay stereotypes to insult someone who picked a fight with you make you a homophobe? Maybe he’s just not afraid to be politically incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/49 "2011-01-31T03:26:35Z")
> [@beartato](#): > > You may find it silly, but for a certain type of artist, it’s necessary to the image. The motorcycle-jacket wearing, cigarette smoking older brother to pop’s pigtails and knee socks. As a style of pop makes its way to the mainstream, a rock alternative will emerge, whether it’s punk or grunge or any of the recent bad-high-school-poetry-with-loud-guitars styles of late. A band that the loners, the outcasts, and the kids that don’t fit in can identify with and call their own, a band that appears to stick it to The Man (while cashing paycheques from Him). These rock bands may be signed to the same labels as the pop tarts, may play at the same venues, may even share a stylist. But playing the role of the “alternative” is crucial to their ticket and song sales. Yeah, I know. But bands should not worry so much about the “role” of alternative (or whatever) and just be alternative (or whatever). ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/50 "2011-01-31T03:42:15Z")
I don’t watch Glee, but I look forward to hearing about the very special _ **Kings of Glee-on** _ episode coming right up… ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/51 "2011-01-31T05:46:59Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > Yeah, I know. But bands should not worry so much about the “role” of alternative (or whatever) and just be alternative (or whatever). I imagine that would involve saying “no” to Glee. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/52 "2011-01-31T10:29:07Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > Not that Ryan Murphy wasn’t acting like a complete tool here. Nathan’s response was kind of tool-ish, Caleb’s was entirely reasonable. That’s what I took away from this. > [@What\_the](#): > > Does using gay stereotypes to insult someone who picked a fight with you make you a homophobe? > > Maybe he’s just not afraid to be politically incorrect. Well, you can always insert a popular minority. Would it be okay to use black stereotypes against a black person? I know many people here do not think so. ---
**Author:** ![Hippy\_Hollow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hippy_hollow/32/4841_2.png) [@Hippy\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hippy_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269/53 "2011-01-31T14:37:47Z")
Ryan Murphy, whom I did not know of until opening this thread, is coming across as a major douchebag. Seems to me that Glee is recycling the idea of High School Musical… it ain’t my cup of tea, and as far as I’m concerned, it can leave the airwaves yesterday. He seems to think that popularity equals greatness. Well, I can’t be sure if the show is great or not, but KOL have every right to say no to Murphy for really any reason. It’s their music. I’m sure there are a number of other artists who will let their music be used in Glee. Now Followill’s response, is slightly sexist. Because it is introducing the trope that there’s something weak about being female. Now on the sexist outrage chart it’s like a 2 out of 10. Hardly worth getting het up over, but certainly worth an “educational moment.” But as others have stated, Murphy is hardly a known quantity in pop culture. If Followill doesn’t watch and know about the show, how would he even know he’s gay? I think he was going for the “don’t be a wuss/pussy” angle and it came out badly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kings-of-leon-respond-to-glee-creator-with-homophobic-rant-really-really/569269.md?page=2)