# Lame Stuff in Baseball **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 22, 2001, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180 "2001-09-22T06:43:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laughing_Lagomorph)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2001, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/41 "2001-09-27T02:53:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SteverinoAlaReno \* > My point remains: having a big market isn’t everything. \*\* Well, good thing, then, that I never said it was! My last post, I promise, on this particular topic (we’ve strayed from the O.P., anyway): I’m a Yankees fan. I love it when the Yankees win. The last few years, then, have been a hoot for me. The Yankees have been kicking butt. They have been able to keep Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera, re-sign Bernie Williams, experiment with Hideki Irabu (bust), sign Roger Clemens, and then go out and get Mike Mussina. Why can they do this? They have money. Why do they have money? They are a storied franchise, and, follow me closely here, they are in the nation’s biggest market, NYC. They have a massive television contract because many people in the NYC area want to see them, which means TV stations can charge advertisers more money, and pay the Yankees more money to televise their games. They lead all teams in merchandising, selling truckloads of hats, jerseys, jackets, etc. all with the Yankee logo. So, as of now and for the past several years they tend to steamroll other teams, then get to the World Series and win that too. As I said, as a Yankee fan I love it. As a baseball fan, its not so good. In an era of declining national TV ratings, and flat attendance, it is shortsighted for the sport as a whole to allow a handful of franchises to more or less routinely flatten another handful, with a third group in the middle that can sometimes compete, but not always. Getting back to the O.P., it is LAME. It does not help the popularity of the game nationally. I don’t know why some teams (Angels) seem to be unable to take advantage of the resources available to them. There is such a thing as bad management. I see it all the time with the Red Sox (I live in Boston). Losing can become a way of life, just like winning. I don’t know why you keep knocking the Dodgers. I see they are only 3 1/2 games out today and still in the race both for their division and for the Wild Card. That’s competitive, in my book. ---
**Author:** ![Mercutio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/51bf81/32.png) [@Mercutio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mercutio)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2001, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/42 "2001-09-27T05:14:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyla \* > \*\*The very existence of the Dodgers. \*\* This coming from the fan of the team who gave us the **San Francisco Giant _Crab_** ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2001, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/43 "2001-09-27T06:15:29Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Jeff Olsen \* \*\* [QUOTE] \*Originally posted by bup \* > [@](#): > > I don’t recall it being proven the balls being juiced. Cite? \*\* This is IMHO. It’s an outrageous opinion of mine. Sue me. I _do_ recall (but I can’t find a cite) that in the 1995, the first season after the strike, the method of winding around the inner core was changed. Baseball officially claimed it would have no effect on the liveliness of the ball, and a lot of people rolled their eyes. I also call attention to the circumstantial evidence that home runs have gone up tremendously since the strike. The top 5 season homer totals ever have occurred in the past 4 years. People can talk about conditioning and the like, but that wouldn’t explain why home runs went up so suddenly. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2001, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/44 "2001-09-27T18:35:30Z")
> [@](#): > > I also call attention to the circumstantial evidence that home runs have gone up tremendously since the strike. The top 5 season homer totals ever have occurred in the past 4 years. People can talk about conditioning and the like, but that wouldn’t explain why home runs went up so suddenly. Well, if you’re quoting circumstantial evidence, at least do it right. The 5 homer totals you mention were achieved by 3 players. The fact that it hasn’t been more evenly dispersed to other hitters strikes me as evidence of their superior conditioning, not of the ball which everyone uses. I’d like to see the distribution of size and weight of players over the last decade compared to the rate of long balls. I would almost garuntee you’d see a hell of a correlation. The balls that baseball uses aren’t a closely guarded secret and everyone and their brother who was involved in the process has said the balls are the same. Without evidence any juiced ball theories are complete garbage. It the balls were juiced…someone would be able to prove it, they haven’t. Until they do, its a myth. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2001, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/45 "2001-09-27T20:05:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Omniscient \* > \*\* > Well, if you’re quoting circumstantial evidence, at least do it right. The 5 homer totals you mention were achieved by 3 players. \*\* Okie-doke, Mr. Omniscient! The top three single-season home run hitters have all done it in the past four years. Gee, to me that still sounds worthy of attention. You say that the fact they’re not more evenly distributed is evidence that these are truly extraordinary players, not of external changes. How many guys would have to be packed right at the top for your suspicions to be aroused? I mean, I guess that’s what you’re getting at - I could only say the top three production rates of all time are going on right now, and you imply I need more than that. Home run increases _are_ distributed - total home runs have been at record levels the past 6 years (cite!): [http://www.baseball-almanac.com/hihr8.shtml](http://www.baseball-almanac.com/hihr8.shtml) And some people feel like maybe it’s the ball: [http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/DailyNews/baseballs010402.html](http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/DailyNews/baseballs010402.html) I don’t have the stats you asked for - height and weight distribution of players for the past ten years against the home run production - maybe you do. At any rate, I’m sure there is a correlation. That doesn’t mean home run production _isn’t_ correlated to other things as well. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/46 "2001-09-28T05:39:29Z")
> [@](#): > > The top three single-season home run hitters have all done it in the past four years. Gee, to me that still sounds worthy of attention. Well, I doubt they’d do it over a span of 15 years…they’ll have great years in their primes, those primes will span 3-4 years usually. There are several other reasons, each with some type of measurable emperical data to compare, that are likely the cause of the increase in home run totals. The juiced ball theory has no factual basis, and in my opinion is a red herring. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/47 "2001-09-28T20:08:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Omniscient \* > \*\*Well, I doubt they’d do it over a span of 15 years…they’ll have great years in their primes, those primes will span 3-4 years usually. > \*\* I don’t mean Sammy Sosa’s best years are all bunched together. Let me re-phrase it more clearly: In the 126 years of major league baseball recognized by Cooperstown, and in the 82 seasons of major league baseball since the ‘dead ball’ era, the past 4 seasons have contained the 3 highest home run totals ever achieved by players. Maris’ record, which stood for 37 years, has been broken 5 times, by 3 different players, and is about to be broken a 6th, all in the past 4 years. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2001, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180/48 "2001-09-29T05:11:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Laughing Lagomorph \* > \*\* > I have news for you, friend. More than 6 million people live in the San Francisco/San Jose/Oakland area, making it the US’s 5th largest metropolitan area. \*\* Divided among 2 teams. > [@](#): > > \*\*Not a small market by anyones definition…don’t confuse “market” with “city”. > So, taking those two big market teams off your list, what are we left with? One team that hasn’t won the World Series since Harry Truman was president, and two teams that have never won it. > Seriously, I never said that small market (hereinafter refered to as “SM”) teams couldn’t win any games, or even string a few good years together (Seattle, Cleveland). \*\* Stringing a few good years together isn’t competitive? > [@](#): > > \*\*But the fact is that teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs and Dodgers can, year in, year out, command resources that the “SM” teams will never have available to them. They get money from TV contracts and merchandising of hats, shirts, etc. that teams like Milwaukee and Montreal can only dream of. \*\* But teams who don’t command this revenue are competitive. > [@](#): > > \*\*What those teams then do with that money is a subject for another thread (yes, the Red Sox and Cubs haven’t won many World Series lately either), \*\* Nor the Dodgers or Angels. > [@](#): > > \*\*but there is clearly a tiered system of baseball franchises. Some of them can spend the money to get a Mike Mussina or a Manny Ramirez without breaking a sweat, while others have to let the Randy Johnsons, A-Rods, and Ken Griffeys go. That they can still compete is a testament to their managements ability and shrewdness, but clearly they are not all competing at the same level. \*\* Maybe so, but as long as small markets are able to compete (and they quite clearly can) then I don’t see a big problem. Shoot, last year there was more parity in in baseball than there ever has been. The gap between the haves & have-nots is smaller than ever. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lame-stuff-in-baseball/83180.md?page=2)