# "La Vieille" in Georgian Bay, Lake Huron? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 16, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140 "2016-03-16T05:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/1 "2016-03-16T05:04:36Z")
I’m reading about Scottish fur trappers in Canada and came upon a reference to the French-canadian canoemen throwing trinkets into Georgian Bay to appease _La Vieille_. Who or what is she? A spirit? The wind? An island? The only Georgian Bay folklore I can find on the internet is the legend of Kitchikewana, which doesn’t seem likely. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/2 "2016-03-16T06:01:39Z")
It means “the old woman”, though it’s also the French name for the wrasse. I can’t see why the canoemen would be afraid of a fish, though. So presumably La Vieille is the personification of some hazard that canoemen faced. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/3 "2016-03-16T10:35:36Z")
Well it they were gaelic, here’s one of version of the many “old woman” (of the sea. ) myths Scottish > **[Selkie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selkie)** > > Selkies are mythological creatures that can shapeshift between seal and human forms by removing or putting on their seal skin. They feature prominently in the oral traditions and mythology of various cultures, especially those of Celtic and Norse origin. The term “selkie” derives from the Scots word for “seal”, and is also spelled as silkies, sylkies, or selchies. Selkies are sometimes referred to as selkie folk (Scots: selkie fowk), meaning 'seal folk'\[a\]. Selkies are mainly associated with t... Presumably the same word, same character. from Gaelic > **[Cailleach](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cailleach)** > > In Gaelic (Irish, Scottish and Manx) myth, the Cailleach (Irish: \[ˈkal̠ʲəx, kəˈl̠ʲax\], Scottish Gaelic: \[ˈkʰaʎəx\]) is a divine hag and ancestor, associated with the creation of the landscape and with the weather, especially storms and winter. The word literally means 'old woman, hag', and is found with this meaning in modern Irish and Scottish Gaelic, and has been applied to numerous mythological and folkloric figures in Ireland, Scotland, and the Isle of Man. In modern Irish folklore studi Cai... In greek, GRAEAE (Graiai), that is, “the old women,” were daughters of Phorcys and Ceto. I guess its because the water is a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/4 "2016-03-16T10:41:58Z")
Oh there is a Lake Lavieille near there (near that river in Canada). That may be why the OP’s author used the particular term. (Is it fiction or non fiction ? ) Acionna was the name of a goddess of the sea in Gaul / France… Sedna is similarly an intuit myth, but to same effect, worship her ,appease her, in the hope of avoiding disaster and gaining fish… ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/5 "2016-03-16T11:28:01Z")
Throwing valuables into water to appease gods/spirits is an ancient custom. Certainly goes back to the Bronze Age in the UK, and I’d imagine the same sort of belief system applied elsewhere in Europe. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/6 "2016-03-16T16:37:35Z")
La vielle was the old lady of the winds. Wind could be a voyageur’s enemy, or his friend. When the wind blew from astern, the voyageurs could rig a small sail and their canoe would be propelled by the wind, bringing relief from the endless strain of paddling and portaging. “Souffle, soufflé la vielle!”, the voyageurs would call out. (Source: _The Illustrated Voyageur_, by Howard Sivertson.) On the other hand, la vielle could turn angry. High winds and waves could be life-threatening, especially on the Great Lakes. Twas only prudent to appease la vielle with gifts, which as noted sailors have done in various guises since ancient times. ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/la-vieille-in-georgian-bay-lake-huron/749140/7 "2016-03-16T18:47:12Z")
> [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](#): > > La vielle was the old lady of the winds. Wind could be a voyageur’s enemy, or his friend. When the wind blew from astern, the voyageurs could rig a small sail and their canoe would be propelled by the wind, bringing relief from the endless strain of paddling and portaging. “Souffle, soufflé la vielle!”, the voyageurs would call out. (Source: _The Illustrated Voyageur_, by Howard Sivertson.) > > On the other hand, la vielle could turn angry. High winds and waves could be life-threatening, especially on the Great Lakes. Twas only prudent to appease la vielle with gifts, which as noted sailors have done in various guises since ancient times. Thank you! I felt sure she was the wind but couldn’t find confirmation anywhere. I think I must have heard it in a long-forgotten French class some twenty years ago. I just couldn’t find it on the internet.