# Kitty-corner vs catty-corner **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 28, 2012, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409 "2012-11-28T21:48:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![chizzuk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e36b37/32.png) [@chizzuk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chizzuk)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/21 "2012-11-29T05:46:07Z")
I’m 25 and learned it as catty-corner but in conversation I’d more likely say “(object/building) over there” and point, or say that it was diagonally across. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/22 "2012-11-29T06:03:25Z")
It’s cater. Yes, I was brought up to say kitty. But I’m literate, and it’s no use pretending I’m not. So cater it is. It’s from the French word _quatre_. ‘Four’. There used to be a whole series of warped French numbers used in English. That’s how we got _deuce_ from _deux_, _trey_ from _trois_ (centuries ago, _trois_ was pronounced like trey), _cater_ from _quatre_, etc. There was a family who lived cater-corner from me. I never got to know them and never even found out their name. So I named them the Caters. Ma Cater, Pa Cater, and the Cater tots. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/23 "2012-11-29T06:09:14Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > This just _has_ to be a generational difference. > > I’m 68, and never heard “kitty-corner.” I’m 67, and all I heard was “kitty-corner” (or just plain “diagonal”). ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/24 "2012-11-29T07:00:14Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > It’s cater. Yes, I was brought up to say kitty. But I’m literate, and it’s no use pretending I’m not. So cater it is. It’s from the French word _quatre_. ‘Four’. There used to be a whole series of warped French numbers used in English. That’s how we got _deuce_ from _deux_, _trey_ from _trois_ (centuries ago, _trois_ was pronounced like trey), _cater_ from _quatre_, etc. > > There was a family who lived cater-corner from me. I never got to know them and never even found out their name. So I named them the Caters. Ma Cater, Pa Cater, and the Cater tots. I don’t know why people cite the spelling of the word as if that settles how it’s pronounced (or as a testament to how lettered one is). There are plenty of words pronounced vastly differently from how they’re spelled. Your very citation of “deuce” and “trey,” originally Anglicized pronunciations of the words spelled “deux” and “trois,” are examples of standard pronunciations differing from spelling. As you no doubt know, the written words “deuce” and “trey” came _after_ those novel pronunciations of the original French. I mean, you don’t pronounce it “boat-swain” or “bee-ow-champ,” do you? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/25 "2012-11-29T07:06:48Z")
I’d say “on an angle, in the corner.” Actually, I probably wouldn’t even say that, and more likely just point. I’ve never used the kitty, catty, cater, whatever corner. Not a phrase I heard in my part of the world. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/26 "2012-11-29T07:21:45Z")
I would say “kitty-corner” for diagonally-opposite if I used any of the terms at all. Southern Ontario. I am wondering whether this isoneof those regional-dialect things as well. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/27 "2012-11-29T14:08:09Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > I don’t know why people cite the spelling of the word as if that settles how it’s pronounced (or as a testament to how lettered one is). I’m not. Like I said, I’m literate and when growing up I would just sit and read dictionaries and encyclopedias. Other kids mocked me for reading too many books instead of playing sports or whatever, but hey. Reading dictionaries, I found the pronunciation given as ['kætər]. But my earlier post was basically about the spelling, in answer to the OP which did not ask about either pronunciation or spelling specifically, only “which term do you prefer”. My vote was for “Something else entirely,” even though it isn’t entirely different from kitty and catty, which are “corruptions” of the original term, according to Wiktionary (which also casts doubt on the etymology deriving from French, which actually doesn’t matter to my usage of the word). As a linguist I wouldn’t use value-laden terms like “corruption”—with my linguist hat on, I’d call them “variants” or something value-neutral like that, or likely “folk etymologies”—but the OP is asking about my idiolect, what I as an individual prefer to say. My individual preference is not a _function_ of my being a linguist, though it is _informed_ by my language studies. In other words, I’m not denouncing everyone else for getting it “wrong,” but I’m firm about how _I_ want to say it, and I can confirm that my preference is backed up by actual data. ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/28 "2012-11-29T14:18:34Z")
Always catty-corner, but the few times I’ve used it in my life, nobody seems to have known what it meant. So I’ve pretty much stopped using it altogether. I’ve never heard anyone say kitty-corner. ---
**Author:** ![Rollo\_Tomasi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/58956e/32.png) [@Rollo\_Tomasi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rollo_Tomasi)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/29 "2012-11-29T14:32:46Z")
I’ve always said catty-corner (though I’ve always imagined it being spelled “caddy-corner,” for some reason). I’ve never heard kitty-corner. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/30 "2012-11-29T16:16:55Z")
I grew up hearing cattycorner, and that’s what I use; kittycorner makes more sense. Catercorner neither makes sense nor is anything I’ve actually heard anyone else use, but have only seen in print. ---
**Author:** ![Airk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Airk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airk)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/31 "2012-11-29T16:21:59Z")
> [@Rollo\_Tomasi](#): > > I’ve always said catty-corner (though I’ve always imagined it being spelled “caddy-corner,” for some reason). I’ve never heard kitty-corner. This one is me. ---
**Author:** ![Delta-9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3be4f8/32.png) [@Delta-9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Delta-9)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/32 "2012-11-29T16:27:56Z")
Must be regional. I’m 50, been in Chicago most of those years. Kitty-corner. Never heard the others till now. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/33 "2012-11-29T16:33:44Z")
I say catty-corner, and then my wife corrects me that it’s kitty-corner. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Doug\_K](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5ac83/32.png) [@Doug\_K](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_K)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/34 "2012-11-29T17:04:33Z")
Backing up **Sunspace** , whether you say kitty, catty, or cater, the term does not apply to the arrangement given in the OP. _Maybe_ if you had a couch long enough to reach corner to corner diagonally across the room. ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/35 "2012-11-29T17:16:07Z")
I used to work as a mover for a few years when I was in undergrad, so I used to hear this all the time. As mentioned, the proper phrase is catercorner, but I would often heard it pronounced similar to cata-corner or catty-corner. I have never heard kitty-corner, and I can only guess that it’s a play on catty-corner which is itself a mistake on catercorner. FTR, I live in Northern Virginia. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/36 "2012-11-29T17:21:16Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I’ve never thought of cattycorner and catawampus as being related, but they probably are. For me, catawampus is something that’s messed up or broken down or just crooked. Same here, except I use kitty-corner rather than cattycorner. Kitty-corner is intentionally diagonal, catawumpus denotes disarray. Age 39, Chicago. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/37 "2012-11-29T18:07:04Z")
I say kitty corner but if someone said cattycorner or catercorner, I’d know what they mean. If someone said cattywumpus, I’d look at them curiously because if something is cattywumpus, it needs to be straightened immediately. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2012, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/38 "2012-11-29T19:07:14Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > I say kitty corner but if someone said cattycorner or catercorner, I’d know what they mean. If someone said cattywumpus, I’d look at them curiously because if something is cattywumpus, it needs to be straightened immediately. And if they said the building is catawampus from the post office, I’d assume it was about to topple into the street. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/39 "2012-11-30T01:27:29Z")
Here’s a thought: I did a Google image search on _kitty corner_ to see what kind of pictures show up. Result: One showing buildings across an intersection, One showing a piece of furniture designed to fit into a corner, and pages of cat-related pics. Oh, and a scattering of human females in scanty attire. I did a Google image search on _catty corner_ to see what kind of pictures show up. Result: A whole bunch showing building (or lamp posts or whatever) across an intersection, and a bunch of cat litter boxes shaped like a quarter circle to fit into a corner. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409/40 "2012-11-30T01:38:41Z")
I did “kitty corner” (with quotes) and got a stuffed cat with a gun shoved up its ass and a HO scale strip club for your model trains :dubious: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kitty-corner-vs-catty-corner/642409.md?page=3)