# Kopbusters has it's first sting **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 8, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189 "2008-12-08T01:04:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/1 "2008-12-08T01:04:58Z")
[http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Raw\_footage\_from\_KopBusters\_first\_sting\_1207.html](http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Raw_footage_from_KopBusters_first_sting_1207.html) Kopbusters is an attempt to duplicate the “Catch a Predator” type show by catching cops who break the rules.They set them up and wait for cops to step over the line. I personally like the idea. Everybody should play by the rules. Cops should player cleaner and fairer. Perhaps they will be a little bit better about breaking rules and laws now. It will not be hard to get find them. I suspect cops will get real pissed and go after them with suits and threats. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/2 "2008-12-08T01:44:27Z")
I like the idea, but isn’t enticing police officers to investigate a mythical crime scene a waste of essential public resources? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/3 "2008-12-08T01:58:45Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > I like the idea, but isn’t enticing police officers to investigate a mythical crime scene a waste of essential public resources? How did they entice police? They didn’t do anything to mislead them or tip them or anything. All they did was turn on some grow lights. The only way the cops could have found out about them was by breaking the law. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/4 "2008-12-08T02:15:48Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > How did they entice police? They didn’t do anything to mislead them or tip them or anything. All they did was turn on some grow lights. The only way the cops could have found out about them was by breaking the law. In this one instance, you’re correct. But I’m thinking of the whole vast configuration of things. Certainly there will be stings that don’t involve mere grow lights. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/5 "2008-12-08T02:19:05Z")
I suppose we have to wait to see where it goes. If it makes them a little more honest .I will be pleased. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/6 "2008-12-08T02:35:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > They didn’t do anything to mislead them or tip them or anything. [Actually, they did. Tip, I mean.](http://www.theagitator.com/2008/12/06/gotcha/#comment-214886) Of course, that opens the question of whether a single anonymous tip SHOULD be able to set something like this into motion, considering the increasingly violent tactics being used these days. But it does make the incident speak a little less to necessarily illegal tactics, which may be unfortunate, depending on your point of view. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/7 "2008-12-08T03:12:04Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > [Actually, they did. Tip, I mean.](http://www.theagitator.com/2008/12/06/gotcha/#comment-214886) > > Of course, that opens the question of whether a single anonymous tip SHOULD be able to set something like this into motion, considering the increasingly violent tactics being used these days. But it does make the incident speak a little less to necessarily illegal tactics, which may be unfortunate, depending on your point of view. Your cite is just a poster on a message board. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/8 "2008-12-08T04:11:59Z")
I’m all for it. It’s just a shame the police haven’t weeded out these scumbag cops on their own. ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/9 "2008-12-08T04:26:14Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Your cite is just a poster on a message board. What’s your cite that “All they did was turn on some grow lights?” How does turning on grow lights alert the cops and have them at the house in less than 24hrs. with a search warrant? ---
**Author:** ![Randy\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee7513/32.png) [@Randy\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/10 "2008-12-08T04:36:05Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Of course, that opens the question of whether a single anonymous tip SHOULD be able to set something like this into motion, […] My friend, that question was opened years ago (_Spinelli v. United States_, 393 U.S. 410 (1969)) ([Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aguilar-Spinelli_test) is decent), and reopened years later (_Illinois v. Gates_, 462 U.S. 213 (1983) ([Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_v._Gates) isn’t great on this one but gives the gist.)). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/11 "2008-12-08T04:39:27Z")
> [@Fantome](#): > > What’s your cite that “All they did was turn on some grow lights?” How does turning on grow lights alert the cops and have them at the house in less than 24hrs. with a search warrant? That’s for the cops to answer. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/12 "2008-12-08T04:41:58Z")
I find it a little suspicious that the cops would have just happened to look at the house with an IR camera just shortly after Kopbusters set up the grow room. It’s possible, I suppose, but I find it more likely that someone gave the cops some sort of tip. Does it make a big difference in what Kopbusters was trying to accomplish? I don’t think so. The state has an awful lot of power to steamroll over people. Even if you know your rights and are successfully able to defend yourself legally it can be potentially expensive and have other negative ramifications. “Did you hear about Bob in accounting? The police raided his home for marijuana this weekend.” I have a pretty good attitude towards law enforcement but I have nothing wrong with a watchdog group keeping them on their toes. Odesio ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/13 "2008-12-08T04:46:22Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > That’s for the cops to answer. You’re the one that made the claim. You said, “They didn’t do anything to mislead them or tip them or anything. All they did was turn on some grow lights.” How do you know that? It’s certainly not a reasonable conclusion as I see no way that simply turning on grow lights could have the cops alerted and with warrant in hand in less than 24hrs. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/14 "2008-12-08T04:47:05Z")
> [@](#): > > I find it a little suspicious that the cops would have just happened to look at the house with an IR camera just shortly after Kopbusters set up the grow room. It’s possible, I suppose, but I find it more likely that someone gave the cops some sort of tip. They could just cruise down the street with the camera in likely areas, such as where a lot of college students live. By which I mean that it’s technically possible. I don’t know what the current legal situation is for IR cameras (apparently they’re now considered a “search”?). ---
**Author:** ![Randy\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee7513/32.png) [@Randy\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/15 "2008-12-08T04:53:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > (apparently they’re now considered a “search”?). Ooh! Me! Me! I know this one! [Kyllo v. United States, 533 U.S. 27 (2001)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyllo_v._United_States) (Yes, they are considered a “search.”) ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/16 "2008-12-08T05:11:52Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Your cite is just a poster on a message board. Who was quoting from the message board of the guys who did this. But point taken; I guess I shouldn’t assume that he’s telling the truth just because it’s easily checked on. I’ll see if I can dig up what the quoted person saw. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/17 "2008-12-08T05:21:32Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Who was quoting from the message board of the guys who did this. > > But point taken; I guess I shouldn’t assume that he’s telling the truth just because it’s easily checked on. I’ll see if I can dig up what the quoted person saw. I tried but their [website appears to be snowed under](http://nevergetbusted.com/node/178) at the moment. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/18 "2008-12-08T13:01:19Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > [Actually, they did. Tip, I mean.](http://www.theagitator.com/2008/12/06/gotcha/#comment-214886) > > Of course, that opens the question of whether a single anonymous tip SHOULD be able to set something like this into motion, considering the increasingly violent tactics being used these days. But it does make the incident speak a little less to necessarily illegal tactics, which may be unfortunate, depending on your point of view. As I suspected. Otherwise, how would the officers have known to go to the house with FLIR or obtain a search warrant against the house? It’s nice to filter out bad police officers, but, I imagine, many of the subjects of these stings will be good cops who will not act inappropriately. So, my question still stands; should law enforcement resources be wasted on investigating mythical crime scenes? In fact, isn’t making such a tip–pretending that you believe there is a crime being committed when you know there is not–a crime itself? ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/19 "2008-12-08T13:05:49Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Your cite is just a poster on a message board. Without a tip-off, how would the police officers have even known about this house? Do you think they went to every house in the town with their FLIR gun and finally discovered the sting house of their own accord? What wonerful serendipity for the architects of the sting! ETA: I see this has already been covered. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/20 "2008-12-08T17:18:12Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > Without a tip-off, how would the police officers have even known about this house? Do you think they went to every house in the town with their FLIR gun and finally discovered the sting house of their own accord? What wonerful serendipity for the architects of the sting! > > ETA: I see this has already been covered. Regardless of this case, police have, in fact, done just that in the past, and in some cases no doubt still do on occaision. It’s hard to prove that they did or did not. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189.md?page=2)