# Kitchen remodeling: give us your words of wisdom **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 27, 2023, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862 "2023-01-27T01:11:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/61 "2023-01-31T16:48:39Z")
> [@carrps](#): > > I also recommend taking cabinets to the ceiling. I think it looks bad with that couple of inches where there’s that gap. Besides the issue of dust collecting. Not just dust, but grease. Grease + dust + top-of-cabinet-height = gunk that is very difficult to remove, because it tends to build up for years before you suddenly realize you’ve never cleaned up there. Also, the tops of cabinet boxes aren’t usually finished, so all that gunk is really stuck in the wood grain. ---
**Author:** ![racer72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/racer72/32/3075_2.png) [@racer72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racer72)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/62 "2023-01-31T16:54:35Z")
Based on watching a lot of the home improvement shows on TV, with a 100 year old house plan on adding about 50% to your base budget to fix things you didn’t plan for. Ben Napier from Home Town says to take the age of the house, divide that by 2 and add that percentage to your initial budget. He said the worst part is finding things from a 50 year old remodel that won’t meet current codes. In a show a few months ago, a simple kitchen remodel found the foundation of the house was defective, a $30,000 kitchen redo ended up costing $85,000. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/63 "2023-01-31T17:18:40Z")
I’m doing work on a 60 year old house, and we certainly have issues. For instance, the plumber is replacing the old basement sink. The drain was mostly corroded through, which was not unexpected. But it turned out the vent (I’m not sure what vents do for plumbing, but it’s apparently important) had totally disconnected, and he needed to open up the wall to get at it. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/64 "2023-01-31T23:22:04Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > The one lesson that was successful for us was to plan plan plan and get everything (appliances, tiles, flooring, countertops, cabinet measurements, etc) ordered and scheduled properly in advance. That meant the actual work in the room, from demolition to finish, was 8 days. We had heard stories of people taking months to complete, there is no reason for that. Sure, it meant that the electrician and plumber were bumping into each other, and the cabinet cabinet guy was crawling over the flooring guy, but it worked and it was a beautiful thing. Oh, for sure! My whole professional life, although in a completely unrelated field, revolves around making sure all the various pieces that are needed for the final project are available by the time the actual prep happens, so I am quite used to doing that. And we definitely want to minimize the amount of time the kitchen is completely out of commission. The other thing I will need to figure out is work. I am 100% remote these days and don’t even have an office anymore, and I would like to keep it that way. However, all the living area in our house is on one floor, and I need a decent-sized external monitor as well as a laptop in order to work reasonably efficiently. My desk is in the bedroom next to the kitchen that we use as an office/den, so I am going to have to figure out an alternative location. The basement is unheated, so maybe if it’s warm enough down there by the time demo starts? Other than that, I am going to need a relatively quiet spot. Maybe I can run cables through the window to the (covered) front porch? ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/65 "2023-02-01T12:52:25Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Not just dust, but grease. Grease + dust + top-of-cabinet-height = gunk that is very difficult to remove, because it tends to build up for years before you suddenly realize you’ve never cleaned up there. Also, the tops of cabinet boxes aren’t usually finished, so all that gunk is really stuck in the wood grain. Oh yeah. It’s nearly impossible to deal with. And usually ends of being ‘Out of sight, out of mind’. I wonder if before the installation it would be a good idea to paint the tops of the cabinets? It’s certainly an extra chore, but might be worth it? I donno. Anybody try this? I would think some high gloss lacquer or oil paint. A reputable paint store should be able to make a recommendation. Wow we are spending other peoples money and time left and right. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/66 "2023-02-01T14:38:19Z")
FYI–plumbing vents are indeed important–not only do they provide an easy route for sewer gases to escape, they allow air in to avoid siphoning out the trap in fixtures which would then admit gases… ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/67 "2023-02-01T18:15:56Z")
Yeah, I got the plumber to explain it to me. Also, now that he’s fixed the drain pipe from the washer, the drain pipe from the nearby bathroom is working, too. I suspect they were both affected by that missing vent. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/68 "2023-02-01T18:46:21Z")
Just another thought. In my last house, I put together a woodworking shop. I have a fair number of power tools, and it wouldn’t be unusual to have two fairly high current (amperage) tools running at the same time – say: a power tool _and_ a dust collector. What I had done is something that – if it seems relevant to you – you could do in your kitchen: I put in a few quadplex electrical outlets: [![](https://inspectapedia.com/electric/Electrical_Receptacle_0322_DJFcs.jpg) ](https://inspectapedia.com/electric/Electrical_Receptacle_0322_DJFcs.jpg) But the thing that was unique about how I had them wired is that the left two receptacles were on one circuit and the right two receptacles were on another circuit. This basically meant that the left two could handle a 15 amp load _and_ the right two could handle an _additional_ 15 amp load. Simultaneously. If you’re going to run a coffee maker _and_ a toaster oven … or something like that … on a rather regular basis … it’s kind of a nice thing. Good luck! ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/69 "2023-02-01T19:19:09Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > If you’re going to run a coffee maker _and_ a toaster oven … or something like that … on a rather regular basis … it’s kind of a nice thing. When we remodeled our kitchen, I ran circuit one on two walls, and circuit two on the other two walls. The countertops are on opposite walls, so the toaster oven lives on one countertop, and the coffee maker lives on the other countertop. I used 12 gauge wire and put in 20 amp circuit breakers. I don’t believe we’ve ever tripped a breaker. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/70 "2023-02-01T19:30:31Z")
There are so many small appliances someone might have that two circuits might not be enough. How much power does one of those big Kitchenaid stand mixers draw, for instance? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/71 "2023-02-01T19:33:17Z")
Speaking of mixers, we installed one of these. If you have room, it’s a great option to keep your counter tops clear. [Hardware Resources Soft-close Mixer/Appliance Lift, Chrome ML-1CH | Keats & Castle (keatscastle.com)](https://www.keatscastle.com/p/hardware-resources-kitchen-organizers-HRML1CH-p16762?msclkid=c66e0440a3aa1cbe503d679a1de07e91&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Shop%20-%20S01%20-%20Main%20-%20Generic&utm_term=4575755093437015&utm_content=All%20Products) ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/72 "2023-02-01T19:44:55Z")
Plan your appliance purchases around July or November. That’s when they have their best sales at Home Depot (not sure about Lowes). Think “Black Friday all November” and a similar thing for July. When the appliances arrive, check them over thoroughly! You may wish to plan things so that the appliances are delivered only when needed. We ordered ours in November, at a great price, but when the kitchen was finally done in late December and the refrigerator was put in place, we found that the doors were misaligned and nothing we did could fix this. It was all covered by warranty, and they sent out a technician who ended up replacing a few door parts. Nevertheless, the salesman explained that had I found the problem the next day he could have simply had them deliver a new one–one month later he didn’t have that option. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/73 "2023-02-01T19:49:00Z")
> [@minor7flat5](#): > > You may wish to plan things so that the appliances are delivered only when needed. Not sure how things are now, but a couple of years ago there were _huge_ delays on appliances. We ordered ours months before we thought we would need them. I was constantly telling my contractor to order everything early, so we wouldn’t have down time due to delays in delivery. (they don’t seem to get this concept.) ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/74 "2023-02-01T19:49:41Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > How much power does one of those big Kitchenaid stand mixers draw, for instance? According to the [KitchenAid](https://www.kitchenaid.com/countertop-appliances/commercial-products/commercial-stand-mixers/p.nsf-certified-commercial-series-8-quart-bowl-lift-stand-mixer-with-stainless-steel-bowl-guard.ksmc895wh.html?) site, 500 watts. That’s the largest mixer listed on the site. But that’s less than a coffee maker, which draws 750 watts. And our stand mixer is on the same circuit as the coffee maker. I should add that when we remodeled, I ran a dedicated circuit for the microwave, and another dedicated circuit for the fridge. That may be required by code. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/75 "2023-02-01T19:50:13Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > How much power does one of those big Kitchenaid stand mixers draw, for instance? About 5-1/4 amps (575 watts), tops. More info: > **[Power Consumption of Typical Household Appliances](https://www.daftlogic.com/information-appliance-power-consumption.htm)** > > List of the Power Consumption of Typical Household Appliances > [@Railer13](#): > > When we remodeled our kitchen, I ran circuit one on two walls, and circuit two on the other two walls. Y’see: _that’s_ what _I’m_ talkin’ about (hand up for a virtual high-five)! ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/76 "2023-02-01T22:58:15Z")
When we did our big kitchen remodel. The guys delivering the cabinets said they where lost and could not deliver. My Wife drove out to find them. The fact was that they where afraid to drive their truck over the pass. It’s a state highway. Semis do it all the time. 50 a day at least. And there was no way in the world they could turn around. My Wife convinced them to follow her to the top of the pass. There is a big area there that even these guys could turn the truck around. I, in the mean time was hooking up my trailer so that I could meet these guys on the top of the pass, and haul the cabinets. Still had to shove some stuff in our SUV’s. Then, we where looking at a semi full of cabinets. Our cabinets where scheduled for the first delivery. They should be in the back. But our cabinets where loaded on first. With a couple of other kitchens worth of cabinets blocking them. We had to move EVERYTHING. To get our cabinets out. Kinda funny now. Not so much back then. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/77 "2023-02-02T02:38:07Z")
We’re not planning to buy any new appliances (although we could possibly be suckered into a new stove). We have now replaced every single major appliance in the house since we moved here in May 2017 except the stove, so we plan to keep them. And the stove is actually pretty solid, although I do miss the proofing drawer we had on the old stove at our condo. Also, all the appliances have come from a local independent place that is price-competitive with chain big box stores, except they have MUCH better service. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/78 "2023-02-02T04:30:35Z")
Blockquote > [@Chefguy](#): > > Also, the tops of cabinet boxes aren’t usually finished, so all that gunk is really stuck in the wood grain. I wonder if that could be dealt with by ordering a custom panel/panels to install on top of the cabinets rather than painting the tops? Seems like it would be more durable, look nicer, and be easier to keep clean. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/79 "2023-02-02T13:21:39Z")
Any amateur carpenter could cut those and install them. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862/80 "2023-02-02T16:05:20Z")
> [@Eva\_Luna](#): > > I wonder if that could be dealt with by ordering a custom panel/panels to install on top of the cabinets rather than painting the tops? Seems like it would be more durable, look nicer, and be easier to keep clean. They could also be removable for easier cleaning. But I like the idea of going all the way to the ceiling. That’s what we just did. We built a little alcove in the pantry where we can slide in a small step stool for helping reach the high spots when needed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitchen-remodeling-give-us-your-words-of-wisdom/978862.md?page=5)