# Kirkland1244, you don't seem to be getting it **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 8, 2002, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437 "2002-04-08T05:16:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2002, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/101 "2002-04-08T23:37:42Z")
> [@](#): > > I am not a female. I like females. But I am not one of them. And I do not like being referred to by feminine pronouns. I consider it gay-bashing You really are a dumb shit–I’M gay, you twit! I’m so gay that 3 dollar bills say, “Damn, he’s gay!” I’ve been gaybashed–attacked by three punks as I came out of a bar in Phoenix. Trust me, you stupid beyatch, being called “she” is NOT the same thing as getting a chain upside one’s head. If you weren’t so unbelievably “not-bright”, you have noticed that every poster in this thread–gay and straight-- thinks you’re giving horse’s asses a bad name. You’re so stupid, George W. Bush calls you a dummy. You’re so dense, your head has an event horizon. You’re so addlepated that you make a box of rocks look like Stephen fuckin’ Hawking. To quote The Master, “if ignorance was cornflakes, you’d be General Mills.” Now shut the fuck up, and sit the fuck down. Your opinions have no merit, your posts smell like yesterday’s sewage, and I ain’t even started on you yet. Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time. ---
**Author:** ![Ferrous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Ferrous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferrous)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2002, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/102 "2002-04-08T23:44:28Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Esprix \* > \*\* Get over yourself and your misplaced righteous indignation, girlfriend - we have._\* Heh heh. So, **Kirkland** , are you beginning to think that maybe it wasn’t such a great idea to let everyone know how easy it is to push your buttons just by calling you female names? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2002, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/103 "2002-04-08T23:51:59Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Kirkland1244 \* \*\* I have a problem with Baptists because the Southern Baptist Convention is a bigotted hate cult that is organized to oppose equal rights for gays. Their screwed up, pseudo-Christian theology (when compared to the real historic Churches), has nothing to do with my opinion of them as a people. \*\* Screwed up how? Not vague “They’re icky people” but specifics: Exactly what doctrines do Baptists subscribe to /not subscribe to that “true” Christians do or don’t? \*\* > [@](#): > > Baptist baptism is not the same as Christian (Catholic, Anglican, Orthodox… etc) baptism, because it is not considered regenerative… \*\* Define regenerative in this context please: You mean they have to keep getting Baptized over and over? \*\* > [@](#): > > In a Baptist baptism all that happens is that you get wet. Historical Christians believe that the act of Baptism washes away all sins the person being baptized has committed in their lifetime. > \*\* Can Dave or any other Baptist confirm this? If it’s true (that you don’t believe that Baptism washes away sins, what’s your point in doing it?) My understanding was that Baptists believed exactly what you said, with the understanding that it’s not “magic water” that does it, it’s Christ and while the water’s nice, it’s optional compared to Christ. Fenris PS: Hey, **Gobear** : “Don’t you know? General Mills doesn’t _make_ cornflakes: Kelloggs does!” 😉 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/104 "2002-04-09T00:02:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > **You really are a dumb shit–I’M gay, you twit!** Yes. I know. But I don’t care. I consider being referred to with feminine pronouns an insult. I am not feminine in any way. Maybe you are. Maybe you don’t mind it. I do, and I’m repeating my request that you stop. Please. > [@](#): > > I’m so gay that 3 dollar bills say, “Damn, he’s gay!” I’ve been gaybashed–attacked by three punks as I came out of a bar in Phoenix. Trust me, you stupid beyatch, being called “she” is NOT the same thing as getting a chain upside one’s head. Of course not. I’m glad you survived. > [@](#): > > If you weren’t so unbelievably “not-bright”, you have noticed that every poster in this thread–gay and straight-- thinks you’re giving horse’s asses a bad name. Gee, people posting in a thread that’s designed to attack me don’t like me. What a shock. And I’ll admit I’ve been a bit fogged recently. It honestly wasn’t until today that I noticed I was showing all the symptoms of a depression relapse (I haven’t slept well in three weeks, I’ve lost all interest in my column, and now I’m having mood swings, as evidenced by my erratic posting here). \*\* > [@](#): > > Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time. \*\* You didn’t do the accent right. Kirk ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/105 "2002-04-09T00:03:36Z")
**Kirkland** , you ignorant slut. Unless you’ve interviewed every single solitary Baptist in the world, your claim is nothing more than sound and fury…signifying nothing…or something like that. You, you …um, woman! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/106 "2002-04-09T00:03:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ferrous \* > \*\* > Heh heh. So, **Kirkland** , are you beginning to think that maybe it wasn’t such a great idea to let everyone know how easy it is to push your buttons just by calling you female names? \*\* You’re right. I shouldn’t have assumed that anyone around here had a shred of decency within them. ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/107 "2002-04-09T00:07:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\ ***Kirkland** , you ignorant slut. \*\* What, you filthy whore? \*\* > [@](#): > > Unless you’ve interviewed every single solitary Baptist in the world, your claim is nothing more than sound and fury…signifying nothing…or something like that.\*\* What are you talking about? If you’re talking about their screwed-up understanding of baptism, then you need only go read the doctrinal statements on their websites. If something else, why don’t you stipulate exactly what you’re talking about or… here’s an idea, quote to provide context. \*\* > [@](#): > > You, you …um, woman!\*\* Go to hell. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/108 "2002-04-09T00:32:31Z")
quote] Yes. I know. But I don’t care. I consider being referred to with feminine pronouns an insult. I am not feminine in any way. Maybe you are. Maybe you don’t mind it. I do, and I’m repeating my request that you stop. Please. [/quote] Actually, I’m a regular masculine guy, as Dopers who’ve met me can testify. But if I were fem, it wouldn’t matter because I have an extraordinarily large…ego. > [@](#): > > It honestly wasn’t until today that I noticed I was showing all the symptoms of a depression relapse (I haven’t slept well in three weeks, I’ve lost all interest in my column, and now I’m having mood swings, as evidenced by my erratic posting here). Ah, now have the Scarlett O’Hara “Ah declayuh Ah have the vapuhs something terrible today” defense in which the poster blames his incoherent, hate-filled rantings on organic troubles So That He Isn’t To Blame For Posting Like A Jackass, Really, It’s Not His Fault, It’s That Pesky Low Blood Sugar. In addition your repeated protestations that “I’m not a woman, I’m not, stop CALLING me that!” are just egging on the crowd. You’re begging people to step on your Achilles heel by acting so, well, hysterically (and a moment’s study of that word’s etymology will no doubt prove rewarding–hee hee). If I were you, I’d feign nonchalance on the subject. Oh, and **Guin** was making a reference to an old SNL bit, so you may wish to apologize to her. In fine, if you wish not to be called a girl, stop acting like a pussy. ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/109 "2002-04-09T00:49:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > **Actually, I’m a regular masculine guy, as Dopers who’ve met me can testify. But if I were fem, it wouldn’t matter because I have an extraordinarily large…ego.** Congrats. Like I care. \*\* > [@](#): > > Ah, now have the Scarlett O’Hara “Ah declayuh Ah have the vapuhs something terrible today” defense in which the poster blames his incoherent, hate-filled rantings on organic troubles So That He Isn’t To Blame For Posting Like A Jackass, Really, It’s Not His Fault, It’s That Pesky Low Blood Sugar.\*\* Not a defense. A statement. Don’t operate under the false assumption that I care what you think about me. I don’t. I feel no need to justify myself or my reasoning to you. I post here solely because it amuses me to do so, and I find you rather amusing, in fact. You seek to be intentionally hurtful to me, but in truth you draw more laughter than you do blood. \*\* > [@](#): > > Oh, and **Guin** was making a reference to an old SNL bit, so you may wish to apologize to her.\*\* I recognized the reference. Kirk ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/110 "2002-04-09T00:55:30Z")
> [@](#): > > I feel no need to justify myself or my reasoning to you. I post here solely because it amuses me to do so, and I find you rather amusing, in fact. You seek to be intentionally hurtful to me, but in truth you draw more laughter than you do blood. Israelis and Baptists and women, oh my! Hee, hee. Okey dokey, Dorothy, glad you’re so cool and Above It All now. (meltdown clock continues to tick) ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/111 "2002-04-09T01:02:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > **Israelis and Baptists and women, oh my! Hee, hee.** You might want to replace “women” with Palestinians. I have no love for them. I can understand their actions, but they’ve gone too far. \*\* > [@](#): > > Okey dokey, Dorothy, glad you’re so cool and Above It All now.\*\* Above it All? Judy Garland reference? I don’t catch it. Kirk ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/112 "2002-04-09T01:22:55Z")
> [@](#): > > _Kirkland originally posted:_ > > Don’t operate under the false assumption that I care what you think about me. I don’t. I feel no need to justify myself or my reasoning to you. I post here solely because it amuses me to do so, and I find you rather amusing, in fact. You seek to be intentionally hurtful to me, but in truth you draw more laughter than you do blood. Oh _nooooo_, you don’t care. Ha! It’s all a lark! That’s why you almost spontaniously combust when anyone refers to you as a female! But - oh yeah! - you _really_ don’t care! And don’t think for a minute that we are buying that you don’t care - you didn’t bother to give us your story about depression and woe until now, and there’s a _reason_ for that. Many of us are older and tougher than you, we know the drill _all_ too well. Even the ones who are not older are still far wiser. You are fooling no one. I think you are getting a huge charge out of this. I think you are being a drama queen. I think it’s sad, that you are making yourself such an easy target deliberately. I think the best thing we all could do is to let this thread die. You’re obviously feeding off all the negative attention. Are you really proud of that fact? And yeah, the meltdown clock continues to tick. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/113 "2002-04-09T01:24:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kirkland1244 \* > > \*\* > > Above it All? Judy Garland reference? I don’t catch it. > > Kirk \*\* Actually, If I’m not mistaken, he’s referring to your manic moodswings. 4 hours ago, you were frothing at the mouth spewing hate and evil and shit, now you’re playing all calm, cool and collected. Sam ---
**Author:** ![DAVEW0071](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e19b73/32.png) [@DAVEW0071](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DAVEW0071)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/114 "2002-04-09T01:24:31Z")
To try to answer **Fenris’s** question: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kirkland1244 \* > **Baptist baptism is not the same as Christian (Catholic, Anglican, Orthodox… etc) baptism, because it is not considered regenerative** I don’t know what **Kirk** means by “regenerative.” Is baptism supposed to regenerate the spirit of the person being baptized? Not as far as I understand it. The immersion in or sprinkling of water is symbolic only. Jesus was also baptized, but we are told he was sinless, with no need to regenerate his spirit. > [@](#): > > \*\* In a Baptist baptism all that happens is that you get wet. \*\* True. It is significant only in the fact that it is the outward display of an inward decision. > [@](#): > > \*\*Historical Christians believe that the act of Baptism washes away all sins the person being baptized has committed in their lifetime. > > Kirk \*\* I don’t believe so. Again, why would Jesus have need of baptism for washing away sins? Also, I don’t know of any Scripture which says that the Spirit is conveyed to Christians through water, as I believe **Kirk** stated earlier. In fact, in Acts 1:5, Jesus tells his disciples “…John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” Thus, had any of them been baptized, either by John or anyone else, would they not already have the Holy Spirit? Also, on the day of Pentecost, the Spirit descended upon the Apostles in tongues of flame, not water. In any case, New Testament Scripture makes it clear that salvation is the gift of God, not achieved through baptism or any other works. That is and has always been a basic tenet of Christianity. > [@](#): > > _Fenris:_ > \*\*If it’s true (that you don’t believe that Baptism washes away sins, what’s your point in doing it?) My understanding was that Baptists believed exactly what you said, with the understanding that it’s not “magic water” that does it, it’s Christ and while the water’s nice, it’s optional compared to Christ. \*\* The point in doing it is, as I said before, an outward and public declaration of faith. Baptism by immersion is also symbolic of death (being lowered into the water), burial (being under the water) and resurrection (rising from the water). Thus, a baptism is a Christian’s way of 1) identifying with Christ’s death, burial and resurrection and 2) symbolically “dying” to the old, sinful life, “burying” it, and “rising” to a new (or reformed) life here on earth. It has great symbolic significance, and it is not to be entered into lightly. Having been baptised as well as witnessing many baptisms, I can also attest that it is a beautiful and emotionally fulfilling act to participate in. But it does not accomplish anything that had not already been done through the miracle of faith. ---
**Author:** ![Denis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5e9695/32.png) [@Denis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Denis)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/115 "2002-04-09T01:29:00Z")
Holy shit, fella! Don’t you realize that when you slag on any group around here you’re going to be locked in a cage and poked with sharp sticks? Seems like the only group around here safe to slam is the French. Damn! My heritage is mostly French! Oh well, the only things “French” about me are my real life name and my love of good food, wine, and fucking. Get a thicker skin, guy! Most people around here don’t like bigoted statements either. You’ve made a few, yourself. I have to laugh when I see you posting that, “Baptists aren’t Christians.” Oh man. I grew up Catholic in West (by God) Virginia. Part of the Bible Belt. The times the local fundie lunatic fringe pamphleted my hometown with “Catholics aren’t Christians” hate screeds are still quite sharp in my memory. But they were the _fringe_. Most fundies I knew, were fine, decent people. Just because the Southern Baptists contribute to the Focus on the Family and all that garbage doesn’t make every member a bigot. Most Baptists I know really don’t care about the social policies of their church. They are there for personal spiritual reasons. I liken it to my own disagreements with many of America’s policies. I may even hate some of those policies, but I’m not leaving, because I think the US is the best game in town, overall. Bigotry against gays I hate. I think it’s stupid and cruel. Problem is, when those who are oppressed get strident, people tune them out. Maybe it’s not right, but that’s the way it is. If you try to reason with someone about any differences, if they are reasonable people, you will find common ground and usually get some kind of good results. Stand on your priciples in an inflexible, self-righteous, and strident manner, and you’ll get hosed. No matter how “right” you are. I’m speaking from experience here. Tilting at windmills can be funny as hell to watch, but doing it will get you nowhere. I hope I don’t come off as condescending to you. I just see a lot of me in your passion against bullshit. Resist the temptation (this is coming from an atheist :D) to paint everything in black and white, good/evil, decent person/bigoted scum. It will help you deal with things so much more effectively, and you’ll be happier for it. I know I am. ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/116 "2002-04-09T01:31:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DAVEW0071 \* > \*\*To try to answer **Fenris’s** question:I don’t know what **Kirk** means by “regenerative.” Is baptism supposed to regenerate the spirit of the person being baptized? Not as far as I understand it. The immersion in or sprinkling of water is symbolic only. \*\* That is the Baptist position. It is not the historical Christian position. Take a look at the Catholic and Orthodox churches to see how baptism has been viewed by Christians for the last 2000 years. \*\* > [@](#): > > Jesus was also baptized, but we are told he was sinless, with no need to regenerate his spirit.\*\* There’s a difference between John’s baptism and baptism in the name of the Trinity. \*\* > [@](#): > > That is and has always been a basic tenet of Christianity.\*\* BZZZT. Sola fide is a tenet of Protestantism, not Christianity. The vast majority of the world’s Christians do not believe in Sola fide (faith alone). Kirk ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/117 "2002-04-09T01:33:44Z")
You’re probably right, PT. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/118 "2002-04-09T01:34:30Z")
\*\*\*Burning bridges one by one What I’m doin’ can’t be undone And I’m always hoping someday I’m gonna stop this runnin’ around But every time the chance comes up Another bridge goes down \*\*\* _sits down and admires the glow…_ jayjay ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/119 "2002-04-09T01:37:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GaWd \* > \*\*Actually, If I’m not mistaken, he’s referring to your manic moodswings. 4 hours ago, you were frothing at the mouth spewing hate and evil and shit, now you’re playing all calm, cool and collected. \*\* Yeah. I get that, then. Whatever. Kirk ---
**Author:** ![red\_dragon60](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@red\_dragon60](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/red_dragon60)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437/120 "2002-04-09T01:40:30Z")
The Nazis gained control of Germany in 1933. The Nazis invaded Poland with a “Blitzkrieg” tactic, meaning “lightining war”, in 1939. The Nazis invaded France and Belgium in 1940. The Nazis set up a secret police, called the Gestapo, to ferret out spies and resistance. The Nazis killed over 11 million people in a period called the Holocaust. These groups included Poles, Jews, and Homosexuals, among others. The Nazis finally surrendered in May of 1945. The Nazis were portrayed as bumbling fools in the TV show “Hogan’s Heroes”, in which the Nazis never found out about the radio in the coffeepot or the tunnel. In any of these situations, can you replace the word “Nazis” with the word “Jews” and still be truthful? Can’t? THEN STOP FUCKING COMPARING THEM. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kirkland1244-you-dont-seem-to-be-getting-it/102437.md?page=7)