# Kopbusters has it's first sting **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 8, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189 "2008-12-08T01:04:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/21 "2008-12-08T17:57:35Z")
They have sensors on choppers that can find grow lites. Weed is a horrible drug and must be stopped. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/22 "2008-12-08T17:58:14Z")
I don’t like shows where they set people up in order to say, ‘Gotcha’. The citizens of any town where they operate should start a class action suit against them. Particularly anyone hurt in a crime that occurs during one of their candid camera moments. Better to have people turn in real footage of cops behaving badly than to manufacture them for the TeeVee. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/23 "2008-12-08T18:02:29Z")
Are Grow Lights sufficient probable cause? What if I was growing Cilantro and Coriander? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/24 "2008-12-08T18:15:50Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > I don’t like shows where they set people up in order to say, ‘Gotcha’. The citizens of any town where they operate should start a class action suit against them. Particularly anyone hurt in a crime that occurs during one of their candid camera moments. Better to have people turn in real footage of cops behaving badly than to manufacture them for the TeeVee. I think there’s a crucial difference here though. They didn’t _actively encourage_ the cops to kick down the door. They just passively set up some grow lights. The pro-life “stings” of Planned Parenthood involve actors actually trying to persuade the workers to give them abortions while overlooking statutory rape. The pretend underage actors try to sound desperate and win over the workers sympathy, and then GOTCHA YA! There’s no persuasion involved here. Nobody was twisting the cops arms and making them raid the place. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/25 "2008-12-08T18:18:10Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > I think there’s a crucial difference here though. They didn’t _actively encourage_ the cops to kick down the door. They just passively set up some grow lights. You can put me in the, “There’s no way the cops would have known if they didn’t drop a tip.”, camp. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/26 "2008-12-08T18:32:24Z")
Tip or no tip, I like it. If they’re wasting resources it’s their own decision to go off something they don’t have probable cause for anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/27 "2008-12-08T18:34:31Z")
Maybe I’m missing something, but what did the cops do wrong here? They got a tip about a weed house and busted it. So what if it was empty? What would a “good” cop do? They had a search warrant, so is the judge a bad guy too? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/28 "2008-12-08T18:38:54Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > You can put me in the, “There’s no way the cops would have known if they didn’t drop a tip.”, camp. But this is exactly the point they are trying to prove. A very, very good point. Why is some anonymous dude calling in enough evidence to kick down the doors? It could be a jealous ex-lover with a grudge for all they know. ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/29 "2008-12-08T18:42:41Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > But this is exactly the point they are trying to prove. A very, very good point. Why is some anonymous dude calling in enough evidence to kick down the doors? It could be a jealous ex-lover with a grudge for all they know. How do you know that’s the point they’re trying to prove? Nothing was mentioned about a tip-off and we don’t know what was done to get the cops to the house with a warrant. And you’re changing your tune. You said: > [@](#): > > They just passively set up some grow lights. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/30 "2008-12-08T18:43:27Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Maybe I’m missing something, but what did the cops do wrong here? They got a tip about a weed house and busted it. So what if it was empty? What would a “good” cop do? They had a search warrant, so is the judge a bad guy too? An anonymous tip doesn’t constitute probable cause to break into your house with a full police raid. They likely falsified “evidence” to support probable cause in order to get the search warrant. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/31 "2008-12-08T18:44:45Z")
> [@Fantome](#): > > How do you know that’s the point they’re trying to prove? Nothing was mentioned about a tip-off and we don’t know what was done to get the cops to the house with a warrant. And you’re changing your tune. You said: I suppose I spoke too soon then. I still think it’s funny though. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/32 "2008-12-08T18:52:32Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > The citizens of any town where they operate should start a class action suit against them. The whole point is that they’re _not_ doing anything remotely illegal. ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/33 "2008-12-08T19:00:47Z")
> [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](#): > > The whole point is that they’re _not_ doing anything remotely illegal. We don’t know that yet. It seems unlikely that all that was done were that grow lights were turned on and the police showed up in less than 24hrs with warrant in hand. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/34 "2008-12-08T19:01:35Z")
> [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](#): > > The whole point is that they’re _not_ doing anything remotely illegal. Yea that whole anonymous tip thing is a convenient cover I suppose. What if the police took longer to respond to a rape during that period of time? ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/35 "2008-12-08T19:08:30Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > What if the police took longer to respond to a rape during that period of time? You mean assuming the police did falsify evidence to a judge? Then the lag time in responding to a rape is on them. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/36 "2008-12-08T19:10:24Z")
> [@Fantome](#): > > You mean assuming the police did falsify evidence to a judge? Then the lag time in responding to a rape is on them. The only difference between our view on this is you are absolving one more culpable party than I am. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/37 "2008-12-08T19:11:13Z")
> [@Fantome](#): > > We don’t know that yet. True, and if they did do something illegal, I’ll be happy to join in on the pile-on, as it would indeed be a colossal waste of time at best. But “innocent until proven guilty” is extremely pertinent here (though if not on a message board). > [@](#): > > It seems unlikely that all that was done were that grow lights were turned on and the police showed up in less than 24hrs with warrant in hand. …which is the point, as **DtC** pointed out upthread and **Rigamarole** expanded on. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/38 "2008-12-08T19:17:47Z")
Even if this did slow down police response to real crime _at this particular moment_, it’s still quite plausible that it’ll improve things in the long run. Maybe now, the next time they detect grow lights, they _won’t_ charge in full-bore, and leave more resources available for their other duties. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/39 "2008-12-08T19:21:04Z")
Never mind ---
**Author:** ![Fantome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Fantome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fantome)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2008, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189/40 "2008-12-08T19:23:02Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > The only difference between our view on this is you are absolving one more culpable party than I am. I am. I think more good than harm comes from busting crooked cops. If cops are getting illegally obtained warrants to bust suspected marijuana growers, they’re the culpable party. > [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](#): > > True, and if they did do something illegal, I’ll be happy to join in on the pile-on, as it would indeed be a colossal waste of time at best. But “innocent until proven guilty” is extremely pertinent here (though if not on a message board). You said they did nothing illegal. I said we don’t know that yet. > [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](#): > > …which is the point, as **DtC** pointed out upthread and **Rigamarole** expanded on. But you said "The whole point is that they’re _not_ doing anything remotely illegal. " 😕 > [@Chronos](#): > > Even if this did slow down police response to real crime _at this particular moment_, it’s still quite plausible that it’ll improve things in the long run. Maybe now, the next time they detect grow lights, they _won’t_ charge in full-bore, and leave more resources available for their other duties. Exactly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/kopbusters-has-its-first-sting/476189.md?page=3)