# Know what? FUCK your thoughts and prayers **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 13, 2016, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299 "2016-06-13T23:25:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/81 "2016-06-14T11:05:16Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > This pitting was really of the non-psychos who preen about their concern but won’t fucking act on it, but yes, the problem they need to act on How about those of us who aren’t concerned and don’t see a problem that needs acting on? Getting shot by a stranger just isn’t a big risk here. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/82 "2016-06-14T11:08:09Z")
Even if that isn’t preening self-delusion: It isn’t all about you, is it? Are you interested in keeping anyone \*else \*from getting killed? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/83 "2016-06-14T11:23:17Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > We know the drill from long practice. After yet another mass killing, something that happens literally every few days in the US, there are cries of sympathy for the families, peace vigils, relentless shared Facebook posts, paeans to love, and prayers that God will somehow change people’s hearts. > > But essentially no insistence on actual legislation or changes in policies, I honestly thought this was leading up to a Trump-style call to ban Muslims. > [@](#): > > If you’re not doing any of that, go fuck yourself with that vigil candle, okay? You knew the last time and the time before and the time before that back to infinity what it takes to actually save lives in the future. And you didn’t do shit but wring your hands, make a headband or something with whatever color is trendy among the useless, hell, you know what you did and didn’t do. And you’re doing it, or \*not \*doing it, again, aren’t you? You know there are more people dead today, and every day, because you couldn’t be bothered to do anything but congratulate yourself on loving and praying and showing symbols to other people like you. And those dead people’s blood is largely on your hands too. Huh. A person calling for a ban on Muslims would say all of _that,_ too… > [@](#): > > Did you settle for just praying for people to become better persons? For God to reach people’s hearts and create love? Did it stop with handwringing for you? Then guess what, Sparky, you’re part of the fucking _problem_, aren’t you? What do suppose God thinks of you making excuses for your inaction and putting the responsibility on Him, huh? That’s not why we’re here, and you damn well know that’s not what you’ve been taught is right, even if it makes you feel good about yourself for a moment. Because it’s going to happen again and again and again until you get off your pew and do what you know you need to do. …and all of that… > [@](#): > > You don’t even care. There’s no reaching you except to point out that “the bad guys” are _you_. > > There will be no symbolic but futile gestures from me. I’m not wasting any time with any more fucking peace rallies. Let’s all get on with actually saving lives, for pity’s sake. …and would build to that conclusion. I mean, yeah, we’d have to swap in “First Amendment” in the middle of that bit about _“Start demanding the repeal of the Second Amendment, behind which so many cowards have hidden”_ – but it’s the same reasoning, isn’t it? It seems like the same reasoning throughout this thread; it doesn’t matter how many decent people [del]own guns[/del] are Muslim and aren’t hurting any law-abiding citizens; just demonize them _all_, if (a) all they do is speak out against this loathsome killer, but (b) they still work to preserve their Constitutional rights. Would all the same insults be slung? The bit about masturbation and a pro-murder stance, about how the problem is these people and the disease they suffer from, about how those who aren’t interested in saving lives should just Shut The Fuck Up: all of it, word-for-word, the you-yourself-are-one-of-the-bad-guys bit, everything? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/84 "2016-06-14T11:25:49Z")
Even most Muslims don’t claim a right to exercise a fetish overrides others’ right to _life_. So no. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/85 "2016-06-14T11:26:49Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > Yes, the sale of milk and driving are regulated where I live. I’m not really free to do those things, because my rights are limited by government action. > But, I still practice those things insofar as I can. > > I don’t accept the regulation of milk any more than I accept gun control. Nothing about that makes a hypocrite. No-It makes you an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/86 "2016-06-14T11:27:00Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Even if that isn’t preening self-delusion: It isn’t all about you, is it? Are you interested in keeping anyone \*else \*from getting killed? If there’s significant enough risk to warrant government action. Getting shot by a stranger barely registers. Humans are bad at risk assessment. They get worked up about nonissues like stranger danger, mass shootings, and GMOs. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/87 "2016-06-14T11:32:03Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > I disagree with the characterization that anybody who resists gun control is some sort of gun nut who is no doubt attracted to firearms to make up for underlying inadequacies. Yes, it’s terrible when one has to resort to insults and strawmen to make their point. > [@](#): > > So, any comment on how \*\*gun grabbers \*\*might agree on ways to alleviate this problem, or is “more government” pretty much the only contribution to the discussion we can expect from them? > [@Waymore](#): > > Besides, it’s hard to take the arguments of \*\*gun grabbers \*\*seriously. > [@Waymore](#): > > Crude post after crude post, but the gun grabbers act like they’re the voice of reason. Huh. I’m trying to think of a way to describe the above… > [@Waymore](#): > > That’s not an argument. It’s an amalgamation of clichés and stereotypes applied to anybody you disagree with. Yep, that’ll do. > [@Waymore](#): > > And with the exception of Thudlow, you and every other gun grabber in this thread have been sanctimonious, crude and quick to exclude middles and throw up strawman. Stay classy. I’m impressed how you managed to write a sentence in which you commit every fallacy you’re in the process of accusing others of. Stay classy indeed. > [@Waymore](#): > > It all boils down to your side yelling “more government, less freedom.” It’s no more sophisticated, logical, or nuanced than my stance of “more freedom, less government.” > > You value security over freedom. That’s a callow worldview, and I’ll do what I can not to be ruled by it. You value selfishness over others’ deaths. “Give me liberty even if it gives you death!” seems to be your rallying cry. > [@Waymore](#): > > Yes, the sale of milk and driving are regulated where I live. I’m not really free to do those things, because my rights are limited by government action. > > No, you are ruled by a callow worldview. What’s worse, you want to limit my rights because of your worldview. No, we want to limit your rights so that vast numbers of people don’t die of preventable diseases, car crashes and/or gunshots. That’s how basic civilization works. This idea that people want more regulation for the sake of regulation is a fantasy. Back on topic: I can’t really blame your average American for offering “thoughts and prayers” in the event of a tragedy. I can, however, look at politicians who do everything possible to 1) prevent not only any kind of gun control from happening but even research into mass shootings, and 2) spew endless rhetoric about how LGBT people are all degenerate child-molesting perverts who don’t deserve even basic human rights, and decide that, yes, those politicians should be buggered sideways with a glass-encrusted coracle. If everything you do works to facilitate these incidents, I don’t want your phony prayers when one happens. For example, Mike Huckabee was quick off the mark to offer T&Ps; this is the same Mike Huckabee happily comporting himself with [Kevin Swanson](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/16/opinion/campaign-stops/ted-cruz-and-the-anti-gay-pastor.html), a hateful preacher who thinks all gay people should die (but not until they’ve had a chance to pray all the gay out!). Messr Cruz and Jindal have also had the benefit of association with the good Reverend, but I’m sure they only turned up at his events for the potato salad. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/88 "2016-06-14T11:34:03Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Even most Muslims don’t claim a right to exercise a fetish overrides others’ right to _life_. But some Muslims, of course, say that gays should die. And some Muslims kill gays. Now, plenty of Muslims say they don’t want to override anyone’s right to _life_ – but they of course want to maintain their First Amendment freedoms when it comes to what they believe and what they say, what with the rights to speech and religion. And plenty of people who don’t happen to be Muslims say, _yeah, okay, we’ll stick up for your First Amendment rights, seeing as how you’re not murdering anyone._ ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/89 "2016-06-14T11:47:03Z")
**ElvisL1ves** , could you please think about somebody else while you masturbate? TIA. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/90 "2016-06-14T11:53:53Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > **ElvisL1ves** , could you please think about somebody else while you masturbate? TIA. > > Regards, > Shodan Jealousy does not become you. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/91 "2016-06-14T11:56:50Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Even most Muslims don’t claim a right to exercise a fetish overrides others’ right to _life_. > > So no. I think it’s safe to say most Muslims across the world (though to be fair, probably not in the U.S.) would consider their (what I would call) fetishes about homosexuality and about women having sex outside of marriage to override gays’ and “harlots’” right to life. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/92 "2016-06-14T11:58:13Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Jealousy does not become you. I care about you. I’m just not ready to be exclusive. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/93 "2016-06-14T12:32:28Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > One group of people telling another group of people what they can and can’t own is the problem. “Now if y’all will excuse me, I need to find my whip. The cotton ain’t gonna pick itself!” ---
**Author:** ![Azeotrope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/0ea827/32.png) [@Azeotrope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azeotrope)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/94 "2016-06-14T12:56:56Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > And you still don’t. Nope, you’re not interested in saving any _lives_, only in deriding those who do and in keeping your fetish items, aren’t you? > > You \*could \*keep on demonstrating that, but it would serve you much better for now to just Shut The Fuck Up. Still waitin’ on that list of what you’ve personally done over the past two decades to save lives from gun violence. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/95 "2016-06-14T14:29:41Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > So, I’ll ask again. What is the point of regulating guns if not to keep people from owning guns? > > And with the exception of Thudlow, you and every other gun grabber in this thread have been sanctimonious, crude and quick to exclude middles and throw up strawman. Stay classy. Excuse me??? I offered up the Aussie model and asked you respectful questions. “Gun grabber”. Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![boffking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/858c86/32.png) [@boffking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boffking)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/96 "2016-06-14T14:39:17Z")
OP, how do you know that these peace rallies never prevented any violence? If they got even _one person_ to have a change of heart and decide not to attack in the future, then your whole premise is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/97 "2016-06-14T14:41:54Z")
Depending on government to try to contain evil by use of evil, that includes the criminal punishment, er justice system - built on a foundation of an eye for an eye and our bullies can stop yours, rule by fear simply does not help but makes things worse for all. Now if you can build a system based on rehabilitation for the good of the persons, including good thoughts for their well being by all those involved, instead of the punishment system, that would be a far better system, So I’m not convinced the answer is in the solutions you cite, yes solutions you cite may have stopped this particular form of violence but I doubt it would do anything to contain the overall use of evil in the world, and the most we push back using evil (such as new laws and the use of fear, punishment and violence that backs them) the more evil in the world we have to contend with and fear. So overall I do what I can, I try to be an agent for change, an agent for God to show and provide His/Her love to humanity, which also goes forth and changes hearts and is the only thing that can counter and dispose of evil and make this world a better place. The coming together in goodwill to help heal the hurts of the evils is a good thing and does allow healing, answers. Rules and punishment ultimately do no good and give people a unfounded sense of self righteousness that leads to a worse off society of judgemental embittered people, which the OP seems to be a part of. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/98 "2016-06-14T15:03:02Z")
39 matches for “gun” on page one, 143 (so far) on page two; TL;DR, so I’m just going to say: Here’s my suggestion- change the First Amendment to permit the government to do the following:[ul] [li]Censor the media from sensationalizing public massacres[/li][li]Enact a new Hayes-style code to stop Hollywood’s glorification of gun violence[/li]Ban “slaughter training” first-person shooter games that desensitize youths to gore and death[/ul]What’s that? You say that would be an intolerable intrusion on peoples’ rights? Tough. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/99 "2016-06-14T15:04:00Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > People can be angry at the _system_ all they want about the gay nightclub shootings in Orlando all they want but it was virtually unpreventable once you face the facts. A licensed and well-trained security officer needs to have access to guns (just ask the numerous anti-gun celebrities that employ people just like him as bodyguards of their own). Access to guns, sure. But why does she need a personal weapon? Go to work, check out your weapon, guard Beyonce for 8-hours, go back to the office, turn the weapon back in. And if weapons were harder to come by, then the need for private security to be armed would go way down. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2016, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299/100 "2016-06-14T15:04:23Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > People can be angry at the _system_ all they want about the gay nightclub shootings in Orlando all they want but it was virtually unpreventable once you face the facts. Do you realize what you just said? That terrorists have won? That there’s no way to stop them? That we just might as well give up the fight? I don’t know exactly what the solution is, but there is a solution. We’ve come too far as a society coming up with solutions to prevent senseless death for the millennia we’ve been here. You talk about how this isn’t Soviet Russia. Yeah–because we’ve done things to make it better. Humanity will never stop trying to prevent these things. To do so would be to give up what makes us human. To do so would be to say “what’s the point?” and end our lives ourselves. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/know-what-fuck-your-thoughts-and-prayers/757299.md?page=6)