# Land of the Dead **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 13, 2005, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115 "2005-06-13T18:14:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![want2know](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@want2know](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/want2know)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/21 "2005-06-14T20:30:02Z")
> [@Lisa-go-Blind](#): > > Yeah, I was waiting for someone to call me out on that … but I can’t mention zombies without mentioning braaaaaains, so there you go. > > Are the zombies even ever referred to as “zombies” within Romero’s films? I can’t think of a single instance from either **Night** or **Dawn** when this happens. Actually, Ken Foree does refer to them as “zombies” in **Dawn**. When the biker gang approaches, he says "When they open those doors, there’ll be a thousand zombies in here."Just FYI. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/22 "2005-06-14T21:37:59Z")
> [@want2know](#): > > Actually, for me, **Day of the Dead** is my favorite of the trilogy. Once you get past the fact that the actor who plays Rhodes is possibly the _worst_ actor of all time, I think it’s the best constructed of all Romero’s films. The sheer claustrophobia of the setting adds to the terror, plus, it follows the progression of the breakdown of society in the face of disaster (the common thread in all three films) very skillfully.BTW, Romero is receiving a lifetime achievement award this weeked at the CineVegas film festival this Saturday before the world premiere of LOTD. If there are tickets available, I am SO there! It’s not my favorite(Night is my favorite) but I don’t see why people dump on Day all the time. Day covers the remements of the Government, and showing that, even with a zombie-proof bunker, things are still far from rosy. A scientist whose sanity seems to be slipping, and a few military personnel who seem to be little more then idiots and bullies. In a way, the bunker is a scarier place then the outside. Dawn…the best part of dawn was them living in the mall. The rest of it, particulary the bit about the bikers, wasn’t particulary great, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/23 "2005-06-14T22:00:34Z")
> [@HPL](#): > > Day covers the remements of the Government, and showing that, even with a zombie-proof bunker, things are still far from rosy. A scientist whose sanity seems to be slipping, and a few military personnel who seem to be little more then idiots and bullies. **In a way, the bunker is a scarier place then the outside.** Precisely. The cardinal rule of all Romero Zombie Movies, aside from _zombies don’t fucking run_\*, is that _people are their own worst enemies_. I’ll not go so far as to say that Romero Zombies are harmless, but any group of humans with weapons, food, and straight heads can survive the shambling hordes without much trouble. Bikers, gung-ho rednecks, and crazed soldiers are much more dangerous to the survival of the human race in general. \*I saw the remake of _Dawn of the Dead_. In a theater. That’s money and time I’ll never see again, god damn them. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/24 "2005-06-14T22:45:16Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > _zombies don’t fucking run_\* Anyone else notice that that 1st zombie in NOTLD, the one chasing the girl at the cemetary, moved at a pretty good clip? I wouldn’t calling it running exactly, but it’s a good jog at least, at some times. BTW, NOTLD can be downloaded free and legal at: ---
**Author:** ![Linty\_Fresh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Linty\_Fresh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linty_Fresh)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/25 "2005-06-14T22:47:08Z")
> [@want2know](#): > > So, if we follow your line of logic, George Lucas should have never made the last 3 Star Wars films. 😕 Wellllllll, since you brought it up . . . 😃 ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/26 "2005-06-15T13:03:11Z")
I like Day… Not my favorite, but I have no ill will against it. It has some of my favorite lines, most from Rhodes who, while over the top, was entertaining. "I’m running this monkey farm now Frankenstein and I wanna know… what the fuck your doing with my time? " “I don’t want them to do anything but drop over!” “All I’m getting from you is a mouth full of Greek salad” “Choke on 'em!” ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/27 "2005-06-15T18:18:13Z")
Running zombies have been around for twenty years now (Return of the Living Dead, which also BTW featured clever zombies setting traps). Can zombie fans just get over it? ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/28 "2005-06-15T19:22:18Z")
About a decade ago, George Romero remade his own NotLD with shuffling zombies. Last years DotD had blindly fast sprinting zombies. Perhaps we will see a remake of Day of the Dead with zombies that…_fly?_ :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/29 "2005-06-15T19:47:15Z")
> [@Enola Straight](#): > > About a decade ago, George Romero remade his own NotLD with shuffling zombies. > > Last years DotD had blindly fast sprinting zombies. > > Perhaps we will see a remake of Day of the Dead with zombies that…_fly?_ :rolleyes: That’s a common misconception about the Night remake from '90. Romero didn’t make it Tom Savini (the effects man) did. IMO its a really good update. The female lead doesn’t spend the movie in a catatonic state. She is active and is the only one to realize that “Hey, the zombies are slow… let’s just walk out of here.” And she’s the only one to live. ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/30 "2005-06-15T20:16:54Z")
Re: running Zombies I like RoLD, but it had a different agenda. It was a nihilistic movie where you know right from the start (You can’t re kill them) you know the characters are pretty much pooched. Running Zombies are a great way to emphasize that. The movie was a tounge in cheek “Fuck it man!” movie The latest remake of Dawn owed more to 28 days and the idea that kids want to see reved up zombies because “it’s not your Dad’s Zombies!” which is meaningless as you point out because we’ve seen them before. Romeros films are about the danger from within caused by the slow building danger from outside. I prefer teh slow ones because there is a hope of survival as long as the character is smart and focused enough. that means we can be caught off gaurd when someone we like doesn’t make it. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/31 "2005-06-15T20:37:21Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > Anyone else notice that that 1st zombie in NOTLD, the one chasing the girl at the cemetary, moved at a pretty good clip? I wouldn’t calling it running exactly, but it’s a good jog at least, at some times. If I remember correctly he also picked up a rock to bash open the car window with. Also, the zombie child in the basement used a pair of scissors to kill her mother. I don’t really understand why there has to be one interpretation of a particular monsters. Do these living dead things have their mouths sewn shut? Can you destroy one by putting salt in its mouth? If not then they aren’t really zombies. I’ve nothing against fast zombies or somewhat intelligent zombies “send more cops” and I like to see them mix things up a bit. If all zombies were alike in the movies we’re going to end up with the same problem vampire movies have. Boring stagnation. Marc ---
**Author:** ![JohnBckWLD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d6d6ee/32.png) [@JohnBckWLD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnBckWLD)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/32 "2005-06-15T20:53:12Z")
> [@Soylent Gene](#): > > Can’t George Romero do something new? That trailer looks he is. It looks more like a Marilyn Manson music video than it does a full-length feature film ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/33 "2005-06-15T21:10:46Z")
If they’re running, tool-using, and smart as freaking chimps then why call them zombies at all? Why not expend a few brain cycles and come up with a new mythology that is, you know, _creative_? Or if you can’t be that smart, why not create a vampire movie where the vampires simply aren’t suave and photophobic? That’s pretty much what you have when your ‘zombies’ aren’t stupid and shambling. ---
**Author:** ![parthenokinesis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/cc9497/32.png) [@parthenokinesis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/parthenokinesis)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/34 "2005-06-15T21:50:44Z")
I think the underlying reason us traditionalists dislike the new _fast zombies_ is that it changes the genre of the film. Traditional slow zombie films were a tenser, more dramatic, more psychological thrillery. There’s a collective subconsious affinity to the _seige_. We imagine ourselves in those conditions, and we are in control, handling it, surviving. There’s quite a bit of adventure to the Romero survivors. Then these new zombies come along, and there’s no high spirits, no almost Gillbert and Sullivan sense of play, just the inside of a video game. And it seems upping the danger value raise the terror response reduces the entire film on a thematic level. Of course, YMMV. Jack ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/35 "2005-06-16T02:45:22Z")
Looking forward to this movie; possibly the only good effect of the _Dawn_ remake was to shake loose funding for Romero’s new movie. (Actually the recent version of _Dawn of the Dead_ wasn’t bad, just a different kind of movie; action with a horror theme, rather than real horror. The first ten minutes are great.) ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/36 "2005-06-16T03:48:45Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > Looking forward to this movie; possibly the only good effect of the _Dawn_ remake was to shake loose funding for Romero’s new movie. (Actually the recent version of _Dawn of the Dead_ wasn’t bad, just a different kind of movie; action with a horror theme, rather than real horror. The first ten minutes are great.) I also appreciate the fact at least one character is willing to shoot someone who’s been bitten. It usally takes a while for people to get it through their skulls that being bitten is as good as being a zombie already. Waiting just gets you killed. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/37 "2005-06-16T08:49:26Z")
**HPL** : That was a good part. But what gets me is that even in spoofs like _Shaun of the Dead_, _nobody has ever seen a zombie movie_. Nobody knows what zombies are or how to destroy them. The more intelligent characters know that they won’t ‘snap out of it’ or ‘get better’, but it seems that there have never been any zombie movies in the universe of any zombie movie. I don’t think this is a legal issue. I do know that shows and movies reference each other in much more blatant ways all the time: Having a character in _Brunch of the Dead_ saying “These are Romero zombies: They have the brains of slugs and they can’t run. If we aim for the head and keep calm, we’ll find a Meg-A-Mart with guns and food and we’ll hole up there for a while.” hardly compares to your average “South Park” episode. This isn’t a plot issue or a scare factor issue. Good zombie movies, like good horror movies in general, don’t rely on jump scares. They rely on characterization and atmosphere. Watch _Night of the Living Dead_ and count how many times things jump out at you. Now remember that it was made 37 years ago on a nonexistent budget by a bunch of unknowns. And yet you not only know its name, you’ve probably seen and enjoyed it. It’s probably creeped you out at least once in your life. _That is an effective movie._ Jump scares are a crutch for the incompetent hacks who churn out _Halloween XXIV: Michael Scared Stupid_. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/38 "2005-06-16T09:45:47Z")
> [@Lisa-go-Blind](#): > > Yeah, I was waiting for someone to call me out on that … but I can’t mention zombies without mentioning braaaaaains, so there you go Sounds way better than oesophaguuuuuuuuuuusssssss… ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/39 "2005-06-16T12:39:44Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > But what gets me is that even in spoofs like _Shaun of the Dead_, _nobody has ever seen a zombie movie_. Nobody knows what zombies are or how to destroy them. One notable exception: ‘Return of The Living Dead’ characters had seen NOTLD, and expected brain damage to stop their zombies. In general, of course you are right. I think it’s an artistic decision for the characters to be totally bewildered and confused by the situation, so in their ‘universe’ there were no zombie movies. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2005, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115/40 "2005-06-16T16:13:56Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > One notable exception: ‘Return of The Living Dead’ characters had seen NOTLD, and expected brain damage to stop their zombies. > > In general, of course you are right. I think it’s an artistic decision for the characters to be totally bewildered and confused by the situation, so in their ‘universe’ there were no zombie movies. Also in House of the Dead (a brillantly bad movie based on the video game), there’s a character who talks about the Romero Holy Trinity of Night, Dawn and Day. So if it’s a serious zombie movie the characters are unfamiliar with the monster… if it’s a schlocky one, they are. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/land-of-the-dead/308115.md?page=3)